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Old 03-04-2016, 10:38 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tired of the Nonsense View Post
It does raise the question of why Pilate, who turned the body over to Jesus' followers in the first place, would bother tasking a Roman Tribune with determining what happened to it?
There was a Roman guard placed on the tomb. They knew where he was buried, and they had soldiers guarding the tomb. That's why.
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Old 03-04-2016, 10:57 AM
 
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
There was a Roman guard placed on the tomb. They knew where he was buried, and they had soldiers guarding the tomb. That's why.
This might be a valid point if Gospel Matthew said anything about a Roman guard at the tomb. It does not.

Matt:27
[65] Pilate said unto them, Ye have a watch: go your way, make it as sure as ye can.


"YOU have a guard," Pilate tells the priests. "go ahead and make it as secure as you can." Pilate points out that the priests have their own guard, and gives them permission to guard the tomb. We see this occuring very clearly in the next verse.

[66] So they went, and made the sepulchre sure, sealing the stone, and setting a watch.

The priests set the watch. There is no mention of Roman guards here at all. Every bit of the scenario of a Roman Tribune checking into what happened to the body of Jesus based on Roman involvement is pure Christian fantasy.
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Old 03-04-2016, 12:41 PM
 
Location: louisville
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It is a MOVIE. Every historical movie takes some Liberty.

Christians: if it doesn't mesh with your literal understanding of the bible, it's a movie
Atheists/agnostics: if it helps you 'debunk' what over 2 billion view as an historical event, it's a movie
Historians: it's a movie

if one isn't interested in seeing it, then don't.
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Old 03-04-2016, 12:52 PM
 
19,952 posts, read 13,032,258 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tired of the Nonsense View Post
This might be a valid point if Gospel Matthew said anything about a Roman guard at the tomb. It does not.

Matt:27
[65] Pilate said unto them, Ye have a watch: go your way, make it as sure as ye can.


"YOU have a guard," Pilate tells the priests. "go ahead and make it as secure as you can." Pilate points out that the priests have their own guard, and gives them permission to guard the tomb. We see this occuring very clearly in the next verse.

[66] So they went, and made the sepulchre sure, sealing the stone, and setting a watch.

The priests set the watch. There is no mention of Roman guards here at all. Every bit of the scenario of a Roman Tribune checking into what happened to the body of Jesus based on Roman involvement is pure Christian fantasy.
You realize there are 3 other Gospels, right?
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Old 03-04-2016, 01:11 PM
 
Location: louisville
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
You realize there are 3 other Gospels, right?
I actually thought it was Matthew but maybe 'matt' is one of the gnostic gospels. Lol
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Old 03-04-2016, 01:25 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Stymie13 View Post
I actually thought it was Matthew but maybe 'matt' is one of the gnostic gospels. Lol
It's not uncommon to abbreviate names. I have quoted from "1 Corin" before on the powerpoint slides in church when I preach. Obviously, people realize I am referencing "1 Corinthians"
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Old 03-04-2016, 02:01 PM
 
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
You realize there are 3 other Gospels, right?
I certainly do. I have read them all quite thoroughly. If any of the other Gospels mention ANY guard of ANY type being placed at Joseph's personal newly constructed hand hewn tomb then please feel free to show us all just exactly where that might be mentioned, chapter and verse.
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Old 03-04-2016, 02:03 PM
 
19,952 posts, read 13,032,258 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tired of the Nonsense View Post
I certainly do. I have read them all quite thoroughly. If any of the other Gospels mention ANY guard of ANY type being placed at Joseph's personal newly constructed hand hewn tomb then please feel free to show us all just exactly where that might be mentioned, chapter and verse.
I apologize. I should have just looked it up to start with.

Matthew 27:65 "Pilate said to them, “You have a guard of soldiers. Go, make it as secure as you can.” 66 So they went and made the tomb secure by sealing the stone and setting a guard."
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Old 03-04-2016, 02:38 PM
 
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
I apologize. I should have just looked it up to start with.

Matthew 27:65 "Pilate said to them, “You have a guard of soldiers. Go, make it as secure as you can.” 66 So they went and made the tomb secure by sealing the stone and setting a guard."
Just as I have already indicated. There is no mention of Roman soldiers here at all. According to Gospel Matthew, the priests went out to the tomb and found the entrance to the tomb covered by a large stone. The priests then set their official seals on the stone, and set a guard of their own men.

"On the morrow, that followed the day of the preparation," the priests went to Pilate, asked for and received permission to guard the tomb.

Why?

Matt:27
[63] Saying, Sir, we remember that that deceiver said, while he was yet alive, After three days I will rise again.
[64] Command therefore that the sepulchre be made sure until the third day, lest his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people, He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first.


And so the priests secured the tomb. A case of locking the barn door after the horse was already gone as it turned out. The tomb proved to be empty the following morning. Because you see, the disciples of Jesus did not have to "come by night, and steal him away." The corpse of Jesus had been given to his followers by Pilate on Friday afternoon, and it was theirs to do with as they saw fit. Joseph's tomb was never intended to be the final resting place of Jesus. It was simply used as convenient place to wash and prepare the body "for the sepulchre was nigh at hand" (John 19:42) to the place where Jesus was crucified. The priests clearly took possession of a closed and empty tomb the next day. Subsequently the disciples absolutely did "say unto the people, He is risen from the dead" of course. And so the suspicions of the priests turned out to be entirely well founded.
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Old 03-04-2016, 03:14 PM
 
19,952 posts, read 13,032,258 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tired of the Nonsense View Post
Just as I have already indicated. There is no mention of Roman soldiers here at all. According to Gospel Matthew, the priests went out to the tomb and found the entrance to the tomb covered by a large stone. The priests then set their official seals on the stone, and set a guard of their own men.

"On the morrow, that followed the day of the preparation," the priests went to Pilate, asked for and received permission to guard the tomb.

Why?

Matt:27
[63] Saying, Sir, we remember that that deceiver said, while he was yet alive, After three days I will rise again.
[64] Command therefore that the sepulchre be made sure until the third day, lest his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people, He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first.


And so the priests secured the tomb. A case of locking the barn door after the horse was already gone as it turned out. The tomb proved to be empty the following morning. Because you see, the disciples of Jesus did not have to "come by night, and steal him away." The corpse of Jesus had been given to his followers by Pilate on Friday afternoon, and it was theirs to do with as they saw fit. Joseph's tomb was never intended to be the final resting place of Jesus. It was simply used as convenient place to wash and prepare the body "for the sepulchre was nigh at hand" (John 19:42) to the place where Jesus was crucified. The priests clearly took possession of a closed and empty tomb the next day. Subsequently the disciples absolutely did "say unto the people, He is risen from the dead" of course. And so the suspicions of the priests turned out to be entirely well founded.
Really? Did you not read the verse? Whose soldiers were they? Do you think they were Jewish?
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