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Old 04-15-2016, 05:30 PM
 
4,573 posts, read 2,267,926 times
Reputation: 338

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrhockney View Post
...which by that logic would mean EVERYBODY alive today as well including the unsaved which I don't think you agree with...Regarding not being the God of the dead as well, We'll just have to conveniently overlook the fact that the bible says that David said God would be there "in sheol" (the grave)..and the dead will rise...and God rules heaven too which last I checked are full of Angels and dead people...Yeah, rather than use bible gymnastics to explain away the use of the word 'all' in so many reconciliation verses, I tend to think God is God of ALL created things past, present, and future.
Yes, God is God of All created things.....
Does that have to mean All will serve God ?_____
Doesn't Matthew 20:28 say that Jesus' ransom covers MANY and does Not say All ?______
Was Jesus telling a lie about committing the unforgivable sin at Matthew 12:32 ?______
Doesn't the word ' impossible ' mean ' impossible ' as used at Hebrews 6:4-6 ?______
What happens at the soon coming ' time of separation ' on earth for the haughty ' goats '-___________ Matthew 25:46
Aren't they punished with ' everlasting destruction ' - 2nd Thess. 1:9 ______
Doesn't Jesus destroy Satan according to Hebrews 2:14 B ?_______
What are the two (2) choices presented to us at 2nd Peter 3:9 but either ' repent ' or ' perish ' ( be destroyed )
Who ends up destroyed forever according to Psalm 92:7 _______________________
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Old 04-16-2016, 02:43 PM
 
4,058 posts, read 1,454,729 times
Reputation: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrhockney View Post
...which by that logic would mean EVERYBODY alive today as well including the unsaved which I don't think you agree with...Regarding not being the God of the dead as well, We'll just have to conveniently overlook the fact that the bible says that David said God would be there "in sheol" (the grave)..and the dead will rise...and God rules heaven too which last I checked are full of Angels and dead people...Yeah, rather than use bible gymnastics to explain away the use of the word 'all' in so many reconciliation verses, I tend to think God is God of ALL created things past, present, and future.



Yes God is God to all--but he was referring to all who are allowed to enter his kingdom. Jesus taught--that will be Few from those who live to see Harmageddon arrive to the earth.
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Old 04-16-2016, 05:49 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,432,516 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjw47 View Post
You must have missed---God is God of the living, not the dead. He was referring to those still living--the living will amount to--ALL.
When Jesus said God is God of the living He was telling the Sadducees, who didn't believe in a resurrection, that there is need for a resurrection of the dead.

In Romans 5:12, death did not enter into only the believer but all mankind.

Likewise in Romans 5:18,19, due to what Adam did, not just believers were made sinners. All mankind were made sinners.

Likewise, in 1 Timothy 2:4-6, the subject is all mankind, not all believers. You are taking the Jehovah's Witness stance on this matter.
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Old 04-16-2016, 05:59 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,432,516 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4 View Post
Yes, God is God of All created things.....
Does that have to mean All will serve God ?_____
Doesn't Matthew 20:28 say that Jesus' ransom covers MANY and does Not say All ?______
Jesus gave His soul a ransom for MANY (Matthew 20:28). Jesus gave HIMSELF a ransom for all (humans) (1 Timothy 2:4-6) and it is based upon all mankind being ransomed which is the reason why "God will have all humans to be saved."

Quote:
Was Jesus telling a lie about committing the unforgivable sin at Matthew 12:32 ?______
No, He didn't lie. He said that "that sin won't be pardoned in this eon or in that (eon) which is impending."
Quote:
Doesn't the word ' impossible ' mean ' impossible ' as used at Hebrews 6:4-6 ?______
Doesn't "God will have all humans to be saved" mean that you are taking Hebrews 6:4-6 improperly?

Quote:
What happens at the soon coming ' time of separation ' on earth for the haughty ' goats '-___________ Matthew 25:46
They will only receive EONIAN chastening or "age-lasting chastening."

Quote:
Aren't they punished with ' everlasting destruction ' - 2nd Thess. 1:9 ______
No. Eonian destruction or age-lasting destruction. Jesus came to save he destroyed sheep of the house of Israel.

Quote:
Doesn't Jesus destroy Satan according to Hebrews 2:14 B ?_______
Here again, you misunderstand the idea of "destroy" to a Greek. Satan was not destroyed as we think. He will be cast into the abyss in the coming eon then let out to deceive the nations, and then later be cast into the lake of fire during the New Earth age.

