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Old 04-28-2016, 09:38 AM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,436,374 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Wrong again. I believe in Christ, Pharisees did not. They had Him killed.

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life"

And the same message is repeated, and repeated, and repeated......

Anyone who does not understand it, is in denial, or is willfully rejecting the truth.
You forgot to post John 3:17 which shows God saving all mankind:

John 3:16-17 For thus God loves the world, so that He gives His only-begotten Son, that everyone who is believing in Him should not be perishing, but may be having life eonian." (17) For God does not dispatch His Son into the world that He should be judging the world, but that the world may be saved through Him."

The "may" in verse 17 is not the "may" of doubt but is a subjunctive which is dependent upon what went before. Here is an example of the subjunctive:

I have a pen in my hand. I will loose my grip on the pen so that it "may" be falling. The falling of the pen is dependent upon my loosening my grip on it. It will surely fall should I do so.

Likewise the saving of the world is dependent upon God sending His Son into the world. Since He did do that, the world will be saved.

Furthermore, your bolded phrase "that whoever believes in him" does not prove free-will salvation. In fact I have already posted that no one is saved by their own will but by God's will:

Joh_1:13 who were begotten, not of bloods, neither of the will of the flesh, neither of the will of a man, but of God."

So one should understand that "whoever believes in him" is done so due to God willing that such a one believe in Him. It is just that simple.
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Old 04-28-2016, 09:41 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,518 posts, read 31,895,350 times
Reputation: 9412
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
You forgot to post John 3:17
You forgot verse 18: Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.

You are in denial, or willfully ignoring what Jesus taught.
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Old 04-28-2016, 09:43 AM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,436,374 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Feel free to mock God and me all day long.
Your God is a paramount and abject failure. He sent His Son to save the world and only gets a measily few while Satan gets his billions (according to your theology). Pity.
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Old 04-28-2016, 09:45 AM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,436,374 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
You forgot verse 18: Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.

You are in denial, or willfully ignoring what Jesus taught.
Who ever does not believe does so because God did not will to save such a one for eonian life. It is as simple as that.

Jesus said "No one can come to Me unless the Father draw Him and I will be raising him up at the last day." So it is all God's responsibility if one does not believe. The buck stops with God, not man.

Saul was condemned already because he wasn't believing. Yet God willed that Saul be saved and become Paul. See how easy that is?
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Old 04-28-2016, 09:46 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,518 posts, read 31,895,350 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Your God is a paramount and abject failure.
If you say so. Keep mocking, I won't be listening.

You are in denial, or willfully ignoring what Jesus taught.

Have a nice day.
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Old 04-28-2016, 09:47 AM
 
Location: RV Park
7,543 posts, read 11,557,405 times
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I do know this: John the revelator said the people in heaven were of so great number that "no man could number".

It never says that about those in hell - heaven's population is greater?
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Old 04-28-2016, 10:13 AM
 
Location: Gulf Coast Texas
26,229 posts, read 14,109,783 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
I already have. But not in the words you have chosen above. Anyone who is saved does not have a choice. Remember, we are not saved by our wills but by God's will. Do you believe that verse?
Of course there is a choice. Are you following God against your will? Our choices reside within God's sovereignty.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Freak80 and TroutDude were ransomed. They will be set free from sin and death and freed into God's salvation. Would you personally feel you HAD TO WORSHIP THE LORD BASED ON THAT IN YOUR OWN LIFE? Or do you personally just want to worship God and be thankful for all He did to save you? Please be honest.
Everyone has been set free. That is separate from salvation and eternal life. People are not "freed into God's salvation". People are just free from sin and death.

Romans 8:2 - For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death.
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Old 04-28-2016, 12:02 PM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,518 posts, read 31,895,350 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
Of course there is a choice. Are you following God against your will? Our choices reside within God's sovereignty.
Yes, there is the choice to accept the invitation to the wedding feats (buffet), or reject it.

There are no 'lifeguards' to drag you in against your will and force steak and lobster down your throat. In the other hand there are those, who can toss you in the outer darkness.
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Old 04-28-2016, 12:04 PM
 
Location: GOVERNMENT of TRAITORS & NAZIS
20,586 posts, read 22,739,853 times
Reputation: 7630
I love a good buffet.
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Old 04-28-2016, 12:37 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,436,374 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius
I already have. But not in the words you have chosen above. Anyone who is saved does not have a choice. Remember, we are not saved by our wills but by God's will. Do you believe that verse?
Quote:
Drob: Of course there is a choice. Are you following God against your will? Our choices reside within God's sovereignty.
God chose us. We didn't choose God. Only in a relative sense do we think we chose Him but since "all avoid Him" He has to intercept us and give us faith to be believing. Remember Jesus said: "Not you choose me yet I choose you."

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius
Freak80 and TroutDude were ransomed. They will be set free from sin and death and freed into God's salvation. Would you personally feel you HAD TO WORSHIP THE LORD BASED ON THAT IN YOUR OWN LIFE? Or do you personally just want to worship God and be thankful for all He did to save you? Please be honest.
Quote:
Drob replied: Everyone has been set free. That is separate from salvation and eternal life. People are not "freed into God's salvation". People are just free from sin and death.
That was not the answer to the question I asked above. Can't you answer the question?

Quote:
Drob: Romans 8:2 - For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death.
Romans 8:2 is for the believer. The "you" is the believer not all mankind. For them it has not occurred yet.
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