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Old 12-22-2014, 08:44 AM
 
10,076 posts, read 5,696,952 times
Reputation: 2891

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
There is no ship going down. speak for something rather than against something. The message is one of peace on earth and goodwill to all men. Yes goodwill to those you call defiled, there is nothing unclean if you have eyes to judge righteously rather than by appearance.

He came and preached peace to those that were near and those that are afar off, why are you preaching against those he preached peace to?. The message of condemnation as never worked, all its produced is more children of hell. Repent and give it up and believe Jesus Christ.
The problem with your brand of Christianity is that it is one sided. You want to conveniently ignore the other side to Jesus, the side that took a rock hard stance against sin. Here are the actual words from Jesus:


And if your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than to have two feet and be thrown into hell. Mark 9:45


That's harse and cold, but it's the truth. NOTHING on earth is worth risking your salvation. Now I don't know if Jesus was talking literally here, but his point either way is warning people to stay away from sin. Do whatever it takes to follow the path of righteousness.

Now you can go on using words like love and peace to paint your side as the glowing righteous one, but in reality, it dishonors Jesus to embrace and give a stamp approval on people living a sexually immorality lifestyle. He endured hours of extreme physical torture so all of humanity can have a way to escape sin's death penalty. Not as a means to keep on sinning freely.

 
Old 12-22-2014, 08:56 AM
 
Location: New England
37,337 posts, read 28,149,823 times
Reputation: 2742
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40 View Post
The problem with your brand of Christianity is that it is one sided. You want to conveniently ignore the other side to Jesus, the side that took a rock hard stance against sin. Here are the actual words from Jesus:


And if your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than to have two feet and be thrown into hell. Mark 9:45


That's harse and cold, but it's the truth. NOTHING on earth is worth risking your salvation. Now I don't know if Jesus was talking literally here, but his point either way is warning people to stay away from sin. Do whatever it takes to follow the path of righteousness.

Now you can go on using words like love and peace to paint your side as the glowing righteous one, but in reality, it dishonors Jesus to embrace and give a stamp approval on people living a sexually immorality lifestyle. He endured hours of extreme physical torture so all of humanity can have a way to escape sin's death penalty. Not as a means to keep on sinning freely.
Jesus never had another side. You see him chase a few thieves out the temple and think he's mad with the world while ignoring such an amazing statement from the book of John that if all that he did was recorded, all the books in the world could not contain all the wonderful things he did. When he says things like cut of your hand or gouge your eye out if it is sins, he is not saying your brothers, he is saying yours, and whatsmore the essence of what Jesus is saying here is "look keep your eyes off your brother, because if you want to start fault finding, i can find plenty in you if i was that way inclined, comprehendo ".

Last edited by pcamps; 12-22-2014 at 10:25 AM..
 
Old 12-22-2014, 09:20 AM
 
14,917 posts, read 13,059,599 times
Reputation: 4828
Quote:
Originally Posted by other99 View Post
Yes there is Hell. It is for God to judge who goes to Heaven and Hell
If God sends you to Hell, what does that say about how he feels about you?

Is condemning one to Hell a loving acting, or an act born of hatred?
 
Old 12-22-2014, 10:35 AM
 
951 posts, read 1,048,589 times
Reputation: 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archmage View Post



I need to do some more research on this passage, but are you suggesting (via Paul) that we should allow sinners to continue sinning so that they may destroy themselves enough spiritually that they'd seek God?
Here is another piece to the puzzle:

Matthew 13:
10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
17 For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.


 
Old 12-22-2014, 10:48 AM
 
951 posts, read 1,048,589 times
Reputation: 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Jesus never had another side. You see him chase a few thieves out the temple and think he's mad with the world while ignoring such an amazing statement from the book of John that if all that he did was recorded, all the books in the world could not contain all the wonderful things he did. When he says things like cut of your hand or gouge your eye out if it is sins, he is not saying your brothers, he is saying yours, and whatsmore the essence of what Jesus is saying here is "look keep your eyes off your brother, because if you want to start fault finding, i can find plenty in you if i was that way inclined, comprehendo ".
No, You have to repent of your sins to be in the Kingdom of God. King David had to repent of his sins and he will be in the Kingdom ruling over Israel under Christ. The apostles all had to repent of their sins and they will be ruling over each of the 12 tribes of Israel. Paul had to repent of all of his sins and he will probably given some high position in God's Government when it is set up on this earth at the Return of Christ.

If you are teaching conversion without repentance then you are wrong. The subject of this thread is a sin against God which one must repent of or else you really are not being called by God to Christ because it is God who will lead you to repentance and bring you to Christ. Otherwise, you are just entertaining tares who will be destroyed in the end unless they repent in the Great White Throne Judgement.

Last edited by tthttf; 12-22-2014 at 11:28 AM..
 
Old 12-22-2014, 10:56 AM
 
Location: New England
37,337 posts, read 28,149,823 times
Reputation: 2742
Quote:
Originally Posted by tthttf View Post
No, You have to repent of your sins to be in the Kingdom of God. King David had to repent of his sins and he will be in the Kingdom ruling over Israel under Christ. The apostles all had to repent of their sins and they will be ruling over each of the 12 tribes of Israel. Paul had to repent of all of his sins and he will probably given some high position in God's Government when it is set up on this earth at the Return of Christ.