Quote:
What are the two (2) choices presented to us at 2nd Peter 3:9 but either ' repent ' or ' perish ' ( be destroyed )
Again, "destroy, lost, perish" all use the same Greek word. Jesus, the good Shepherd will seed the lost/perished, destroyed sheep till He find them and save them.
Quote:
Who ends up destroyed forever according to Psalm 92:7 _______________________
Psa 92:7 The wicked bud like herbage, And all contrivers of lawlessness blossom, But only that they be exterminated until the future,

It is only UNTIL the future. "God really will have all humans to be saved because Christ really did ransom all humans (1 Tim.2:4-6).
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Old 04-17-2016, 12:22 PM
 
4,058 posts, read 1,454,729 times
Reputation: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
When Jesus said God is God of the living He was telling the Sadducees, who didn't believe in a resurrection, that there is need for a resurrection of the dead.

In Romans 5:12, death did not enter into only the believer but all mankind.

Likewise in Romans 5:18,19, due to what Adam did, not just believers were made sinners. All mankind were made sinners.

Likewise, in 1 Timothy 2:4-6, the subject is all mankind, not all believers. You are taking the Jehovah's Witness stance on this matter.



Maybe you should read what occurs at Har-mageddon. Every kingdom( govt, armies, supporters) will be mislead to stand in opposition to Gods king--they will be crushed( Dan 2:44)-- they will not be in graves to be resurrected- they will be eaten at the great feast.
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Old 04-17-2016, 12:31 PM
 
17,714 posts, read 8,875,130 times
Reputation: 1486
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjw47 View Post
Maybe you should read what occurs at Har-mageddon. Every kingdom (govt, armies, supporters) will be mislead to stand in opposition to Gods king--they will be crushed ( Dan 2:44)-- they will not be in graves to be resurrected- they will be eaten at the great feast.
Write a script and men will follow it, even when in error.
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Old 04-18-2016, 08:18 AM
 
34,507 posts, read 8,896,494 times
Reputation: 4790
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
When Jesus said God is God of the living He was telling the Sadducees, who didn't believe in a resurrection, that there is need for a resurrection of the dead.

In Romans 5:12, death did not enter into only the believer but all mankind.

Likewise in Romans 5:18,19, due to what Adam did, not just believers were made sinners. All mankind were made sinners.

Likewise, in 1 Timothy 2:4-6, the subject is all mankind, not all believers. You are taking the Jehovah's Witness stance on this matter.
Credit where it's due. You got that exactly right.
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Old 04-18-2016, 01:03 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,432,516 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRANSPONDER View Post
Credit where it's due. You got that exactly right.
Hi TRANSPONDER, I'm glad you get it. What I find interesting is that you, who by most "Christians" would consider you "hell bound" are the one who gets it and they don't.
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Old 04-18-2016, 01:10 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,432,516 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
When Jesus said God is God of the living He was telling the Sadducees, who didn't believe in a resurrection, that there is need for a resurrection of the dead.

In Romans 5:12, death did not enter into only the believer but all mankind.

Likewise in Romans 5:18,19, due to what Adam did, not just believers were made sinners. All mankind were made sinners.

Likewise, in 1 Timothy 2:4-6, the subject is all mankind, not all believers. You are taking the Jehovah's Witness stance on this matter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjw47 View Post
Maybe you should read what occurs at Har-mageddon. Every kingdom( govt, armies, supporters) will be mislead to stand in opposition to Gods king--they will be crushed( Dan 2:44)-- they will not be in graves to be resurrected- they will be eaten at the great feast.
Dear kjw47, I have read the Bible more times than I can remember. I know what occurs in that battle.

Just because they are graveless, does not mean irremediableness. We understand that Revelation 20:13 states "And the sea gives up the dead in it, and death and Hades (i.e. the unseen) give up the dead in them. And they were condemned, each in accord with their acts."

So the ones not interred in a grave are just represented by "Death." They are all condemned. But we must not read into the word "condemned" a sense of irremediableness. They are judged and then sent back to death until death is abolished and then God will be All in all. See 1 Corinthians 15:22-28.

"The Son of mankind came to seek and to save that which was lost"--not to seek only, but to save (Luke 19:10). How many are lost? All! Then that is the number He will save, for He will never be disappointed.

Last edited by Eusebius; 04-18-2016 at 01:55 PM..
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Old 04-18-2016, 03:13 PM
 
741 posts, read 271,341 times
Reputation: 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjw47 View Post
Maybe you should read what occurs at Har-mageddon. Every kingdom( govt, armies, supporters) will be mislead to stand in opposition to Gods king--they will be crushed( Dan 2:44)-- they will not be in graves to be resurrected- they will be eaten at the great feast.
Kjw, save your time my friend. These folks have made up their own translation rules from Greek to English. Those that do such things the Bible warns us at 1 Timothy 2:14, 16, 23 to avoid it. It's a waste of time and leads to nothing good. If they want to change the translation, let them have it. There has been enough defense of God's Word on this thread and if there is no agreement that the Bible has been accurately translated then there is no reason to discuss the Bible. Just as long as you're not falling for it my friend, that is all that matters.
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