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The LDS Prophets and Apostles are the spokesman for God on the Earth. Christ is our only advocate with the Father, but Christ's Prophets and Apostles help us come unto Christ and then Christ alone will bring us to the Father. We know we can receive the mind and will of God through His spokesmen. And then we can pray independently and receive a personal verification of the truthfulness of the message through prayer and the power of the Holy Ghost.
Moroni doesn't say "by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know all things." Moroni does say, "by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things." We have to recieve the word through Prophets and Apostles first and then pray to know the truth of those things.
When I was at BYU, we had a great BYU Devotional and during the closing hymn "We Thank Thee O God For A Prophet" someone in the back of the Marriott Center stood up during the singing. Before too long, everyone in the Marriot Center was standing except the Brethren sitting on the stand. Then Elder Holland stood before the prayer and kindly reproved us, telling us that the Brethern didn't want us to get into the habit of standing up during the closing song. Elder Holland then reminded us that we should always keep our eye on the Brethren and to stand only if directed. Then he quipped, "Do you you still love me?"
This was a true lesson, I believe, about the importance of keeping our eye on the Brethren and understanding the role of the Holy Ghost is, not necessarily, to independently "know all things" but help us know the "truth of all things".
I have a testimony that the First Presidency and Apostles are chosen of God. They truly are inspired. I am of the belief that these men aren't teaching us Joseph Smith-type revelations/doctrines not because they are not in tune with the Spirit but because we (the church as a body and not as an individual) are not worthy of it. The steps to exaltation are like a ladder and we must start at the bottom and make our way up to the top one rung at a time. I believe that the Lord tells them not to give us greater things until we can comprehend and obey the lesser things. We are wandering around in the wilderness of Babylon and can't get out until we fully comprehend the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel.
I know a few General Authorities (3 members of the First Quorum of the Seventy) on a personal level and I can tell you that these men are servants of the Lord Jesus Christ and that they know Him. On a personal level, they have shared with me many great and marvelous things. I have been wondering why they won't share these things in General Conference to all of us and I believe that it is because we are not ready. I feel like a change is coming soon and that those that do not want to follow Christ in all things will be weeded out and the greater things will once again be preached to us as a church.
I do believe that there is lots of idolatry in the church toward the "Brethren." They are humble men and I know that they don't want to be idolized. I love General Conference because the Spirit confirms so many truths to me about what those men are saying.
The LDS Prophets and Apostles are the spokesman for God on the Earth. Christ is our only advocate with the Father, but Christ's Prophets and Apostles help us come unto Christ and then Christ alone will bring us to the Father. We know we can receive the mind and will of God through His spokesmen. And then we can pray independently and receive a personal verification of the truthfulness of the message through prayer and the power of the Holy Ghost.
Moroni doesn't say "by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know all things." Moroni does say, "by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things." We have to recieve the word through Prophets and Apostles first and then pray to know the truth of those things.
When I was at BYU, we had a great BYU Devotional and during the closing hymn "We Thank Thee O God For A Prophet" someone in the back of the Marriott Center stood up during the singing. Before too long, everyone in the Marriot Center was standing except the Brethren sitting on the stand. Then Elder Holland stood before the prayer and kindly reproved us, telling us that the Brethern didn't want us to get into the habit of standing up during the closing song. Elder Holland then reminded us that we should always keep our eye on the Brethren and to stand only if directed. Then he quipped, "Do you you still love me?"
This was a true lesson, I believe, about the importance of keeping our eye on the Brethren and understanding the role of the Holy Ghost is, not necessarily, to independently "know all things" but help us know the "truth of all things".
Danite, I like your posts because they highlight the side Mormonism I have never heard or seen.
The LDS Prophets and Apostles are the spokesman for God on the Earth. Christ is our only advocate with the Father, but Christ's Prophets and Apostles help us come unto Christ and then Christ alone will bring us to the Father. We know we can receive the mind and will of God through His spokesmen. And then we can pray independently and receive a personal verification of the truthfulness of the message through prayer and the power of the Holy Ghost.
Moroni doesn't say "by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know all things." Moroni does say, "by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things." We have to recieve the word through Prophets and Apostles first and then pray to know the truth of those things.
Danite, I'm not sure I understand. The LDS Prophets and Apostles are God's spokesmen on earth and they interpret the Scriptures so that you can understand them?
