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It's not that women don't have faith.
It's not that women don't have leadership skills.
It's not that women don't have revelation from God.
It's not that they were the only ones to stay close to Jesus in His darkest hour.
It's not that they are not respected.
It's not that they fail to confront wrongs.
It's not that they take no action to help others---
It's that they don't have a certain organ between their legs that make you as a man special!!!
Yup, I think I understand what kind of god you are worshipping.
Good luck with that.
There are a lot of things women can do that I can't. What's your point?
Again...I realize that actually reading the Bible and doing what it says is a foreign concept to you. I've never observed it to be an important thing to you. But the Bible does say that a requirement to be a pastor is that he be a man. I don't know how to get around that.
Actually the scriptures are very important to me,what you believe they are saying isn't. There's nothing to get around apart from being ignorant of your own attitude towards women, there are plenty of women posting on this forum that are far more spiritually aware to the things of God than any who claim to be male pastors on this forum.
Actually the scriptures are very important to me,what you believe they are saying isn't. There's nothing to get around apart from being ignorant of your own attitude towards women, there are plenty of women posting on this forum that are far more spiritually aware to the things of God than any who claim to be male pastors on this forum.
So please tell me how I'm reading Paul wrong. A pastor must be the "husband of one wife". How else do I read that? You say you're so "aware"....please enlighten me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps
Speak in the Spirit, the most obvious to me.
What does that even mean? Can you give me an example from the Bible of it being done?
So please tell me how I'm reading Paul wrong. A pastor must be the "husband of one wife". How else do I read that? You say you're so "aware"....please enlighten me.
What does that even mean? Can you give me an example from the Bible of it being done?
To actually have to tell a male pastor what speaking In or by the spirit is, is another reason why no one bothers going to church anymore and why Christianity is in its darkest years of human history, thus making the bible irrelevant in the eyes of many, because if it is saying what those who are not in the spirit are believing it is saying, we really are in the darkness.
Again...I realize that actually reading the Bible and doing what it says is a foreign concept to you. I've never observed it to be an important thing to you. But the Bible does say that a requirement to be a pastor is that he be a man. I don't know how to get around that.
(Bolding mine.)
I'll tell you how, Vizio:
You realize one day, like most Christians, that the bible is not inerrant. That one is actually allowed to use one's Creator-given intelligence, reason and common sense, to suss out which parts of your holy book are allegorical, metaphorical, mythical, cultural, and which might contain a smidge of history.
It's really not THAT big a leap for a person gifted with average intelligence and the ability to read and reason.
You realize one day, like most Christians, that the bible is not inerrant. That one is actually allowed to use one's Creator-given intelligence, reason and common sense, to suss out which parts of your holy book are allegorical, metaphorical, mythical, cultural, and which might contain a smidge of history.
It's really not THAT big a leap for a person gifted with average intelligence and the ability to read and reason.
I honestly think you are capable.
If you weren't so afraid.
Sorry, Dude. I do believe it to be inspired. I can't understand why some people consider themselves to be Christians and don't believe it to be inspired. To them, it must be nothing more than a social club.
To actually have to tell a male pastor what speaking In or by the spirit is, is another reason why no one bothers going to church anymore and why Christianity is in its darkest years of human history, thus making the bible irrelevant in the eyes of many, because if it is saying what those who are not in the spirit are believing it is saying, we really are in the darkness.
Pcamps, this is one of several reasons that I quit attending church years ago, but remain reading the scriptures and seeking ways to serve God by serving others.
The Spirit left most of the churches long ago. My own denomination, the now non-existent SBC (name change), began to make changes within the denomination to have further domination over the many good women in the church. What was called the Lottie Moon Offering was an annual drive to fund missionary effort within the U.S.. The Women's Missionary Union had been in complete charge of that drive for decades.
As the right wing element began to rise within the denomination it was determined that a committee of oversight needed to be formed to make sure the funds were being handled properly. This despite there never being a single complaint in the decades the women had overseen the program. Nor had any audit found a penny out of place.
And yes, the committee of oversight was predominately male.
That was over twenty years ago. I left and never looked back. My wife and I have searched on occasion and only found one church--in Denver of all places--that was seeking to follow in Jesus footsteps by reaching out to the homeless, providing weekly dinners for them, having a kind of thrift shop where they could freely obtain clothes donated by members, etc. Unfortunately it was over 30 miles from our house and winter driving was sometimes challenging---and now, of course, we don't live there.
I did have a woman pastor for one year a couple years after I graduated college. Although Baptist we had a friend from college who became the pastor of a small Methodist church in Louisville, Ky. Since we were moving to Louisville and lived near him and his wife and their small church, we became sort of "guest" members of their church. When he was ready to move on two years later it just so happened that the Methodists, who assign their ministers within churches in a district, assigned a woman to replace our friend. It had been our intention to move back to a Baptist church when our friend left, but we knew immediately how that would be viewed by a lay body that was already in shock of having a woman assigned to them.
Joyce (I'll call her that) had been a juvenile delinquent public defender--a lawyer!! She felt a call into the ministry and left her work as a lawyer to attend seminary.
But she had more than being a female working against her as a minister. She was divorced and had a six year old child. The lay members in our church reduced general giving and funneled more money into the building fund--always a sign to Methodist district authorities that the congregation is unhappy because the district has to make up the general fund shortage.
One of our fine church members literally cut out of a Bible the scribal addition attributed to Paul about women keeping silent in a church and sent it in an envelope to the church office.
It was a difficult year for that poor woman. But she was very educated and quite fluent from the pulpit. Her favorite saying was, "If I can't get you under grace, then I'll get you under the law," an allusion to her law degree.
But one statement in one sermon that she made has become part of my own verbal liturgy. I've never forgotten it, and have kept an eye out for displays of it ever since.
She said, "We try to whisper sweet nothings in God's ear in hopes that He will not see the brutality we practice toward one another."
With regard to how "Christians" have treated women, particularly women who have felt a call from God to serve Him from the pulpit---there is overwhelming brutality practiced toward them by those protesting that they are following God's instruction.
I've never met anyone that says they quit attending church that didn't get a little weird in their theology.
A little weird maybe, and a lot more right.
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Excellent point
