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Old 01-02-2012, 03:14 PM
 
91 posts, read 58,011 times
Reputation: 15

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saltandlight View Post
Yes, the psalms would be a part of the old testament.
From what i understand the book of psalms is a book of prayer and song to God from his people { it mentions David}
It did involve mechanical instruments.
The Bible says it does so i believe that.

If you look at Psalms 57 just as an example.
This was a prayer and song for deliverance in reference to the events in
1 sam 24: 1-3

All of the books in the Old Testament overlap each other as they are all carrying through the same story of the Jewish people.

I don't know of any passages that shows God required this form of worship
in the old testament.
Maybe something in Leviticus since that book deals mainly with the law of the Jews.
The point is we see it being done, unlike the new testament where we don't see it at all.
I have several responses.

So, then I suggest that the Psalms (and other similar books from the OT) were not fulfilled by Jesus as part of the New Covenant. Therefore, the OT form of worship was not fulfilled by the New Covenant. It was the Old Testament laws that were.

See this passage from Paul: "Instead, be filled with the Spirit, speaking to one another with psalms, hymns, and songs from the Spirit." It seems to me that the meaning of "psalms" here is pretty clear - the Psalms of the OT.

Finally, in Romans 14, Paul basically says that we can continue to follow the OT laws, if we believe that they failing to do so will be a sin. "Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God." If he is making this distinction on following the Old Covenant (which was fulfilled by Jesus), then why would we not be able to worship as outlined in the Psalms?

I would also like to point out that Romans 14 basically acknowledges as correct two different interpretations of following Jesus.

 
Old 01-02-2012, 03:20 PM
 
44 posts, read 37,265 times
Reputation: 17
You know, This idea that we cannot all understand the scriptures alike must have come from satan!

Surely there will be times when people will disagree on a point and have to talk it out and study more, But God's desire is that all men come to the knowledge of the truth and be saved!

If we believe that the Bible is from God and it is our guide on how to live and please our God.
2Tim 3:16
Gal 1:8-9
2Peter 1:3
Col 1: 5-6

Why would God give us the Bible and make it impossible for everyone to understand it when he says that this very word will be our judge {John 12:48} in the last days.
Yes, Jesus will judge us according to the words in the Bible.
 
Old 01-02-2012, 03:42 PM
 
91 posts, read 58,011 times
Reputation: 15
What is Paul saying then in Romans 14?
 
Old 01-02-2012, 03:45 PM
 
44 posts, read 37,265 times
Reputation: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyknish View Post
I have several responses.

So, then I suggest that the Psalms (and other similar books from the OT) were not fulfilled by Jesus as part of the New Covenant. Therefore, the OT form of worship was not fulfilled by the New Covenant. It was the Old Testament laws that were.

See this passage from Paul: "Instead, be filled with the Spirit, speaking to one another with psalms, hymns, and songs from the Spirit." It seems to me that the meaning of "psalms" here is pretty clear - the Psalms of the OT.

Finally, in Romans 14, Paul basically says that we can continue to follow the OT laws, if we believe that they failing to do so will be a sin. "Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God." If he is making this distinction on following the Old Covenant (which was fulfilled by Jesus), then why would we not be able to worship as outlined in the Psalms?

I would also like to point out that Romans 14 basically acknowledges as correct two different interpretations of following Jesus.
I would not condemn anyone to Hell if they choose to use mechanical instruments in worship. I will not personally be a part of it, because i don't believe that i see authority in the new testament.

A lot of people use Romans 14 here!

Notice that it starts out with "Accept him who's Faith is WEAK".
The early church was dealing with Jews who we're coming from the old religion that was all physical and worldly into a spiritual kingdom.

More to come!
 
Old 01-02-2012, 04:41 PM
 
44 posts, read 37,265 times
Reputation: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyknish View Post
What is Paul saying then in Romans 14?
I know for certain that he was not saying that you can choose which covenant you want to follow, If that is what you are saying.
People came into the church needing to be taught the right way just like they do today.
You do not have to know everything there is to know about God and his Church to begin a relationship with him { not that anyone will EVER know everything because we are hu***** But once you give your life to God you then begin studying and changing things in your life to the pattern God wants from you.
Jesus said those who worship him Must worship in Spirit and TRUTH.
So we know there is a truth, Just gotta find out what it is.

I think i read in an older post that you we're once a member of a church of Christ.
Do you mind if i ask what changed?
 
Old 01-02-2012, 04:50 PM
 
91 posts, read 58,011 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saltandlight View Post
I know for certain that he was not saying that you can choose which covenant you want to follow, If that is what you are saying.
People came into the church needing to be taught the right way just like they do today.
You do not have to know everything there is to know about God and his Church to begin a relationship with him { not that anyone will EVER know everything because we are hu***** But once you give your life to God you then begin studying and changing things in your life to the pattern God wants from you.
Jesus said those who worship him Must worship in Spirit and TRUTH.
So we know there is a truth, Just gotta find out what it is.

I think i read in an older post that you we're once a member of a church of Christ.
Do you mind if i ask what changed?
That was a different poster.

I was never a member of the cofC.
 
Old 01-02-2012, 05:35 PM
 
44 posts, read 37,265 times
Reputation: 17
Sorry, I confused you with someone else.

What religion are you a part of, If you don't mind me asking?
 
Old 01-02-2012, 05:45 PM
 
44 posts, read 37,265 times
Reputation: 17
I want you to know that i don't claim to have all the answers. I know that the Bible does but i am just as human as you and able to err in the word.

You have brought up a good point about the psalms. The scripture does say speak to one another in psalms, hymns and spiritual songs.
I will definitly be examining this by Gods word because i don't want to be wrong in what i teach the word to say.

I appreciate the communication because most people will not talk these things out.

Have you ever done a google search on the Church and how all the different denominations came about? I hear there are over 33,000. christian denominations in the world today!
 
Old 01-02-2012, 06:07 PM
 
91 posts, read 58,011 times
Reputation: 15
You have brought up a good point about the psalms. The scripture does say speak to one another in psalms, hymns and spiritual songs.
I will definitly be examining this by Gods word because i don't want to be wrong in what i teach the word to say.

Believe me, I appreciate this. Also, I am in no way advocating that musical instruments are a prerequisite for worship by any means. In fact, I construe Romans 14 as meaning that I should not suggest a form of worship that would cause you to sin. My position is that there are servants out there worshipping beautifully with instruments in their own way and I believe it to be a biblical form of worship.
 
Old 01-02-2012, 06:14 PM
 
91 posts, read 58,011 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saltandlight View Post
Sorry, I confused you with someone else.

What religion are you a part of, If you don't mind me asking?
I am a Christian. For the better part of the last decade, I have been a member of the Vineyard church.
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