Are there several LDS prophets and apostles? Who decides who they are? What is their role? Why are they called prophets and apostles? What other positions of authority are there?
I'm glad you are here to teach us about Mormonism.
Danite, I'm not sure I understand. The LDS Prophets and Apostles are God's spokesmen on earth and they interpret the Scriptures so that you can understand them?
Are there several LDS prophets and apostles? Who decides who they are? What is their role? Why are they called prophets and apostles? What other positions of authority are there?
When Jesus Christ established His Church, He appointed both prophets and apostles to preside over the Church He would establish, and Paul said that these should remain a part of the organizational structure of the Church until all believers were to become unified in their faith. He said (in Ephesians 4:11-14) that when Jesus Christ established His Church he gave us "apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teachers." He explained the purpose behind this organizational structure and said that it was essential that it exist until we all came into a unity of our faith, understanding and knowledge of the gospel of Jesus Christ. Then he specifically cautioned that without it, we would be like "children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive." To me, he was saying that without the leadership of men called by God to act on His behalf, we are in danger of being misled, that we can be persuaded by crafty men to believe doctrines that are not of God at all, and will have a difficult time being able to distinguish between what is true and what is false. When you look at what happened during the first couple of centuries after Christ's apostles died, it appears that he was right.
Most people think of a prophet as a person who makes enough legitimate prophesies (i.e. prophesies that come to pass during thier lifetimes) to justify being known as a prophet. That's not how it works in the LDS Church. The Church is governed by a President, his two Counselors, and a Quorum of Twelve Apostles. The President of the Church is, not coioncidentally, also a Prophet. Here's how this comes to be:
LDS Apostles are called to serve in this capacity until they die. When a vacancy occurs (due to a death), a new Apostle is chosen. No one campaigns for this position. The President, his Counselors and the remaining eleven Apostles meet, discuss the various individuals in the Church whose spirituality and leadership potential would qualify them for the position of Apostle. This doesn't happen overnight. They fast and pray about their decision, both individually and collectively. When they are in agreement as to whom they believe the Lord has told them to ask to serve in this position, they issue a "calling" to that person. He is ordained by the laying on of hands by the Melchizedek Priesthood which they hold. His name is then presented to the membership of the Church for their sustaining vote at the next semi-annual General Conference of the Church.
The reason for this background is that the President of the Church, aka the Prophet, is always chosen from the ranks of the Quorum of the Twelve. When the Prophet dies, the Quorum of the Twelve meets together, again fasts and prays and selects the next President of the Church. While there is no hard and fast rule that the Prophet will be the senior member of the Quorum (in years of service, not age), this is how it has always been in the past. Consequently, the Latter-day Saints always know who is "next in line" to succeed the current Prophet following his death. As you can see, every man who is called to be a member of the Quorum of the Twelve has the potential to someday be the Prophet. When a man is ordained as the President of the Church by the members of the Twelve, the keys of authority are given to him. He becomes a Prophet, not because he has exhibited extraordinary skills at predicting the future, but because God has chosen him as the person through whom He wishes to lead His Church. This process, of course, results in another vacancy in the Quorum of the Twelve. Consequently, the procedure explained in the prior paragraph (regarding the appointment of LDS Apostles) is then repeated.
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I'm glad you are here to teach us about Mormonism.
Uh... because there hasn't been anyone here before who was both willing and able to do so? (Not quite sure how to take that, Bart.)
Moderator cut: edit
I would like nothing more than to be able to simply answer questions about my religion in an atmosphere of civility and respect. Since I make it a point never to proselytize, it seems to me that this would not be an unreasonable expectation. Moderator cut: edit That said, if you or anybody else does have any questions about Mormonism, you apparently now have two sources of information Moderator cut: Addressed
"Now Faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
What is faith? This question has been asked many times by many people. The Bible offers this explanation of faith, but it is a confusing one. How can evidence exist of something that cannot be seen? Presumably, this unseen item also cannot be felt, heard, smelt, or tasted--not by physical senses at least. So why is faith said to be evidence of it. How can you have evidence of something that can't be experienced physically?
"And now as I said concerning faith--faith is not to have a perfect knowledge of things; therefore if you have faith ye hope for things which are not seen, which are true.
