U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 02-22-2016, 02:09 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,822 posts, read 9,810,005 times
Reputation: 1300

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
Samson killed himself when he brought down the temple of Dagon. Do you believe he is in hell? I sure don't. Hebrews 11:32 names him among the heroes of the faith.
Read carefully ... Samson is not said to have killed himself.

There are only six recorded cases of suicide in the Bible
Abimelech (Judges 9:52-54),
Saul (1 Samuel 31:4)
Saul's armor-bearer (1 Samuel 31:5)
Ahithophel (2 Samuel 17:23)
Zimri (1 Kings 16:15-20)
Judas Iscariot (Matthew 27:3-5

Samson didn't commit suicide because God the Holy Spirit did not inspire any writer to say such.
His death was not a selfish act of self destruction but a self-sacrificing act similar to that of a soldier who sacrifices himself for his fellow soldiers. His final act did not reflect despair and hopelessness but a prayerful trust in the true God.

For this reason he is mentioned among the people of faith in Hebrews 11:32. However, this was not the case with the other six that were mentioned above. They acted in despair and unbelief and forfeited any hope of heaven.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-22-2016, 02:47 PM
 
19,952 posts, read 12,966,493 times
Reputation: 1957
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
Read carefully ... Samson is not said to have killed himself.

There are only six recorded cases of suicide in the Bible
Abimelech (Judges 9:52-54),
Saul (1 Samuel 31:4)
Saul's armor-bearer (1 Samuel 31:5)
Ahithophel (2 Samuel 17:23)
Zimri (1 Kings 16:15-20)
Judas Iscariot (Matthew 27:3-5

Samson didn't commit suicide because God the Holy Spirit did not inspire any writer to say such.
His death was not a selfish act of self destruction but a self-sacrificing act similar to that of a soldier who sacrifices himself for his fellow soldiers. His final act did not reflect despair and hopelessness but a prayerful trust in the true God.

For this reason he is mentioned among the people of faith in Hebrews 11:32. However, this was not the case with the other six that were mentioned above. They acted in despair and unbelief and forfeited any hope of heaven.
I agree--his death was not a selfish act. He did what God enabled him to do. He knew though, that in destroying the temple he would die.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-22-2016, 03:50 PM
 
4,564 posts, read 2,265,910 times
Reputation: 337
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
Samson killed himself when he brought down the temple of Dagon. Do you believe he is in hell? I sure don't. Hebrews 11:32 names him among the heroes of the faith.
Absolutely Samson IS in hell, in hell with King David - Acts 2:34, and in hell with John the baptist - Matthew 11:11
Also, the day righteous Jesus died, Jesus went to hell - Acts 2:27; Psalm 16:10

They all went to the 'Bible's hell'. Not some non-biblical religious-myth hell of burning forever just taught as Scripture.
Jesus taught sleep in death - John 11:11-14, and so do the old Hebrew Scriptures - Psalms 115:17; 146:4. Ecc. 9:5
So, Jesus believed that while in biblical hell he would be in an unconscious sleep-like state until resurrected out of hell.
The first one to be resurrected out of biblical hell ( grave ) was Jesus - John 3:13; Acts 3:15; 13:30,37

Those of Hebrews chapter 11 still did Not see the fulfillment of the promise - Hebrews 11:13,39; Acts 24:15
God promised father Abraham that ALL families of earth will be blessed - Genesis 12:3
and that ALL nations of earth will be blessed - Genesis 22:18
Jesus will fulfill God's promise during his coming 1,000-year governmental rulership over earth.
Under Christ's millennium-long day of governing over earth mankind will see the blessing of Revelation 22:2
Mankind will see ( through Christ ) the return of the Genesis ' tree of life ' once again on earth for the healing of earth's nations.
Then we will see a happy-and-healthy physical resurrection for those of Hebrews chapter 11 besides King David ,John the Baptist and even the prophet Daniel 12:2,13.
In other words, No one who died before Jesus' died had a heavenly calling.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-22-2016, 05:01 PM
 
1,401 posts, read 390,349 times
Reputation: 781
Suicide, murder and all sins are what Jesus died on the cross for and HE finished that work with sin there once and for all. If you have put your total faith in Christ plus nothing (believer) and die by suicide you are still heaven bound, since salvation is not temporary or changed by what WE do but by what HE has already done.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-22-2016, 05:08 PM
 
Location: USA
3,009 posts, read 1,046,912 times
Reputation: 870
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calvert Hall '62 View Post
so sayeth the Catholic nuns in the 1950s. But what about the argument that a suicidal person is mentally-depressed to the point that he is not responsible?
What about the person with a terminal disease that wishes to avoid weeks or months of severe pain when the outcome is already certain? Does it really matter what a bunch of old biddies who smacked you with rods when you were a kid think?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-23-2016, 08:28 AM
 
Location: Northeastern US
14,070 posts, read 8,560,010 times
Reputation: 6003
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
I agree--his death was not a selfish act. He did what God enabled him to do. He knew though, that in destroying the temple he would die.
What we are saying then is that killing oneself can have different motives. The ones that come to mind are:

* Self sacrifice for the good of others (e.g., Samson)
* Choosing not to have more experiences because of quality-of-life issues
* Succumbing to depression / hopelessness

Most suicides fall under the last reason but there is some overlap among them all. For example depression and hopelessness ARE quality of life issues and ending your life because you are terminally ill with, say, bone cancer, can be self sacrifice as it will save your survivors huge medical bills.

As a consequence I am inclined to classify this as a personal choice issue except that in the last and most common category, disordered thinking often inhibits one from making rational choices.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-23-2016, 09:01 AM
 
Location: Southwestern, USA
12,619 posts, read 10,732,308 times
Reputation: 14851
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vf6cruiser View Post
Suicide, murder and all sins are what Jesus died on the cross for
and HE finished that work with sin there once and for all.
If you have put your total faith in Christ plus nothing (believer) and die by suicide you are still heaven bound, since salvation is not
temporary or changed by what WE do but by what HE has already done.
Now, this is someone who gets it.

I always think of the criminal to Jesus' right...he certainly didn't have to do much
to be guaranteed paradise that day! THAT is the power of God's love...one
crack, a sliver of belief and asking...and His love is right there.
God is all about love.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-23-2016, 02:14 PM
 
Location: GOVERNMENT of TRAITORS & NAZIS
20,551 posts, read 22,715,248 times
Reputation: 7625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn View Post
Now, this is someone who gets it.

I always think of the criminal to Jesus' right...he certainly didn't have to do much
to be guaranteed paradise that day! THAT is the power of God's love...one
crack, a sliver of belief and asking...and His love is right there.
God is all about love.


AND Jesus wasn't dead yet and the thief was granted FORGIVENESS!

It seems to me it is all about the HEART!!

IO find it rather strange that the organized church will run around shouting ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE, but when someone says it
is possible to know god outside the bible they scream NO IT IS NOT POSSIBLE...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2016, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
42 posts, read 15,931 times
Reputation: 56
Actually suicide as an act is mentioned rarely in the Bible and going to hell is not mentioned as punishment. thou shalt not kill is literally translated to you shall not commit murder.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2016, 04:17 PM
 
28,906 posts, read 45,202,743 times
Reputation: 45815
Suicide is the result of depression. Depression deserves our compassion and understanding.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top