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Yeah, nothing like 2-300 people drinking of the same cup. I refused.
But now I'm educated and would refuse anyway.
Actually drinking from a common cup if it is wine has been shown to be more sanitary than having 2 - 300 people dunk their host into a cup. When people dunk they spread the germs on their hands to the host, to the cup. The mouth is far cleaner than the hands and if the server wipes the cup between each person, it is quite sanitary. Of course the alcohol in the wine helps as well (one of the reasons Jesus used/drank wine, not juice - far more sanitary).
The best also leave fundamentalist churches and convert to Catholicism. This is common in married ministers, just watch "Scott Hahn" in the Catholic channel. Sadly, these folks cannot become priests and have to find another profession to earn a living.
Converting from Catholicism to Protestant makes no sense for those that are well versed in Catholicism. Most of those that leave have other personal agendas or are poorly educated in Church History and theology.
So you are saying that folks like me who leave the Roman Church and go to a protestant church are less educated in theology, church history etc. than others? We also do so because of personal agenda's? What a crock. I left the Roman church because it is a misogynist, corrupt institution more concerned about protecting their own and increasing their bank account then they are with living out the teachings of Christ. Show me one place in the Bible where Jesus says only those who belong to a particular group... i.e. the favoured ones, are eligible to come to the table? He didn't - Jesus welcomed all to the table, something I do as well and something the Roman church does not do.
So you are saying that folks like me who leave the Roman Church and go to a protestant church are less educated in theology, church history etc. than others? We also do so because of personal agenda's? What a crock. I left the Roman church because it is a misogynist, corrupt institution more concerned about protecting their own and increasing their bank account then they are with living out the teachings of Christ. Show me one place in the Bible where Jesus says only those who belong to a particular group... i.e. the favoured ones, are eligible to come to the table? He didn't - Jesus welcomed all to the table, something I do as well and something the Roman church does not do.
The issue of communion in Catholic Churches is frequently misunderstood.
But the important thing is for every Christian to find the religious environment that feeds them and nurtures their faith.
We will not all find that in the same religion - and that's okay because ALL religion is manmade and thus flawed in one way or another.
Instead of focusing on the differences each religion has and being critical of them, it's a much better use of your time and energy to just celebrate what they all have in common.
So you are saying that folks like me who leave the Roman Church and go to a protestant church are less educated in theology, church history etc. than others? We also do so because of personal agenda's? What a crock. I left the Roman church because it is a misogynist, corrupt institution more concerned about protecting their own and increasing their bank account then they are with living out the teachings of Christ. Show me one place in the Bible where Jesus says only those who belong to a particular group... i.e. the favoured ones, are eligible to come to the table? He didn't - Jesus welcomed all to the table, something I do as well and something the Roman church does not do.
You sound like a Protestant and therefore, you are a Protestant.
The corruption of the men running the Church is a valid reason to leave and that falls into your own personal agenda. I assume, you did not leave because of theology.
Your knowledge of the Catechism is weak (see bold). See the Catechism on this issue (below):
Quote:
What does "catholic" mean?
830 The word "catholic" means "universal," in the sense of "according to the totality" or "in keeping with the whole." The Church is catholic in a double sense:
First, the Church is catholic because Christ is present in her. "Where there is Christ Jesus, there is the Catholic Church."307 In her subsists the fullness of Christ's body united with its head; this implies that she receives from him "the fullness of the means of salvation"308 which he has willed: correct and complete confession of faith, full sacramental life, and ordained ministry in apostolic succession. The Church was, in this fundamental sense, catholic on the day of Pentecost309 and will always be so until the day of the Parousia.
831 Secondly, the Church is catholic because she has been sent out by Christ on a mission to the whole of the human race:310
Furthermore, see what it says about other religions:
Quote:
838 "The Church knows that she is joined in many ways to the baptized who are honored by the name of Christian, but do not profess the Catholic faith in its entirety or have not preserved unity or communion under the successor of Peter."322 Those "who believe in Christ and have been properly baptized are put in a certain, although imperfect, communion with the Catholic Church."323
In a sense another reason for your departure is that you were not well informed about these issues. Your sentence in bold illustrates the point.
