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Old 07-18-2014, 09:55 PM
 
Location: Canada
11,123 posts, read 6,329,176 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wardendresden View Post
We were made in HIS image. Hate is NOT necessarily an evil thing. I hate slavery, I hate pedophilia, I hate many things. What I cannot hate is people because God RESERVES that right unto Himself as a righteous hatred, because only He sees the heart of man which is wicked beyond description. If we were made in the human image that the OP desires, we would only have love in us from the beginning, but we don't. Just the opposite.
brother why do you think hate is a part of the way God made us in His image? Did man obtain hate from God or did hate come after man fell?

And if you believe God can hate people who sin why can't you who is made in His image and likeness?

seems to me you think you love people more then God does, for you say you cannot hate people even though God hates people.
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Old 07-18-2014, 09:58 PM
 
Location: Canada
11,123 posts, read 6,329,176 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Did you read it, Warden . . . or just make a knee-jerk response to the title? The part of us that is from God is our Spirit because God is Spirit. The part of us that is our adversary is our animal nature because it has no conception of Good or Evil and is simply focused on survival, pleasure and avoidance of pain . . . like most animals. Our Spirit arrives in us at birth as a seed and it grows or not based on our development of control over our animal nature. Unfortunately it starts out handicapped because it is just a seed and must germinate and develop over time . . . while our animal nature is fully developed and functioning.

This is why it is important to teach our children properly and not expect them to be mature adults when they are not. They will develop increasing control and be happier and healthier later in life when their Spirits are more mature. Teaching them that they are just born as worms or filthy rags or whatever simply because their animal nature is stronger and indiscriminate is just plain cruel and evil. It is our animal nature that does not know Good from Evil and will always make indiscriminate choices. Our Spirit which CAN know Good from Evil must discriminate for it and exercise self-control over the baser urges. That does not make us worms or filthy rags . . . it makes us immature.
another good post brother. walk by the spirit and we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh.
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Old 07-19-2014, 12:04 AM
 
4,217 posts, read 2,765,505 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Modern psychology is not just my understanding . . . it is my knowledge as a Professor of it for over 30 years. I am familiar with the Bible interpretations made by our ancestors who saw God in OUR image and in the image of their rulers. The idea that their human emotions were NOT shared by God was inconceivable to them. To them . . . God was responsible for everything . . . including their triumphs and failures. There was no such thing as an accident. If something happened to you . . . God did it to you. You can continue to retain the ancient ignorance of our ancestors as your basis for understanding God . . . as the Christian leaders before you have . . . but it is unwise.
"What you have hidden from the smart and the learned you have revealed it to a mere child."

That would be a child of God which not everyone is.

"While you have the light believe in the light and you will become a child of light."

"If you believe you'll see the glory of God."

The reason you cannot see is you do not believe.
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Old 07-19-2014, 04:49 AM
 
309 posts, read 509,326 times
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How delusional to think that God is not a just God and that he can love and hate. Remember he hated Esau and loved Jacob. He hates workers of iniquity. Moderator cut: deleted

Last edited by june 7th; 07-19-2014 at 10:09 AM.. Reason: Please refer to Sticky.
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Old 07-19-2014, 08:16 AM
 
Location: USA
17,156 posts, read 11,306,202 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deerdog View Post
How delusional to think that God is not a just God and that he can love and hate. Remember he hated Esau and loved Jacob. He hates workers of iniquity. Moderator cut: Orphaned

You might have a point if any Christian Universalist said that God wasn't just. Everything else, including God's justness flows from who/what God IS: LOVE. Hate is certainly not in any biblical description or definition of love. But I can understand why people who don't want to give up hating would convince themselves that God is somehow bi-polar and both loves and hates. It makes God more "user-friendly"* if God is just like us -- if God hates.

