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And I will put enmity
between you and the woman,
and between your offspring and hers;
he will crush your head,
and you will strike his heel.”
Now here's what Dr. Claude Mariottini, esteemed Old Testament scholar has to say about Genesis 3:15. Here's his resume:
Clearly Dr. Mariottini is no slack. He's a Christian minister and scholar of Old Testament interpretation and about Genesis 3:15 in his book Rereading the Biblical Text: Searching for Meaning and Understanding he contends the typical Christian reading is not supported by sound exegesis. Mariottini says the Hebrew word for seed, zera, is a collective noun with a plural meaning. At work here is the word seed is (1) the descendants of the woman and (2) the descendants of the serpent. So the Common English Bible and the Jewish TNK. Thus, “they will strike at your head and you shall strike at their heel.” Gerhard von Rad said there was no messianic prophecy in the original context.
So once again, as we've seen time and time again, we've got Mike and his cohorts on one side of the aisle screaming "It's prophetic!" and myself, Tired of the Nonsense, a whole cadre of Rabbis and scholars of the Old Testament on the other side screaming back "It's not!"
Yet another example of God's "infallible" word being so opaque and confusing as to leave us scratching our heads for another 20000 years.
Once again, God could easily have cleared up all the confusion He knew this passage would generate simply by inserting a word that indicated "savior of the human race" "Messiah" "deliverer" or something similar if He wanted this to be a reference to Jesus. But He didn't.
Clearly God NEVER intended this passage to refer to His Son coming to earth to die for our sins.
As you've been shown, the apostle Paul himself stated that Jesus was the seed. If you had bothered to actually read what was posted you would have seen the line of descent of the seed from the promise in Genesis 3:15 to the Messiah who is Jesus.
As you've been shown, the apostle Paul himself stated that Jesus was the seed. If you had bothered to actually read what was posted you would have seen the line of descent of the seed from the promise in Genesis 3:15 to the Messiah who is Jesus.
Gal.3:13
[16] Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
Yes, Jesus was a Jew. No argument. He was therefore the seed of Abraham. And Abraham was the seed of Adam and Eve, which, according to Genesis ARE WE ALL. Genesis is using the term "seed" to mean progeny. The word seed is used repeatedly in Genesis, but they are not references specifically to Jesus just because you have declared it to be so.
As you've been shown, the apostle Paul himself stated that Jesus was the seed. If you had bothered to actually read what was posted you would have seen the line of descent of the seed from the promise in Genesis 3:15 to the Messiah who is Jesus.
Mike, you just WILL NOT listen to reason:
Here's what John Calvin had to say about Genesis 3:15. CALVIN, one of them most respected theologians of his day and of the second millennium AD. Read it and weep.
…other interpreters take the seed for Christ, without controversy; as if it were said, that some one would arise from the seed of the woman who should wound the serpent’s head. Gladly would I give my suffrage in support of their opinion, but that I regard the word seed as too violently distorted by them; for who will concede that a collective noun is to be understood of one man only? Further, as the perpetuity of the contest is noted, so victory is promised to the human race through a continual succession of ages. I explain, therefore, the seed to mean the posterity of the woman generally. (Commentary on Genesis)
Get that? Calvin wishes with all his heart zera referred to a singular person (Jesus) but in his venerated opinion it does NOT. Zera is a collective pronoun referring to the human race.
Like I said, read it and weep You're wrong, wrong, WRONG!
Here's what John Calvin had to say about Genesis 3:15. CALVIN, one of them most respected theologians of his day and of the second millennium AD. Read it and weep.
…other interpreters take the seed for Christ, without controversy; as if it were said, that some one would arise from the seed of the woman who should wound the serpent’s head. Gladly would I give my suffrage in support of their opinion, but that I regard the word seed as too violently distorted by them; for who will concede that a collective noun is to be understood of one man only? Further, as the perpetuity of the contest is noted, so victory is promised to the human race through a continual succession of ages. I explain, therefore, the seed to mean the posterity of the woman generally. (Commentary on Genesis)
Get that? Calvin wishes with all his heart zera referred to a singular person (Jesus) but in his venerated opinion it does NOT. Zera is a collective pronoun referring to the human race.
Like I said, read it and weep You're wrong, wrong, WRONG!
As I said, the apostle Paul himself realized that the promise of the seed had its ultimate fulfillment in Jesus. This is shown in Galatians 3:16. Furthermore, Scriptural references tracing the descent of the seed to Jesus were provided. Here they are once again.
(2) Trace the theme of the promised “seed” from Genesis 3:15 to Galatians 3:15-16.
The salvation of man and the destruction of Satan was promised in the Garden of Eden (Genesis 3:15). The “seed of the woman” was later revealed to be the “seed” of Abraham (Genesis 12:1-3), of Isaac (Genesis 21:12; 25:19-26), of Jacob (Genesis 25:23; 27:27-29), and of Judah (Genesis 49:8-10). He was still later indicated to be the “seed” of David (2 Samuel 7:12-16). Further revelation indicated that He would both suffer for the sins of His people (Isaiah 52:13--53:12) and reign triumphantly as Israel’s King (Psalm 2, 110). He was to be both human (Genesis 3:15) and divine (Isaiah 9:6; Micah 5:2), born of a virgin (Isaiah 7:14) in the village of Bethlehem (Micah 5:2). Jesus of Nazareth was the promised “seed,” fulfilling all of the prophecies related to his birth, suffering, death and resurrection (Galatians 3:13-16). He was rejected by the leaders of Israel and proclaimed among the Gentiles. This same Jesus is coming again, to triumph over His enemies and to rule over all creation (Acts 2:22-36; 7:2-53).
