U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 12-28-2011, 10:47 AM
 
91 posts, read 59,107 times
Reputation: 15

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by GREATDIVIDE46 View Post
I've been in Churches of Christ that had a piano and an organ but never used them because the Lord didn't lead anyone to that church who could play them. It didn't detract from worship at all that the instruments weren't being used. Not that I'm against instruments in worship, but I think some churches carry it a little to the extreme, what with drums, electric guitars, etc. Sometimes the instruments overwhelm the singing.
I think that we are agreeing this is more a matter of personal preferance as opposed to a biblical mandate?

 
Old 12-28-2011, 10:49 AM
 
91 posts, read 59,107 times
Reputation: 15
On the issue of water baptism, do you agree that there is a distinction drawn between a water baptism and a spiritual baptism in all four Gospels and in the Book of Acts?
 
Old 12-28-2011, 11:08 AM
 
91 posts, read 59,107 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by mzjamiedawn View Post
Joey, having been raised in the cofC and having been a Christian in one for 10 years (I no longer am), I can tell you that the main reason most do not use instrumental music is because they feel it is not authorized in the NT, and they only live under the NT, not the OT. They will refer to Eph. 5:19... "Speak to one another with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. Sing and make music in your heart to the Lord". They believe "making music in your heart" means that's where the instrument is (your heart strings). They also believe that this is the only way you are to "make music".

It's one of the things I disagreed with the church about. I believe since we are told, in the above verse, to speak to one another in psalms, that that gives us the authority to use instruments, since a psalm is actually a song accompanied by instrumental music.

Personally, I like acapella music best, but I never condemned anyone else for using instruments.

Mainstream churches of Christ try their best to follow NT scripture, and not add to it or take away from it. Sometimes in the process, they strain a gnat.

On another note: instrumental music is not the only division in churches of Christ. Another is whether or not you can have a kitchen in the building, and whether you can use church monies to support orphanages. Those who believe you cannot, will not fellowship with those who do.
That's a pretty good summary. Can I ask a follow up question that is only somewhat related?

Given your years of involvement with the church of Christ, is the Old Testament preached at all in any sermons?
 
Old 12-28-2011, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Tulsa
2,529 posts, read 3,615,561 times
Reputation: 548
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyknish View Post
That's a pretty good summary. Can I ask a follow up question that is only somewhat related?

Given your years of involvement with the church of Christ, is the Old Testament preached at all in any sermons?
Oh definitely. It's a way to learn more about God. They just don't believe we have to live under OT laws.
 
Old 12-28-2011, 12:19 PM
 
91 posts, read 59,107 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by mzjamiedawn View Post
Oh definitely. It's a way to learn more about God. They just don't believe we have to live under OT laws.
That's good to hear.
 
Old 12-28-2011, 12:29 PM
 
Location: Coffee County, Alabama
289 posts, read 209,657 times
Reputation: 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyknish View Post
I think that we are agreeing this is more a matter of personal preferance as opposed to a biblical mandate?
Yeah, I would say so.
 
Old 12-28-2011, 12:31 PM
 
Location: Coffee County, Alabama
289 posts, read 209,657 times
Reputation: 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyknish View Post
On the issue of water baptism, do you agree that there is a distinction drawn between a water baptism and a spiritual baptism in all four Gospels and in the Book of Acts?
No, I don't think the Church of Christ draws that distinction. Personally, I don't either. I'm not sure what a spiritual baptism would be all by itself or how one would know they had received it. I can't think of any scripture, off the top of my head, that addresses anything called spiritual baptism.
 
Old 12-28-2011, 12:37 PM
 
91 posts, read 59,107 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by GREATDIVIDE46 View Post
Yeah, I would say so.
Awesome. The rest of the stuff is easy by comparison.
 
Old 12-28-2011, 12:42 PM
 
2,779 posts, read 1,937,875 times
Reputation: 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miss Blue View Post
..This is one reason why there was a split within the mainstream Church of Christ years ago..In all the Churches of Christ I have worshiped in or was a member of,[45 years] some took it very seriously to the point of arguing about it and not having any fellowship with the CofC down the road with a piano. As for myself and many other members it made no difference to us whether there was or was not a piano or other musical instrument..Personally I feel that the arguments took the focus off the reason for the meeting of the church...and has created dissention within the Bride of Christ..

I do not get into any of the scripture battles any more because one has the verses he follows and another has the verses he follows and that is what causes so many arguments and why I am no longer a member of the church being discussed in this thread

that is jmho though
I worsip with a group that doesn't use instruments, but I would never condemn someone who did. This is not something I have ever been knowledgable about so I never took a stand either way. I can only tell you that I visited a church once that used a piano. After singing accappella for so many years, I found the piano to be distracting and it sounded obnoxious. I've not found myself in a position of ever having to defend not using musical instruments. I hope I never do. I believe I have bigger fish to fry in just bringing the lost to Jesus. I am glad, however, that there are no instruments where I go. I don't believe God would find my worship unacceptable if there is no piano, but ifhere were, He might. I figure better safe than sorry. And meanwhile I will leave the controversy to those more knowledable than me.

I am very sorry you walked away though. I pray you will someday rethink your position.

Blessings,

Katie
 
Old 12-28-2011, 01:23 PM
 
2,779 posts, read 1,937,875 times
Reputation: 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by atomtkirk View Post
well, if you want a scripture that tells us not to... there isn't one. so to some that is the only authority they need to do it.

However, from a historical standpoint, instruments were not introduced into worship until (this is an arguable approximation) around 670A.D. I have never ran into a church historian that mentioned Christians using instruments in worship. Josephus spoke on this. As did numerous other church historians.

over 600 years the church did not have instruments. Now I ask myself why? And why after 600 years did they bring an organ in? Seems to me if they were allowed or accepted in the earliest worship services then there would be some mention of it.

instruments are man made devices. Singing from the heart is spiritual. We are the instruments of God.

To people who have grown up with instruments in services, i realize this is going to be a hard pill to swallow and will probably be overlooked as just one person's opinion... and it is. But if the only example of Christ's church in the scriptures doesn't make any mention of it and historical records are overwhelmingly in harmony that the early church did not use them when they were probably readily available, then that tells me that I should not use them.

I can't tell anyone to not use them. Just don't accept that its proper and right in the sight of God to do so. God used to require a lot of things in the OT. But we are no longer under a Tutor...

Galatians 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed. 24 Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. 26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s descendants, heirs according to promise.
Thanks for sharing Atom. This is not one of my strong points. I worship in the north where the coC is very small. It's an old building from the 1700's. When we did some remodeling, we discovered a time capsule hidden in the walls. That was awesome. The old church building belonged to a congegational group before we purchased it. There was a nice old organ in the place, which no one could play. They gave it away. We are just a simple little country church that hasn't experienced some of the problems big congregations sometimes do. We once had a group visit from a big church in Alabama. They had big ideas about some things which didn't fly with our congregation. It is just very different in the north. Our group is made of northern folks who have been here their whole lives. Our preacher never went to preaching school. He's just an ole farm boy who has put lots of time into studying the Bible. We occasionally get visitors from the bigger, more established congregations, and they tell us we are very Biblically sound. I am so thankful I am where I am. God has so richly blessed me.

Katie
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2017, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32 - Top