* "user-friendly"... ie., a convenient excuse to use for justifying our own hate

Last edited by june 7th; 07-19-2014 at 10:10 AM..
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Old 07-19-2014, 09:30 AM
 
63,461 posts, read 39,726,177 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
You know I have read all the Bible, brother. But God is Spirit . . . NOT animal. It is our Spirit that is in God's image . . . not our animal body or nature. He breathed His Spirit into Adam. But Adam's Spirit was newly created and NOT remotely fully developed or mature. That is how we ALL come into this world, Warden . . . immature Spirits in fully developed animal bodies. That is why our FIRST lesson in Eden was to differentiate between right and wrong . . . Good and Evil. It is essential knowledge to develop the self control over our animal nature to avoid doing Evil.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wardendresden View Post
So animals hate? Or is that a "special" attribute of the human animal?
No animals do not hate they just react and develop conditioned associations based on survival, pain or pleasure. Hate is a complex emotion that is the result of conflict between our Spirit and our animal nature. The inner conflict produces the cumulative frustration and hurt that eventually produces hate. Please reread my posts carefully, brother and see if any of it begins to make sense to you.
Peace in Christ's love.
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Old 07-19-2014, 09:43 AM
 
Location: Mobile, Al.
3,671 posts, read 2,225,242 times
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God do hate, and we inherited it from God, this is not just a human thing. and we failed in how to control it. just like evil. the very first test was in the Garden, with the tree of the Knowledge of good and Evil. and yes, God do hate, sin, Proverb 6:16 “These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto himâ€. one can read what he hates in the scriptures that follows. the key is to control it. we don't have full control over it, and many other things in our lives. and for instance "LOVE". we see it in our own eyes, and how we want to control it.


be blessed.
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Old 07-19-2014, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Florida
76,960 posts, read 47,272,488 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
My dear brothers and sisters in Christ,

My heart is heavy and my Spirit is depressed by the belief that our God can hate or be jealous or any of the other complex negative human emotions born of our psychological weaknesses. This misunderstanding has produced a corruption of God's love for us all. I cannot believe how badly Christ's revelation has been misunderstood. God IS agape love. He loves us all and will not count our sins against us. This IS the central message of Christ's Gospel. Hate plays no role and is no part of God, period. Hate is entirely a human psychological weakness caused by our immature Spirit and our animal nature.

For clarity of communication . . . I will once again employ a simple narrative to convey the processes that are essentially driven by very complex neurological and physiological processes to produce the complex human emotions . . . like anger and eventually hate. This simplification encompasses (as do all of my broad analogies and narratives) the essential nature of the processes without any undue jargon and specialized knowledge required. The simplicity combined with my spiritual emphasis will also no doubt annoy our non-Christian brethren.

Hate is a human psychological weakness born of the combination of our immature Spirit (conscious awareness) and our animal nature. It is based in the emotion of anger. Our awareness of evil, injustice, cruelty,etc. (Good and Evil) is transferred to our animal nature and its response is automatic. Our animal nature senses hurt and seeks to assuage the hurt. Failure to do so can result in frustration, cumulative frustration and eventually anger. When we cannot rectify the hurt . . . the combination of our animal nature and immature embryo Spirit produces the emotion of hate for the cause of the hurt.

Without our conscious awareness (Spirit), there can be no anger . . . only frustration. Humans are the only animals we know about that have our unique awareness (Spirit). Therefore, humans are the only animals that can get angry. There will be many of you who have at one time or another seen an animal teased until it got angry. You might think that I am in error. However, the effect that you witnessed was that of physically-imposed cumulative frustration (technically: abreaction). (Tease a dog while holding its muzzle closed and you will be treated to the effects of this cumulative frustration in a very unpleasant fashion.) Cumulative frustration is the basis for human anger . . . but anger is the more complex response created by the involvement of our conscious awareness (Spirit).

Anger can result when someone hurts you, either physically or mentally, or both. The pituitary (Serpent's tongue) produces the hormones that result in the emotion of anger or even rage depending upon the circumstances. Signals to run, hit or kill are the ones most often produced by our animal nature in answer to hurt inflicted by an antagonist. This is usually referred to as the fight or flight response. The logical course of action for your body is to perform some behavior that will satisfy the drive signals and restore equilibrium to the body. This sequence of internal events would occur in any organism that was physically hurt by an antagonist, even the lower animals.

The controls in our cerebrum afford our Spirit many options. It can amplify and perfect the hit or kill response. It can simply allow it to occur without interference or it can decrease reroute or prevent it. The brain is a coordinated grouping and the circuits in the cerebrum are necessary to effect the response. However, the response need not be altered by conscious thought. The entire sequence can occur completely without thought, and frequently does. The irresistible impulse or temporary insanity so often pleaded in murder trials is the result of this combination. The cerebrum enters into the sequence only if you have the time or the inclination to think. Therein lies the important difference.

