The Notion of Trinity (minority, mercy, religions, Islam)

[101c]

Originally Posted by godofthunder9010

Did I claim that the Gods were female?






Okay to answer your point before you make it -- AGAIN. Yes clearly there is significance in both the use of a plural word for Deity and the use of singular pronouns when referencing that Deity. Gods of the Old Testament was always explicitly plural. The use of singular pronouns and grammatical context are likely the result of two things:

• The multiple beings (the OT never specifies the number) comprising "Gods" were so completely unified that they were the same being for all intents and purposes. This is a significant departure from paganism where gods had different agendas, feuded against each other, etc. Multiple divine beings in complete agreement and infinitely unified: That was something new.
• The Biblical text was probably modified as Judaism became increasingly Unitarian over the centuries. But names and phrases referencing Deity weren't as likely to be tampered with, so the plurality of the word was never altered. But clear evidence debunking their notions that Unitarianism was absolute truth was left in the scriptural record.

There I go actually analyzing and digging deeper. Ultimately, you are quite right. Gods is referred to as male(s), not female(s).

thank you for your response. finally someone speaking with some sense. but, you said this, "Gods of the Old Testament was always explicitly plural". understand me clearly. God is a plurality in "SHARING", not in separate individuals as in many god(s). no, please understand what I'm say here about God, God is ONE, who shared "HIMSELF" in flesh. not a separate being, not a division, nor a copy. but the same being, or Spirit, "shared" in flesh equally. that's the diversity. Philippians 2:6 supports this. the word "form" there in the verse, indicate NATURE. and that NATURE was "SHARED" in flesh, and blood. to support this argument the root of the Greek word for nature, "Form", is
G3313 μέρος meros (mer'-os) n.
1. a division or share
there is our answer. JESUS Christ is the SHARE of God in FLESH. God shared himself, equally in flesh. supportive scripture, John 1:11 "He came unto his own, and his own received him not”. STOP, who CAME?, “HE”, who is the “he”?, answer, Isaiah 35:4 "Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he (THERE IS THE HE). he will come and save you”. the “he” is God, both in Isaiah 35:4 and John 1:11. now how did, “he” God come?, made Flesh, John 1:14 "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth”. the Word was made FLESH, or was "BORN", this is what is ment by "Emmanuel", God with us. he was with us in a body, (flesh and blood), there is the “DIVERSITY”, born of a woman, the “OFFSPRING”. G1085 γένος genos (ghen'-os) n.
1. kin
KJV: born, country(-man), diversity, generation, kind(-red), nation, offspring, stock
as Kindred man "he" God, in flesh is our redeemer, and SAVIOUR. that the "he will save us". do you follow me, as to what I saying in Isaiah 35:4.

God had to come in a nature that #1 he could die from. #2 set the example in for us to follow, and #3, obtain the glorification in NEWNESS OF SPIRIT, meaning in the resurrection of the body.

if you have any question, I'll try my best in the name of the Lord Jesus to answer you as best as I can.

[Daniel O. McClellan]

Originally Posted by 101c

thank you for your response. finally someone speaking with some sense. but, you said this, "Gods of the Old Testament was always explicitly plural". understand me clearly. God is a plurality in "SHARING", not in separate individuals as in many god(s).

That's simply not true. There is no text anywhere in the Old Testament that is even the least bit suggestive of "sharing." One can only find it if they refuse to find anything else. That concept simply did not exist in the minds of any ancient Israelites or Jews. I have spoken and written extensively about this topic, but you can find a succinct and helpful discussion in this segment of one of my graduate theses. The Hebrew Bible frequently acknowledges the existence and even benevolence of numerous other gods.

Originally Posted by 101c

no, please understand what I'm say here about God, God is ONE, who shared "HIMSELF" in flesh. not a separate being, not a division, nor a copy. but the same being, or Spirit, "shared" in flesh equally. that's the diversity. Philippians 2:6 supports this. the word "form" there in the verse, indicate NATURE.

It absolutely does not such thing. μορφη refers to appearance. BDAG defines it as "form, outward appearance, shape." The TLG has "form, shape, fashion, appearance, outward form." Even Thayer's, that outdated and largely unhelpful lexicon has, "the form by which a person or thing strikes the vision, external appearance."

What a laughable bit of naive dogmatism.

Originally Posted by 101c

and that NATURE was "SHARED" in flesh, and blood. to support this argument the root of the Greek word for nature, "Form", is
G3313 μέρος meros (mer'-os) n.