As I said, the apostle Paul himself realized that the promise of the seed had its ultimate fulfillment in Jesus. This is shown in Galatians 3:16. Furthermore, Scriptural references tracing the descent of the seed to Jesus were provided. Here they are once again.
(2) Trace the theme of the promised “seed” from Genesis 3:15 to Galatians 3:15-16.
The salvation of man and the destruction of Satan was promised in the Garden of Eden (Genesis 3:15). The “seed of the woman” was later revealed to be the “seed” of Abraham (Genesis 12:1-3), of Isaac (Genesis 21:12; 25:19-26), of Jacob (Genesis 25:23; 27:27-29), and of Judah (Genesis 49:8-10). He was still later indicated to be the “seed” of David (2 Samuel 7:12-16). Further revelation indicated that He would both suffer for the sins of His people (Isaiah 52:13--53:12) and reign triumphantly as Israel’s King (Psalm 2, 110). He was to be both human (Genesis 3:15) and divine (Isaiah 9:6; Micah 5:2), born of a virgin (Isaiah 7:14) in the village of Bethlehem (Micah 5:2). Jesus of Nazareth was the promised “seed,” fulfilling all of the prophecies related to his birth, suffering, death and resurrection (Galatians 3:13-16). He was rejected by the leaders of Israel and proclaimed among the Gentiles. This same Jesus is coming again, to triumph over His enemies and to rule over all creation (Acts 2:22-36; 7:2-53).
This whole claim of yours is a perfect example of how people contrive to make things up and then declare them to be not only necessarily true, but obviously true. The Catholics for example have declared it to be official doctrine that Mary was perpetually a virgin. According to Catholic doctrine Joseph was an old man, incapable of sexual relations when he married the young maiden Mary. The siblings of Jesus mentioned by both Gospels Matthew and Mark were actually the children of Joseph's first marriage, and so were in actuality the half siblings of Jesus. Is any hint of this contained anywhere in scripture? Not a word of it. But Catholics consider the thought that God's perfect vessel was ever defiled to be "repugnant." So they made up a version of reality that satisfies them and then declared it to be true, just as you have done with the whole Garden of Eden mythology that you are promoting. We can read the passages you are quoting for ourselves however, so you hopping up and down declaring it to be obviously true is not only pointless, it helps to further discredit your conclusions entirely. Keep up the good work!
gal.3:13
[16] now to abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, and to thy seed, which is christ.
Yes, jesus was a jew. no argument. He was therefore the seed of abraham. And abraham was the seed of adam and eve, which, according to genesis are we all. Genesis is using the term "seed" to mean progeny. the word seed is used repeatedly in genesis, but they are not references specifically to jesus just because you have declared it to be so.
And I will put enmity
between you and the woman,
and between your offspring and hers;
he will crush your head,
and you will strike his heel.”
Now here's what Dr. Claude Mariottini, esteemed Old Testament scholar has to say about Genesis 3:15. Here's his resume:
Clearly Dr. Mariottini is no slack. He's a Christian minister and scholar of Old Testament interpretation and about Genesis 3:15 in his book Rereading the Biblical Text: Searching for Meaning and Understanding he contends the typical Christian reading is not supported by sound exegesis. Mariottini says the Hebrew word for seed, zera, is a collective noun with a plural meaning. At work here is the word seed is (1) the descendants of the woman and (2) the descendants of the serpent. So the Common English Bible and the Jewish TNK. Thus, “they will strike at your head and you shall strike at their heel.” Gerhard von Rad said there was no messianic prophecy in the original context.
So once again, as we've seen time and time again, we've got Mike and his cohorts on one side of the aisle screaming "It's prophetic!" and myself, Tired of the Nonsense, a whole cadre of Rabbis and scholars of the Old Testament on the other side screaming back "It's not!"
Yet another example of God's "infallible" word being so opaque and confusing as to leave us scratching our heads for another 20000 years.
Once again, God could easily have cleared up all the confusion He knew this passage would generate simply by inserting a word that indicated "savior of the human race" "Messiah" "deliverer" or something similar if He wanted this to be a reference to Jesus. But He didn't.
Clearly God NEVER intended this passage to refer to His Son coming to earth to die for our sins.
Jesus was the seed of both.
Of Eve and of the serpent, what he was not was the son of Adam. That's why it brought healing when people looked at a snake on a pole.
Where was the first word regarding humans needing a messiah...and
was it necessary, according to the
Bible for this messiah to die?
Where did it say first that man needed 'saving'?
Why? I mean really.
I know I'm being lazy and don't want to do the research.
Miss Hepburn. When reading Hosea did you see the Lily of th feild?
It's just as our Lord said. Not even Solomon was arrayed as such.
Think of our Lord as a faithfull Bridegroom.
And if one were open to the truth, it would be very easily read that the sin offering established by God in the OT was to point to Jesus ... then there is Jesus who said:
"Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up,
that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him.”
then if one were to really really use their efforts wantoning to see the truth rather than to continue in having enmity for the truth and for those who believe the truth, one could read the first promise of God's plan for a Messiah when it was said:
"And I will put enmity between you and the woman,
and between your offspring and hers;
he will crush your head,
and you will strike his heel.”
actually its they will crush your head and you will strike their heel...It's alluding to Israel...
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