If you are teaching conversion without repentance then you are wrong. The subject of this thread is a sin against God which one must repent of or else you really are not being called by God to Christ because it is God who will lead you to repentance and bring you to Christ. Otherwise, you are just entertaining tares who will be destroyed in the end unless they repent in the Resurrection.
No, you turn to the goodness of God and you learn how not to miss the mark. You have the horse before the cart and do not know the good news of the gospel of peace. Repent from condemning sinners and believe Jesus Christ for yourself.
 
Old 12-22-2014, 11:25 AM
 
951 posts, read 1,048,589 times
Reputation: 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
No, you turn to the goodness of God and you learn how not to miss the mark. You have the horse before the cart and do not know the good news of the gospel of peace. Repent from condemning sinners and believe Jesus Christ for yourself.
No. Christ said He did not come to destroy the law or the prophets. You must keep the two Great Commandments which are magnified in the Ten Commandments: the first 4 showing love to God and the last 6 showing love to neighbor.

A man can love a woman but if she is some other man's wife and they commit adultery then this is not love but sin -- the sin of adultery -- the 7th Commandment and adultery is not love towards one neighbor as this adulterer is wrecking this man's family and threatening the lives of the adulterer and the adulteress and may cause her husband to have to go to jail for killing the adulterer in a fit or rage.

Without God's law as the guide to man's interaction with God or his neigjhbor one cannot express proper love. And just what is the love of God?

1 John 5:3
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Are the TRUE Saints the ones that keep the Commandments of God? Most certainly!

Revelation 14:
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
 
Old 12-22-2014, 11:32 AM
 
Location: New England
37,337 posts, read 28,149,823 times
Reputation: 2742
Quote:
Originally Posted by tthttf View Post
No. Christ said He did not come to destroy the law or the prophets. You must keep the two Great Commandments which are magnified in the Ten Commandments: the first 4 showing love to God and the last 6 showing love to neighbor.

A man can love a woman but if she is some other man's wife and they commit adultery then this is not love but sin -- the sin of adultery -- the 7th Commandment and adultery is not love towards one neighbor as this adulterer is wrecking this man's family and threatening the lives of the adulterer and the adulteress and may cause her husband to have to go to jail for killing the adulterer in a fit or rage.

Without God's law as the guide to man's interaction with God or his neigjhbor one cannot express proper love. And just what is the love of God?

1 John 5:3
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Are the TRUE Saints the ones that keep the Commandments of God? Most certainly!

Revelation 14:
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Well i guess you might as well put to death those evil in your eyes homosexuals after you have done stoning the adulterers. The 2nd greatest commandment in action
 
Old 12-22-2014, 11:59 AM
 
32,516 posts, read 37,048,154 times
Reputation: 32572
Quote:
Originally Posted by tthttf View Post

A man can love a woman but if she is some other man's wife and they commit adultery then this is not love but sin -- the sin of adultery -- the 7th Commandment and adultery is not love towards one neighbor as this adulterer is wrecking this man's family and threatening the lives of the adulterer and the adulteress and may cause her husband to have to go to jail for killing the adulterer in a fit or rage.
Once again.....we see the blame placed on the woman. The husband, who apparently doesn't know about the "Thou shalt not kill" thing, can point his finger at....her.

Husband: "She made me do it! She caused this!!"

The crowd roars:

"Adulteress! Stone her!!!!"

Enter Jesus from stage left..... Then he gets ignored by all the people who want to yell, "Sinner!" because they've decided they know more about these things than Jesus possibly could.

Last edited by DewDropInn; 12-22-2014 at 12:18 PM..
 
Old 12-22-2014, 01:05 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
10,688 posts, read 7,671,234 times
Reputation: 4674
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40 View Post
The problem with your brand of Christianity is that it is one sided. You want to conveniently ignore the other side to Jesus, the side that took a rock hard stance against sin. Here are the actual words from Jesus:


And if your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than to have two feet and be thrown into hell. Mark 9:45


That's harse and cold, but it's the truth. NOTHING on earth is worth risking your salvation. Now I don't know if Jesus was talking literally here, but his point either way is warning people to stay away from sin. Do whatever it takes to follow the path of righteousness.

Now you can go on using words like love and peace to paint your side as the glowing righteous one, but in reality, it dishonors Jesus to embrace and give a stamp approval on people living a sexually immorality lifestyle. He endured hours of extreme physical torture so all of humanity can have a way to escape sin's death penalty. Not as a means to keep on sinning freely.
Seeing as how Jesus spoke harshly ONLY to Pharisees, the religious zealots of that day, I suspect the highlighted verse was aimed at them.

So perhaps the religious zealots of THIS day and age should take heed.

Yeah, Jesus shouldn't have spent so much time with sinners that he would be called a glutton and winebibber. Just imagine what God thinks of that kind of sin!
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