That's not the word used in Phil 2:6, and it appears nowhere at all in the New Testament in reference to Jesus' identity or relationship to God. Just what kind of dishonest nonsense are you trying to pull?

Originally Posted by 101c

1. a division or share
there is our answer. JESUS Christ is the SHARE of God in FLESH.

Except that word isn't used in any verse anywhere in the Bible in reference to God's identity or Jesus' identity.

Originally Posted by 101c

God shared himself, equally in flesh. supportive scripture, John 1:11 "He came unto his own, and his own received him not”. STOP, who CAME?, “HE”, who is the “he”?, answer, Isaiah 35:4 "Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he (THERE IS THE HE). he will come and save you”. the “he” is God,

So you're asking what the antecedent of the pronoun in John 1:11 is, and you just pick out a verse from the Old Testament that uses the pronoun "he" in reference to God and just arbitrarily insist that identifies the antecedent? What if I point to any one of a number of verses that use "he" in reference to prophets, angels, or Satan "coming" to do something? Good grief, this is shockingly ignorant nonsense.

Originally Posted by 101c

both in Isaiah 35:4 and John 1:11. now how did, “he” God come?, made Flesh, John 1:14 "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth”. the Word was made FLESH, or was "BORN", this is what is ment by "Emmanuel", God with us. he was with us in a body, (flesh and blood), there is the “DIVERSITY”, born of a woman, the “OFFSPRING”. G1085 γένος genos (ghen'-os) n.
1. kin
KJV: born, country(-man), diversity, generation, kind(-red), nation, offspring, stock
as Kindred man "he" God, in flesh is our redeemer, and SAVIOUR. that the "he will save us". do you follow me, as to what I saying in Isaiah 35:4.

God had to come in a nature that #1 he could die from. #2 set the example in for us to follow, and #3, obtain the glorification in NEWNESS OF SPIRIT, meaning in the resurrection of the body.

if you have any question, I'll try my best in the name of the Lord Jesus to answer you as best as I can.

Goo grief, this is just horrifyingly dishonest and misleading. You're not reading scripture, you're tearing it apart and putting it back together to say what you want it to say. This is just awful eisegesis.

[101c]

Originally Posted by Daniel O. McClellan

That's simply not true. There is no text anywhere in the Old Testament that is even the least bit suggestive of "sharing." One can only find it if they refuse to find anything else. That concept simply did not exist in the minds of any ancient Israelites or Jews. I have spoken and written extensively about this topic, but you can find a succinct and helpful discussion in this segment of one of my graduate theses. The Hebrew Bible frequently acknowledges the existence and even benevolence of numerous other gods.
.

I will reproof that. Zechariah 13:7 "Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones”.
notice the word, “Fellow”. H5997 עָמִיתּ `amiyth (aw-meeth') n-m.
1. companionship
2. hence (concretely) a comrade or kindred man
KJV: another, fellow, neighbour.
see how the KJV can rendered it, “ANOTHER”. that the basic of the Greek word G243 Allos, or another. Jesus Christ is God’s “ANOTHER”. scripture, Isaiah 40:25 "To whom then will ye liken me, or shall I be equal? saith the Holy One”. answer JESUS the Christ himself in flesh, supportive scripture, Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

now as for the Jewish mind understanding it, scripture, Titus 2:10 "Not purloining, but shewing all good fidelity; that they may adorn the doctrine of God our Saviour in all things”. who is the Saviour here?, GOD. now just a few verses down, same chapter, Titus 2:13 "Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ”. now tell us dan o. who is the SAVIOUR?. this is a Jewish mind speaking.

[101c]

Zechariah 13:7 can be read this way in light of revelation, "Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my “ANOTHER”, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones”.
now, notice the title “LORD” of Host, listen, Isaiah 44:6 "Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God”. LORD the King of Israel, and the LORD of hosts?. is this two LORDS, NO, one LORD, two titles. listen this LORD the King of Israel is also the First and the Last which are titles our Lord JESUS that he holds.

