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Old 10-23-2013, 07:07 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShepherdMaster View Post
I'm not protestant.
It is OK. You are still a catholic in my book (with little c),
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Old 10-23-2013, 07:40 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian658 View Post
Some Protestants put tradition down, but last time I checked they had their own tradition. There is tradition with little t and Tradition with capital T. They are different.
1. Who are these Protestants that put down tradition? Do you mean your little t or big T?
2. Sacred Traditions, when historically accurate, and congruent with Sacred Scripture make up the whole of Christianity for all believers.
3. No one is suggesting the nonexistence of church tradition. It helps indentify who we are and where we came from.
4. The little t and the big T as you put it. Why is Sacred Tradition of such utmost importance to the RCC it is elevated to Scripture status? Asked another way, what happens to the RCC when Sacred Tradition is not elevated to Scripture status or entirely removed?
5. All Christians are, or should be, indebted to the RCC's collecting and preserving the Word of God.

The RCC says Sacred Tradition grows and expands over time through mystical experience(s), discoveries in natural science, social science and the humanities. Sacred Traditions are compared to an oak tree that continues to grow and change over time.

The following is a quote from Catholic Answers. Are there no other biblical scholars outside The Magesterium who are able to read the early church writings and decide what is and isn't authentic? I think this is answered in part by the word 'indefectible' which the website uses to describe the RCC. Indefectible meaning 'having no flaw or defect; perfect."
The indefectible Church
Quote:
The task is to determine what constitutes authentic
Quote:
tradition. How can we know which traditions are apostolic and which are merely
human? The answer is the same as how we know which scriptures are apostolic and
which are merely human—by listening to the magisterium or teaching authority of
Christ’s Church. Without the Catholic Church’s teaching authority, we would not
know with certainty which purported books of Scripture are authentic. If the
Church revealed to us the canon of Scripture, it can also reveal to us the
"canon of Tradition" by establishing which traditions have been passed down from
the apostles.

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Old 10-23-2013, 10:02 AM
Zur
 
949 posts, read 650,697 times
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How traditions developed in the early church shows the controversy between the church of Asia Minor and the Roman church in the second century about the Passover of the Lord being celebrated on the 14th of Nisan and His resurrection on the 17th of Nisan in the Jewish week of Passover or as Rome said on the Pagan feast of Easter, beginning with Good Friday and ending with Easter Sunday. This is also found under Quartodeciman. The traditions of the Apostles are destroyed through the church of Rome beginning in the 2nd century, even the commentaries of today are twisted, because the pagan tradition won and is sanctified through the church, in contrast to God`s word (Deut 12: 29-32).
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:24 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zur View Post
How traditions developed in the early church shows the controversy between the church of Asia Minor and the Roman church in the second century about the Passover of the Lord being celebrated on the 14th of Nisan and His resurrection on the 17th of Nisan in the Jewish week of Passover or as Rome said on the Pagan feast of Easter, beginning with Good Friday and ending with Easter Sunday. This is also found under Quartodeciman. The traditions of the Apostles are destroyed through the church of Rome beginning in the 2nd century, even the commentaries of today are twisted, because the pagan tradition won and is sanctified through the church, in contrast to God`s word (Deut 12: 29-32).
Some have obsession with Pagan stuff. The whole thing is moot, because Catholics are Christians. The traditions with "t" enhance the connection of humans with God. Who cares if one genuflects or not! Who cares if the church has statues of the Virgin and the crucified Christ. It is no big deal. It is simply a different style that comes from the very early days of Christianity.

Who cares if we celebrate the birth of Jesus on the wrong date! Is that really important?

Who cares if we honor saints? Another early Christian tradition, no big deal. We are Christians.

Catholics are the original Christians.
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:27 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arleigh View Post
Which is it /whom is it , you worship ?
worshipping the church is not worshipping God,
neither is worshipping the scriptures worshipping God.

I would believe in God if there was no NT or CC. These are just instruments to enhance the connection.
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Old 10-23-2013, 12:07 PM
 
535 posts, read 798,010 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian658 View Post
Some have obsession with Pagan stuff. The whole thing is moot, because Catholics are Christians. The traditions with "t" enhance the connection of humans with God. Who cares if one genuflects or not! Who cares if the church has statues of the Virgin and the crucified Christ. It is no big deal. It is simply a different style that comes from the very early days of Christianity.

Who cares if we celebrate the birth of Jesus on the wrong date! Is that really important?

Who cares if we honor saints? Another early Christian tradition, no big deal. We are Christians.

Catholics are the original Christians.
You're changing the thrust of the thread by deflecting attention away from Sacred Traditions with your big T little t. This discussion not about church customs such as genuflection, or praying the rosary, but instead is about SACRED TRADITIONS. Please don't confuse the issue.
arleigh brings up a good point, which is more important, the Church or the Word? The RCC teaches that The Bible comes from the Church, not that the Church comes from The Bible. They teach that The Bible can not stand alone separate from the church. http://www.catholicbible101.com/theroleofthechurch.htm

Last edited by Priscilla Martin; 10-23-2013 at 12:20 PM..
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Old 10-23-2013, 12:30 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,978 posts, read 22,194,090 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Priscilla Martin View Post
Some say Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture make up a single sacred deposit of the Word of God and are equal.

Some say the task of interpreting Sacred Scripture authentically can only be accomplished via The Magesterium.

Some quote 2Thess 2:15 So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught, whether by word of mouth or by letter from us.

Some say Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture must not contradict one another.
I'd go along with Sacred Tradition before I'd go with Sola Scriptura. There is nowhere in the Bible where God ever said He's done communicating with us, and when we tell Him we're not listening to anything He may still have to say, we're making a huge mistake. I think the problem arises primarily when "tradition" is not based on revealed truth, but on man-made beliefs and customs. Sometimes it's hard to know how to distinguish between what may have been revealed but just not written down and what was just of man's own making.
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Old 10-23-2013, 12:41 PM
 
9,908 posts, read 6,769,240 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Priscilla Martin View Post
You're changing the thrust of the thread by deflecting attention away from Sacred Traditions with your big T little t. This discussion not about church customs such as genuflection, or praying the rosary, but instead is about SACRED TRADITIONS. Please don't confuse the issue.
arleigh brings up a good point, which is more important, the Church or the Word? The RCC teaches that The Bible comes from the Church, not that the Church comes from The Bible. They teach that The Bible can not stand alone separate from the church. The Role of The Church - Catholic Bible 101
I was not trying to obfuscate the issue of "t" and "T'. It was a response to the tiresome points of idolatry, bowing, saints, etc. They regurgitate the words straight form the minister's mouth without any analysis.

I agree with you!
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:42 PM
 
183 posts, read 140,729 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian658 View Post
It is OK. You are still a catholic in my book (with little c),

I'm not even a christian, by your definition.
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:50 PM
 
9,908 posts, read 6,769,240 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShepherdMaster View Post
I'm not even a christian, by your definition.
I know nothing about you. Did you reject the salvation offered to you?
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