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If that Mormon believed he would be judged by Joseph Smith he didn't understand LDS beliefs and teachings.
Mormons DO NOT believe they will be judged by Joseph Smith. Nor are they told that. Just so you know.
The post did say the Mormon was calling out the name Joseph, it did not say he was calling out the name Joseph Smith. Unless the poster meant to say the Mormon was calling out the name Joseph Smith?
When someone has not experienced something then they will often have difficulty believing/understating others who have. This includes NDE's.
If that Mormon believed he would be judged by Joseph Smith he didn't understand LDS beliefs and teachings.
Mormons DO NOT believe they will be judged by Joseph Smith. Nor are they told that. Just so you know.
I did not witness this, nor did I know the person who passed personally. I only know what was told to me by someone who did.
While I am not Mormon doctrine scholar, I believe the LDS teach the judgement in this way.
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In John 5:22 it is explained that Heavenly Father has delegated the responsibility of judgment to His Son Jesus Christ.
“The Son, not the Father, is the Judge of the whole earth, but his judgment is made in accordance with the will of the Father and therefore is just. . . .
“Because Jesus is the Son of Man of Holiness he has been given the power to execute judgment, to sit in judgment at the great and last day, to call all men forth in immortality to stand before his bar” (Bruce R. McConkie, Doctrinal New Testament Commentary, 1:190, 192, 195).
Christ will then call others to help him in judgment. The original Twelve Apostles called by the Savior will judge the twelve tribes of Israel, as explained in Matthew 19:28:
And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
The Twelve Disciples whom Christ called among the Nephite people will judge the Nephites and Lamanites. Joseph Smith holds the keys of judgment for people who live in the Last Dispensation of time.
Those things have been planted in our subconscious by all the claims we here and when the brain is deprived of oxygen and sense death is near it brings up those things we have stored away for that time of pre-death. Very simple. I remember hearing of a Mormon who believed he would be judged by Joseph Smith and was calling the name Joseph just before he passed. The things we have preconceived or been told to expect is brought up by the brain at the time needed.
...Those things have been planted in our subconscious by all the claims...
That does not explain the NDEs of children. Those 'things' could not have been planted in their subconsciences.
...when the brain is deprived of oxygen and sense death is near it brings up those things we have stored away for that time of pre-death...
Since the brain functions without oxygen (still sensing death), wouldn't you think we need a new way to declare people dead?
...Very simple. I remember hearing of a Mormon who believed he would be judged by Joseph Smith and was calling the name Joseph just before he passed...
So? Some guy calls out to Joseph Smith before he died. What does that prove?
...The things we have preconceived or been told to expect is brought up by the brain at the time needed...
Still doesn't explain people reporting the same exact things.
Perhaps God sent Joseph Smith to greet him. The literature says that the people we are most comfortable with or love the most will be there when we pass.
My cousin, who died from cancer, in her last moments was saying, "Mom? Mom, is that you?" And my stepfather's last words in delerium were "Oh, what did ever do to deserve this? Moma? Moma?" And then he passed.
Now two relatives giving indications in their last moments they were seeing their dead mothers?
The brain does not die instantly when first deprived of oxygen. Else, CPR would never work.
Yes, I know that. This is about people going without oxygen for long periods of time. Many minutes, even hours. Can the brain function without oxygen for say 30 minutes?
An interesting idea, Thrill. Going along with what you posted someone could be a descendant of Joseph Smith and call out his name. Or maybe he saw a good friend named Joesph. Or maybe the messages in his dying brain caused him to call out a random name.
those things have been planted in our subconscious by all the claims we here and when the brain is deprived of oxygen and sense death is near it brings up those things we have stored away for that time of pre-death. Very simple. .
That does not explain the NDEs of children. Those 'things' could not have been planted in their subconsciences.
That is quite the assertion to make. Actually Children are sponges for information. And they are SURROUNDED in information and culture. Imagery of gods, angels and the like abound and are legion. The declaration you make that children would not absorb such things is quite egregious. I am agog to see your substantiation for such a claim.
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Originally Posted by Zero 7
Since the brain functions without oxygen (still sensing death), wouldn't you think we need a new way to declare people dead?
No. Because the current definition of death works just fine and has nothing to do with oxygen. Clinical death for example has very specific definitions. As does actual death.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero 7
Still doesn't explain people reporting the same exact things.
Except that is does. There is, for example, a good reason why people reporting UFO abductions all describe very similar aliens. Hint: The explanation is not that the aliens are actually abducting people. The explanation lies in the fact our culture is steeped in the imagery of the kind of aliens Stephen Spielberg created and this influences heavily what people imagine aliens look like.
Similarly the conformity of NDE descriptions with the After Life explanations of the culture the NDE experiences are geographically located in is explicable by the influence of the religious culture surrounding the people having those experiences.
And as another user on the the thread already asked anyway: How does experience of coming near an event give one license to declare what happens after that event?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero 7
Yes, I know that. This is about people going without oxygen for long periods of time. Many minutes, even hours. Can the brain function without oxygen for say 30 minutes?
One of the biggest failures in the NDE proponents is that they simply assume that the experiences described by the patient actually happened when they think it happened. A patient declares that they had Experience X when "clinically dead" and NDE fetishists simply take their word for it.
But it is valid to suggest that such experiences were had on the way into, or out of, such a state. Not during it. There is simply no evidence on offer.... much less by anyone on this thread..... to suggest that their experiences actually were had during the periods they believe them to have been.
Were the NDE proponents to address and validate this assumption in some way, we might be able to take them seriously.
I agree with DewDropInn! What does everyone think will happen life after death? I am a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, or as we may called, Mormons. I know that a loving Heavenly Father wouldn't leave us to find the path back to him on our own. We have a great amount of information give to us for ourselves to know.
My question is why do people fear death if they express they believe in God?
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