Last edited by Julian658; 10-29-2013 at 09:46 AM..
Julian why do I care what the Catechism says about other religions? They are going to be pro-Roman and discount everything else. It is called having their agenda ... something you accuse me of. Perhaps you should look into the mirror - you might not like what you see though. I noticed you didn't show me where in the Bible Jesus says only certain people are welcome at the table. Oh that's right, you can't because that is a restriction put in place by the Roman church, not Jesus. Hrm... who exactly has an agenda?
You sound like a Protestant and therefore, you are a Protestant.
The corruption of the men running the Church is a valid reason to leave and that falls into your own personal agenda. Obviously, you did not leave because of theology.
Your knowledge of the Catechism is weak (see bold). See the Catechism on this issue (below):
Furthermore, see what it says about other religions:
In a sense another reason for your departure is that you were not well informed about these issues. Your sentence in bold illustrates the point.
Just addressing this one Line
Quote:
Your knowledge of the Catechism is weak (see bold). See the Catechism on this issue (below)
I do not think any of us here are qualified to judge the posters knowledge of Catholicism. Also it seems many who leave are quite knowledgeable about it. Historically it seems that Martin Luther was quite knowledgeable about Catholicism Although he may not have left out of his own volition and got Booted out. The Anglican Church was originally Catholic and left En Masse There was also the Great Schism that Divided Rome and Greece. But it does seem that many people who left Catholicism were not ignorant of Catholicism. I do not think there is much to support the view that anyone leaves because they are ignorant of Catholicism
Julian why do I care what the Catechism says about other religions? They are going to be pro-Roman and discount everything else. It is called having their agenda ... something you accuse me of. Perhaps you should look into the mirror - you might not like what you see though. I noticed you didn't show me where in the Bible Jesus says only certain people are welcome at the table. Oh that's right, you can't because that is a restriction put in place by the Roman church, not Jesus. Hrm... who exactly has an agenda?
John 14:6
New International Version (NIV)
6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
Straw man. No one disputes this point, including the RCC.
Julian why do I care what the Catechism says about other religions? They are going to be pro-Roman and discount everything else. It is called having their agenda ... something you accuse me of. Perhaps you should look into the mirror - you might not like what you see though. I noticed you didn't show me where in the Bible Jesus says only certain people are welcome at the table. Oh that's right, you can't because that is a restriction put in place by the Roman church, not Jesus. Hrm... who exactly has an agenda?
Rev, again, this is a misunderstanding among Christians.
The Catholic Church is not saying "only certain people are welcome at the table".
Remember, Protestants believe that communion is a symbolic act only.
But the Catholic Church does not believe the act of communion is just symbolic of the last supper.
Catholics believe Jesus himself has become the bread and wine.
And because they believe he is fully present, they want to ensure that those partaking of the elements believe it too.
Simply put, to the Catholic Church it would be disrespectful to Jesus to allow anyone to minimize his presence by their unbelief.
The Catholic Church welcomes everyone who wants to come to the table to come!
But if they cannot in good conscience say they believe Jesus is present, the church asks you to simply fold your arms in a cross over your chest so that the elements won't be offered. At that sign the priest or minister will lay a hand on you and pray a special blessing for you to include you in communion.
You don't have to like or agree with the Catholic Church's teachings or "take" on things, but understanding the "why" will hopefully give you a new perspective that will dim your anger
Sorry lovesmountains, I don't buy it. Some Roman Churches do not allow anyone to the table and partake in the meal, unless they are Roman Catholic's themselves. I believe in Jesus but based on the postings on here, I am not welcome at the table as I no longer associate with them and pastor a Protestant Church. What is the most interesting thing though is I have friends who are Roman Catholic Priests. Never once have they refused me the table, nor commented on me coming up for the meal. In fact a Bishop I know said everyone was welcome, as long as they are Christian - being a member of The Roman Church had nothing to do with Jesus' teachings and everything to do with what Rome wanted you to believe. The only criticism I have ever received was from other congregants who knew I ministered in another denomination; they were appalled that I went up for communion - even though the priest was a family friend and made it clear we were all welcome.
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