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10-22-2014, 08:27 AM
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17,966 posts, read 13,187,750 times
Reputation: 992
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If your theological ideas contradict this:
"God will have all mankind to be saved for Christ gave Himself a ransom for all" (see 1 Timothy 2:4-6),
and
"God IS the Saviour of all mankind, especially them that believe. These things charge and teach" (1 Timothy 4:10,11)
then it is a sure thing that your theology is not correct.
If your church or pastor tells you "God will NOT save all mankind even if Christ ransomed all" and "God is NOT the Saviour of all mankind" then you should find a church or pastor that teaches that which God tells him to charge and teach.
Why do you think your pastor has never told you that which God tells him to charge and teach?
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10-22-2014, 08:35 AM
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14,111 posts, read 5,283,219 times
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Jesus was not ransom. He was a lesson.
Yes, if you believe that some "ideas" like truth, justice, and liberty for all men are more important than your Childs life then understand the story of Abraham. If you do, then society as we think it is will advance. We all will be saved. What slows this transformation unto Christ are notions that the body is the most important thing. "the literal body of Christ" or the "literal religion" hold the dove by its tail.
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10-22-2014, 08:55 AM
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4,220 posts, read 2,130,026 times
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No one knows the son except the Father and no one knows the Father except the son and to whomever the son will reveal Him.
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10-22-2014, 09:17 AM
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Location: Gulf Coast Texas
29,670 posts, read 16,085,647 times
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Must be nice to carry around a Bible that you can laminate and put in your wallet.
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10-22-2014, 09:19 AM
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Location: USA
16,327 posts, read 8,444,257 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC
Must be nice to carry around a Bible that you can laminate and put in your wallet.
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Or to have Christ written on your heart? |
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10-22-2014, 09:35 AM
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1,606 posts, read 978,289 times
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This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave Himself as a ransom for all, the testimony given at the proper time. (1 Timothy 2:3-6) There is nothing in this passage that even remotely supports that all will be saved. Likewise, Jesus can be a ransom accessible by all and given for all, but there's no scripture that supports that it will be accepted by all and a litany of Scripture that supports the opposite, that many will reject Christ and will perish and few will accept His ransom and live eternally in heaven.
'As I live,' saith the Lord GOD, 'I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live.' (Ezekiel 3:11) |
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10-22-2014, 09:39 AM
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Location: Walt Disney World
16,830 posts, read 9,204,227 times
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Holy Scripture consists of more than just 1 Tim. 2 & 4. There is overwhelming scriptural evidence that proves Universalism is false.
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10-22-2014, 09:42 AM
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17,966 posts, read 13,187,750 times
Reputation: 992
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JJ_Maxx
This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave Himself as a ransom for all, the testimony given at the proper time. (1 Timothy 2:3-6) There is nothing in this passage that even remotely supports that all will be saved. Likewise, Jesus can be a ransom accessible by all and given for all, but there's no scripture that supports that it will be accepted by all and a litany of Scripture that supports the opposite, that many will reject Christ and will perish and few will accept His ransom and live eternally in heaven. 'As I live,' saith the Lord GOD, 'I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live.' (Ezekiel 3:11) |
There is everything in the passage that supports all will be saved.
Isa_46:10 Telling from the beginning, the hereafter, and from aforetime, what has not yet been done.
Saying, `All My counsel shall be confirmed, and all My desire will I do.'"
Also, one who has been ransomed must be freed. Check out the entire Old Testament on this truth.
All mankind were ransomed by Christ and therefore "God will have all mankind to be saved."
Eph_1:11 in Him in Whom our lot was cast also, being designated beforehand according to the
purpose of the One Who is operating all in accord with the counsel of His will,"
The same Greek word for "will" in Ephesians 1:11 is the same Greek word for "will" in 1 Timothy 2:4.
Ezekiel is not dealing with all mankind but just the nation of Israel. Also it is concerning dying, not eternally frying someone.
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10-22-2014, 09:44 AM
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17,966 posts, read 13,187,750 times
Reputation: 992
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej
Holy Scripture consists of more than just 1 Tim. 2 & 4. There is overwhelming scriptural evidence that proves Universalism is false.
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jimmiej, that doesn't matter. God specifically told us to charge and teach that God will have all mankind to be saved and that God is the Saviour of all mankind.
So if there is, according to you, evidence that refutes God saving all mankind then that evidence is patently WRONG.
So, jimmiej, does your minister charge and teach God will save all or that "God will NOT save all"? |
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10-22-2014, 09:51 AM
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1,606 posts, read 978,289 times
Reputation: 661
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius
There is everything in the passage that supports all will be saved.
Isa_46:10 Telling from the beginning, the hereafter, and from aforetime, what has not yet been done.
Saying, `All My counsel shall be confirmed, and all My desire will I do.'"
Also, one who has been ransomed must be freed. Check out the entire Old Testament on this truth.
All mankind were ransomed by Christ and therefore "God will have all mankind to be saved."
Eph_1:11 in Him in Whom our lot was cast also, being designated beforehand according to the
purpose of the One Who is operating all in accord with the counsel of His will,"
The same Greek word for "will" in Ephesians 1:11 is the same Greek word for "will" in 1 Timothy 2:4.
Ezekiel is not dealing with all mankind but just the nation of Israel. Also it is concerning dying, not eternally frying someone.
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The term 'will' in those passages means desire and we know that all things that God desires does not come to pass, as much as you would like it to. God does not will, or desire, that we sin but last I checked we do. Unless you wish to make an argument that God desires that we sin, in which case your theology needs more than a tweaking.
The same Greek word used in 1 Timothy 2:4 is also the same used here in Luke 13:31, yes?
Just at that time some Pharisees approached, saying to Him, “Go away, leave here, for Herod wants to kill You.” (Luke 13:31) Indeed it is. God desires that all men be saved, but not all men will be saved.
There is just no argument. As someone said earlier, the Scripture is not made up of one or two verses, but the whole of God's Word and must be accepted wholly.
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