Anger is a possible, but not a necessary part of this sequence. Our special talent lies in being able to initiate this sequence and then to frustrate it by suppressing the natural physical response thereby producing cumulative frustration eventually leading to the emotion of anger. Anger begins with a feeling of hurt experienced by our Spirit, (e.g. an unkind word or injustice.) There is no need for a physical stimulus. If a physical stimulus is present the response will be intensified, (e.g. an unkind word and a slap in the face.) Our animal nature receives this hurt signal and responds with a signal to make some response in retaliation.

Our Spirit is in the middle. The signal to respond creates a need that must be satisfied, i.e. to do something. Our embryo Spirit unlike our animal nature does not really want to respond aggressively to the hurt. Atheists would attribute this attribute of our Spirit to the fact that we learn early in our development that a physical response is almost always a detrimental one . . . and in most cases merely adds fuel to an already volatile situation. Since I believe our Spirits emanate from God . . . I attribute the reluctance to God's nature. Regardless which view you prefer . . . there is a conflict.

Consequently, our animal nature is frustrated, we feel additional hurt from the added frustration, so we signal this hurt to our animal nature, and a reinforced signal to respond is sent. This self-amplifying process continues with our Spirit simultaneously preventing response and sending hurt signals to our animal nature until it exceeds some internal threshold. When it does our Spirit gives up, loses control, and our animal nature is allowed to react . . . usually very violently. It is this cumulative frustration of our animal nature that produces the angry response or outburst. When there is no opportunity for such outbursts . . . hate for the cause of the anger ensues.

In short . . . the primary reason anger occurs is that immature souls transmit hurt signals to our animal nature in the first place. The physiological conditions are unavoidable once that is done. By thinking or dwelling on an incident or unpleasant situation, we end up transmitting cumulatively frustrating hurt signals to our animal nature leading us closer and closer to a physiologically-induced answer in response. Diverting our thoughts from the situation and controlling our interpretation of its significance is the fastest way to short-circuit this destructive inner conflict and eliminate the angry responses. This is why we are told to try to "love God and each other" daily and repent when we don't. Dwelling on the negative only frustrates us and increases the negative emotions within us. That is physically damaging . . . not just psychologically damaging.

The phenomenon of the complex emotions is the reason our immature embryo Spirit has so much difficulty controlling certain behavior. If we do not have an external source of motivation for control of our animal nature . . . we will continue to seek comfort, solace, and pleasure from our body. This indiscriminate transmission of signals to our animal nature can only produce animal answers and temporary animal satisfaction of our needs. Besides, our embryo Spirit will never mature if we don't invest our life energy in Spirit-strengthening responses (Self-control).

I am not optimistic that this description of the genesis of hat will alter the fundamentalists' beliefs that our God hates and is vengeful, etc. . . . but writing it has allowed me to vent some of my cumulative frustration dealing with the lack of understanding of our complex human emotions and why they cannot be attributed to God. I also am frustrated by the inexplicable corruption of the Gospel and Christ's instructions to love . . . into believing all the right details ABOUT God and Jesus . . . as if our Almighty God would NOT know what we believe. Nothing we say or proclaim about our beliefs will fool anyone but other humans nor will it have any relevance to what we truly believe in our innermost hearts and minds. I hesitate to point this truth out to you, brothers and sisters . . . but God already knows our innermost hearts and minds!
Does your love-god love murder?
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Old 07-19-2014, 11:14 AM
 
1,606 posts, read 1,245,239 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Does your love-god love murder?
The love-god they have created does not kill anyone and every time in the Scripture when God exacted His perfect justice it was just made up by 'lying scribes' and proliferated by 'ancient ignorance.'

He has already admitted the belief that Moses didn't exist. That should be enough to dismiss their doctrines as false right away.

God has the capacity to love and hate. God loves us and hates sin. This is Christianity 101. He must have missed that class.
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Old 07-19-2014, 12:01 PM
 
Location: Up above the world so high!
45,218 posts, read 100,370,072 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wardendresden View Post
So animals hate? Or is that a "special" attribute of the human animal?
Only animals with an ego hate, which basically means humans
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