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Old 11-02-2013, 04:47 AM
 
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Like in Revelations 2: 10...Jesus said ``Fear none of those things which you will suffer , Look the devil will cast some of you in prison, that you may be tried and you will have tribulation ten days be you faithful on to death , and I will give you a crown of life ``...........[See some of these people invited the devil into their works , which curses can come which could block any attempt to have faith with God , so they would need to repent and turn away from these sins so Jesus could break the curses , as Jesus said he could reject those who know God but have iniquity of sin which went unrepentant , which would have blocked faith] ......................................... Then From Revelations 3:1-6 Jesus give damning judgment to some from the Sardis church but not all the people , as Jesus said I know your works , and has a name of people alive and have died ..Be watch full and strengthen the things which remain , that are ready to die , for I have not found your works perfect before God ............Remember therefore how you have received and heard , and hold fast and repent..... ............ If there fore you will not watch I will come on you as a thief and you will not know the hour I will come on you .............[ see Jesus said He see their poor judgments as sin and iniquity are cursing their walk .... remember how you were saved and repent and turn away from sin and back to Jesus or be lost ].......................still there are still some who have not defiled their walk for they are worthy , and I will not blot out his name from the book of life , but I will confess his name before my Father and before His Angels ........[ see Jesus said there are some who are still faithful , and their name have not been removed from the book of life as if their names were removed then the crown of life would also be gone ] ..........
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Old 11-02-2013, 07:41 AM
 
19,950 posts, read 13,627,914 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAAN View Post
Everyone backslides at some point or time, even the best of Christians and many Pastors too. Look at Pastors that cheat on their spouse or get addicted to porn, to say they never knew Christ is to be completely unrealistic. Getting saved means you are redeemed , not perfect. We will still sin after we get saved, but committing a sin vs a living a lifestyle of sin are 2 big differences.
I don't know how we can take 1 John 2:19 to suggest we can leave Christ and come back. It is clear--if you leave him, you were never of him.

Yes--Christians sin. Of course we all do. Paul himself wrote about that in Romans--in his "I do what I don't want to do and don't do what I want to do" statement. But if you're a Christian, you will not leave Christ.

I actually think we're pretty much in agreement here.
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Old 11-02-2013, 07:42 AM
 
19,950 posts, read 13,627,914 times
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Originally Posted by hljc View Post
Like in Revelations 2: 10...Jesus said ``Fear none of those things which you will suffer , Look the devil will cast some of you in prison, that you may be tried and you will have tribulation ten days be you faithful on to death , and I will give you a crown of life ``...........[See some of these people invited the devil into their works , which curses can come which could block any attempt to have faith with God , so they would need to repent and turn away from these sins so Jesus could break the curses , as Jesus said he could reject those who know God but have iniquity of sin which went unrepentant , which would have blocked faith] ......................................... Then From Revelations 3:1-6 Jesus give damning judgment to some from the Sardis church but not all the people , as Jesus said I know your works , and has a name of people alive and have died ..Be watch full and strengthen the things which remain , that are ready to die , for I have not found your works perfect before God ............Remember therefore how you have received and heard , and hold fast and repent..... ............ If there fore you will not watch I will come on you as a thief and you will not know the hour I will come on you .............[ see Jesus said He see their poor judgments as sin and iniquity are cursing their walk .... remember how you were saved and repent and turn away from sin and back to Jesus or be lost ].......................still there are still some who have not defiled their walk for they are worthy , and I will not blot out his name from the book of life , but I will confess his name before my Father and before His Angels ........[ see Jesus said there are some who are still faithful , and their name have not been removed from the book of life as if their names were removed then the crown of life would also be gone ] ..........
Please don't take this as me trying to be a jerk....but just a pointer....please learn to hit the "return key" to make a new paragraph occasionally. It's really hard to read a paragraph like that.
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Old 11-02-2013, 09:00 AM
 
Location: New England
32,225 posts, read 21,104,768 times
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Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
I don't know how we can take 1 John 2:19 to suggest we can leave Christ and come back. It is clear--if you leave him, you were never of him.

