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Jjanelle144, what the tread proves as much as anything I think is that many sincere Christian folks have no clear idea of the reasons why other Christians may reasonably and rightly venerate and honor (but NOT worship) Mary without committing idolatry or in anyway reducing the worship of God or acknowledging the sole Lordship of Christ her Son. IOW, loving Mary for her part in God's plan is no hindrance to glorifying He who made that plan (God the Father) and He who fulfilled that plan through the Sacrifice of the Cross (Jesus). her submission and obedience to God is a beautiful example for Christians who also seek to follow her Son (and thus a real problem for Satan).
Last edited by georgeinbandonoregon; 02-06-2015 at 04:56 PM..
Reason: more information.
Sometimes, understandably, the grief of sin, the bare conscience of it exposed in the light of
such purity, knowing all she endured, all she bore, and all her perfection (the most perfect creature
that ever existed, and ever shall exist is she; for her Son was not a creature), makes one intimidated
to approach her in supplication. Yet, as the child who has done wrong still pines for the mother, that
is what we must do, because if we cannot approach her, then we cannot approach Her Son.
Two books I would recommend are The Glories of Mary by St. Alphonsus de Liguori and
Of Mary There is Never Enough by William L. Biersach.
Syncretistically, it brought confusion, not unity.
And, I don't see it as being free from error?
Quote:
Originally Posted by georgeinbandonoregon
obviously you may believe what you want to believe (and luckily I too can believe what I want or feel I must as well)--the ultimate proof of this (and most anything else) is what tangible "fruits" result from that belief--and I think that's God's call and not ours. OTOH, can you point to ONE specific thing directly repugnant to God or Sacred Scripture that the Nicene Creed specifically teaches on the nature of Christ and of God for that matter----just one important thing that is ALSO attested as false by the majority of Christians of all denominations through time as well? please lets not bother ourselves with if either of us have problems (or not) with exactly which day a particular "holy day" (Christmas or Easter) is or is not observed and how---with such things is much time wasted and little light shed---even here, LOL). BTW, the word of God has always brought "division" into the world-setting brother against brother (see Luke 12:51 I think) so likely any thing associated with it like all those seemingly crazy doctrines---the Trinity for example, also defined and taught at Nicea because of much confusion, turmoil, and even bloodshed (see the "arian" heresy) will be a "stumbling block" to someone, sad to say. may God bless us both and help us not only know the truth but truly live it (and not beat each other up too badly while trying to find it). don't know if at the end of the day anybody (including ourselves) will be convinced of much except that we are both "fools in Christ" and that hope of both being "in Christ" fool or otherwise(or at least giving it our best shot with God's grace) will be a very good thing in and of itself.
When controversy divides an empire, you cannot control the people. A 17th century proverb: One man's meat is another man's poison.
In other words, the trinity concept, still separates the Church to this very day.
Discussing the mother of Jesus is a difficult subject for we evangelicals 40-45% former Catholics. First and foremost many non Catholics in their effort to downplay Mary's divinity, tiltles manifested over time by a faith wishing to honor her insult her role " a follower of Jesus, mother and wife.Yes since the church manufactured a icon a mediatrix ( mediator) they have un-
intentionally crossed the line between love and idolatry paganism and a perverted intercessor to prayer. " No one goes to the Father but by me" ...Jesus!!
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). don't know if at the end of the day anybody (including ourselves) will be convinced of much except that we are both "fools in Christ" and that hope of both being "in Christ" fool or otherwise(or at least giving it our best shot with God's grace) will be a very good thing in and of itself.