LORD the King of Israel, and the LORD of hosts is another example of "Diversity" in the OT

[101c]

Now the “diversity” in the LORD of host is the Lord, scripture, Isaiah 6:1 "In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple”. Lord here, with the “L” Capitalized is H136 אֲדוֹנָי 'Adonay (ad-o-noy') n-m.
1. the Lord (used as a proper name of God only)
am emphatic form of H113]
KJV: (my) Lord.
notice what the definition says, “used as a proper name of God only”. now, lets continue with Isaiah 6. verse 2 Above it stood the seraphims: each one had six wings; with twain he covered his face, and with twain he covered his feet, and with twain he did fly 3 And one cried unto another, and said, Holy, holy, holy, is the LORD of hosts: the whole earth is full of his glory”. this is the Glory that Isaiah saw, and the Glory that John recorded in chapter 12 and verse 41.

[Daniel O. McClellan]

Originally Posted by 101c

I will reproof that.

No you won't.

Also, I noticed you're just completely ignoring the fact that you completely misidentified the word used in Phil 2:6 and then insisted another word was relevant when it absolutely wasn't. You're just slipping on past those misuses of the evidence. As I said, you're just throwing stuff against the wall without at all knowing if it's legitimate or not.

Originally Posted by 101c

Zechariah 13:7 "Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones”.
notice the word, “Fellow”. H5997 עָמִיתּ `amiyth (aw-meeth') n-m.
1. companionship
2. hence (concretely) a comrade or kindred man
KJV: another, fellow, neighbour.
see how the KJV can rendered it, “ANOTHER”. that the basic of the Greek word G243 Allos, or another.

Actually the Greek translation there is just ἄνδρα πολίτην μου, "man citizen of me." The word doesn't mean "another," irrespective of how the KJV translates it.

Originally Posted by 101c

Jesus Christ is God’s “ANOTHER”.

But this scripture has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with Christ or any messiah.

Originally Posted by 101c

scripture, Isaiah 40:25 "To whom then will ye liken me, or shall I be equal? saith the Holy One”. answer JESUS the Christ himself in flesh, supportive scripture, Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

You can't just choose any answer you want for a rhetorical question. Good heavens.

Originally Posted by 101c

now as for the Jewish mind understanding it, scripture, Titus 2:10 "Not purloining, but shewing all good fidelity; that they may adorn the doctrine of God our Saviour in all things”. who is the Saviour here?, GOD. now just a few verses down, same chapter, Titus 2:13 "Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ”. now tell us dan o. who is the SAVIOUR?. this is a Jewish mind speaking.

Your translation is bad. God is the savior here, but ἐπιφάνειαν τῆς δόξης is not "glorious appearance," it's the "appearance of the glory of . . ." Jesus is "the glory of our great God and Savior." You could alter the wording like this: "the appearance of Jesus, the glory of our great God and Savior."

[101c]

Originally Posted by Daniel O. McClellan

No you won't.

Also, I noticed you're just completely ignoring the fact that you completely misidentified the word used in Phil 2:6 and then insisted another word was relevant when it absolutely wasn't. You're just slipping on past those misuses of the evidence. As I said, you're just throwing stuff against the wall without at all knowing if it's legitimate or not.



Actually the Greek translation there is just ἄνδρα πολίτην μου, "man citizen of me." The word doesn't mean "another," irrespective of how the KJV translates it.





But this scripture has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with Christ or any messiah.



You can't just choose any answer you want for a rhetorical question. Good heavens.



Your translation is bad. God is the savior here, but ἐπιφάνειαν τῆς δόξης is not "glorious appearance," it's the "appearance of the glory of . . ." Jesus is "the glory of our great God and Savior." You could alter the wording like this: "the appearance of Jesus, the glory of our great God and Savior."

I still reproof that also, H5997 עָמִיתּ`amiyth. http://biblehub.com/hebrew/5997.htm
NAS Exhaustive Concordance

[101c]

I believe you better use your cross reference on Zec, 13:7 it reference Jesus Christ

[101c]

God came as a man, FLESH, listen again, John 1:11 "He came unto his own, and his own received him not”. and the Word was MADE FLESH. God came as a MAN, the “ANOTHER”, or the offspring, or the "diversity".

see dan o. your exegesis of the scriptures is poor, or lousy, or worst yet, than what you said of me as my eisegesis of scriptures. well the kittle is calling the pot black. (smile). now ant that something. at least my scriptures are true.

[Daniel O. McClellan]

Originally Posted by 101c

I still reproof that also, H5997 עָמִיתּ `amiyth. Strong's Hebrew: 5997. ?????? (amith) -- an associate, fellow, relation
NAS Exhaustive Concordance

Completely and totally meaningless. I know what the word means. Just pointing to an outdated lexicon entry is absolutely meaningless.