Yes--Christians sin. Of course we all do. Paul himself wrote about that in Romans--in his "I do what I don't want to do and don't do what I want to do" statement. But if you're a Christian, you will not leave Christ.

I actually think we're pretty much in agreement here.
Peter vehemently denied him 3 times ? Did Peter the fisherman never know him too?
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Old 11-02-2013, 09:13 AM
 
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Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Peter vehemently denied him 3 times ? Did Peter the fisherman never know him too?
He was not "of him" prior to the resurrection. He did not understand the Gospel -- that Jesus was to be crucified as a propitiation for his sin. Obviously, the "us" in "they were never of us" didn't exist yet--there were no apostles yet that had seen the risen Christ.
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Old 11-02-2013, 09:27 AM
 
Location: New England
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Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
He was not "of him" prior to the resurrection. He did not understand the Gospel -- that Jesus was to be crucified as a propitiation for his sin. Obviously, the "us" in "they were never of us" didn't exist yet--there were no apostles yet that had seen the risen Christ.
Pitiful So Jesus not choosing him means nothing to you ?. Let me ask you a question...... What is the clear and obvious evidence in your life that you are a christian(i'm not interested in what you believe)?.
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Old 11-02-2013, 10:04 AM
 
19,950 posts, read 13,627,914 times
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Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Pitiful So Jesus not choosing him means nothing to you ?.
Not sure I follow you here. Not choosing who?
Quote:

Let me ask you a question...... What is the clear and obvious evidence in your life that you are a christian(i'm not interested in what you believe)?.
My faith is the primary evidence -- it's what I know. After that, my actions speak to what I believe. How my faith manifests in my life.
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Old 11-02-2013, 10:21 AM
 
Location: New England
32,225 posts, read 21,104,768 times
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Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
Not sure I follow you here. Not choosing who?


My faith is the primary evidence -- it's what I know. After that, my actions speak to what I believe. How my faith manifests in my life.
If Peter was chosen do you not think he was of him in the first place ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
but scripture is clear--if you believe in Christ ans trust him as Savior, your life will NOT be the same and will NOT look like the rest of the world.
So how do we know you are of him and what is the clear and obvious evidence that you are not like the rest of the world, in what way are you consistently different, that is obvious you follow Jesus Christ and his teachings ?. Your previous answer is way to vague. I ask because i want to use your own litmus test to know whether you are of him in the first place.From your first vague answer you failed your own test and were never of him in the first place. Proof that having a title and calling yourself a bible believer is not the evidence that you are of him in the first place.

Last edited by pcamps; 11-02-2013 at 10:30 AM..
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Old 11-02-2013, 10:47 AM
 
1,263 posts, read 1,087,539 times
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Hebrews 6

4For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt. 7For land that has drunk the rain that often falls on it, and produces a crop useful to those for whose sake it is cultivated, receives a blessing from God. 8But if it bears thorns and thistles, it is worthless and near to being cursed, and its end is to be burned. 9Though we speak in this way, yet in your case, beloved, we feel sure of better things—things that belong to salvation.
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Old 11-02-2013, 11:04 AM
 
Location: New England
32,225 posts, read 21,104,768 times
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Originally Posted by saved33 View Post
Hebrews 6

4For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt. 7For land that has drunk the rain that often falls on it, and produces a crop useful to those for whose sake it is cultivated, receives a blessing from God. 8But if it bears thorns and thistles, it is worthless and near to being cursed, and its end is to be burned. 9Though we speak in this way, yet in your case, beloved, we feel sure of better things—things that belong to salvation.
What is the bar for those enlightened for falling short(away)?. It is scriptures like this that are mishandled that are used to condemn others(proof that you have fallen away) and keeping those weak in faith under condemnation and in fear of God.
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