Both the Book of Mormon and the Bible tell us that faith is belief in things that do not exist in a realm that we can discern with our earthly senses. I suppose that it cannot exist there because we cannot detect the future with our physical bodies. We have to believe in something that we have no concrete way of knowing will actually come to pass.
If our faith is joined with revelation from the Lord, then we can truly have faith. A farmer can plant his crops and have them fail, and so not see the realization of the faith he exercised when planting. But those who are working towards a goal promised by God will always see the realization of their beliefs because God has the power to make the things he promises come to pass. That way, those who exercise faith will be actually basing it on something that is true.
Faith is the evidence because faith is what makes the desired object come to be so long as the faith of man is coupled with the faith of God.
How to bring down an adamant Adam
Now this was the devious plan of the adversary, by which he would get around the adamant nature of Adam. The strategy was to use Eve to destroy Adam by putting Eve in peril (through her fall), which would cause Adam to voluntarily put himself in peril (through his own fall) in order to save her. It worked because it was based upon the nature of Adam, which was patterned after God Himself. In other words, although it was Adam’s nature to be totally obedient, it was also his nature to save his loved ones, even if it meant the voluntary sacrifice of his own life. Sound familiar? Damsel in distress and rescue as gospel principles
As a result of these events, God patterned the entire gospel on that interaction between Adam and Eve, which resulted in the fall. How so?
By partaking of the fruit, Eve became the prototypical damsel in distress and all her daughters would follow this pattern, becoming themselves, in the gospel plan, damsels in distress.
Adam became the prototypical knight in shining armor that puts himself in jeopardy in order to rescue the maiden from the danger she is in, and all his sons would follow this same pattern, becoming saviors (or rescuers) on mount Zion.
The cries of Eve to Adam to save her from her dilemma is the prototypical prayer, by which all prayers to God, in which we plead to Him for mercy and salvation, is patterned after. Just as she wept to Adam, so are we to weep to God. When we perform a proper prayer, after this order of Eve, we take upon us the role of the damsel in distress, and God hears and answers our prayers.
Adam’s response to Eve, in which he condescended to save her from her distress, is the prototype after which the atonement of Jesus Christ is patterned. The condescension of God, then, is patterned after the condescension of Adam. The male priesthood orders, which administer the ordinances of salvation, are based on the “rescuer,” while all female priesthood orders are based upon the “damsel in distress.”
When Jesus faces God, He pleads with Him in our behalf as a Damsel in Distress. When He faces us, He stands as our Rescuer. When a man faces Christ, he pleads with Him as a damsel in distress. When he faces his wife and children, it is as a rescuer. When a woman faces her husband or Christ, it is as a damsel in distress. When she faces her children, it is as a rescuer. Children all have the role of damsels in distress until they are of age.
The root and pattern of the damsel in distress can be traced to Eve, from the time of her fall, and the rescuer principle can be traced to Adam, from the time of his fall. The gospel given to Adam and Eve after their fall, and given to all of their children, retains the same pattern.
The ancient church, as written in our scriptural canon, was almost entirely based upon assigning men the role of rescuer and women the role of damsels in distress, with but few exceptions. The men fought the wars, not the women, and thus they became the protectors of the women. The men were expected to be the providers for their families (rescuing them from hunger, etc.), not the women. The women and children had claim on their husbands, not the other way around. And when it came to leadership, the leader was typically male. In the modern church, we now use the word preside, which is also an expected role of the men, as stated in the Proclamation on the Family. Some Book of Mormon instances of damsel in distress
Captain Moroni’s title of liberty was “in defense of our wives.” That is damsel in distress. The kidnapped Lamanite women created a damsel in distress situation which brought out the vast Lamanite army to search for 24 women. Jacob’s rebuke of Nephite husbands because of their desire for additional wives and how they were making their wives feel bad was a damsel in distress theme, the rescue provided by the Lord who sent His prophet to call the husbands to repentance. The Nephites were commanded to defend their wives and children against Lamanite aggression even unto bloodshed. Why didn’t the Lord just authorize the Nephites to wipe out the Lamanite threat? Well, one reason might have been so that Nephite wives would have a continual source of potential distress, in the form of the Lamanites. This would allow them to more fully cleave unto their rescuing husbands.
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(Not quite sure how to take that, Bart.)
