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Old 05-22-2016, 10:25 AM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,427,722 times
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Nathaniel Scarlett in his Scarlett's translation (which Greek scholars helped him on and never did those Greek scholars translate aion nor aionios as "eternal")

"on Jude 1:6 "unseen chains" . . .

Most Lexicon writers derive the word aidios from aei, ever or always: but it may have the same etemology as [h]ades, which they derive from a negative, and idein, to see; and therefore it signifies invisible, unseen, or unknown. In Romans 1:20 where it is applied to the power of the Deity, it means unknown; because we see or know only a very small part of God's power. The word is used in a limited sense by the Greeks: thus Thucydides has this phrase--othen (whence clv) aidion (imperceptible) misthophoran uparchein (to be belonging clv), from whence he expected a perpetual salary." But this could only be a salary during his life: therefore the word here in Thucydides means a period unknown; though it will certainly end."
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Old 05-22-2016, 10:31 AM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,427,722 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Choir Loft View Post
False prophets come and go. They have their reward during their brief time in the spotlight and then they go into the darkness of eternal deceit they have prepared for themselves.

I don't think its a stretch to state that in the modern age there are more liars around than in times past. Sales of snake oil have been popular for millenia and the purveyors of false doctrines and gospel have come and gone for a long time.

Louis Abbott is just another clown selling religious snake oil. He tickles the ear and the fancies of the mind in an attempt to persuade the reader that there are no consequences for their behavior. If possible he would persuade the whole world that they can do what they want with impunity. False doctrine and false words issue from the mouth and keyboard of this prophet of satan. His lies lead to curses and death.

Why is the truth so hard to discover today? Could it be that so many want to live their lives without restriction from either the laws of God or the laws of man. Lawlessness has increased in the land and there seems to be no respite from it. This has happened because of men like Abbott who easily persuade men and women that they have a license to sin and break the law.

Truth says that there is a reckoning for sin whether the law or philosophy of man acknowledges it or not. God is not willing that any should suffer for it, but that all should come to realize they need to reverse their attitude and behavior and seek peace with God and their fellow man. Today is the day to seek peace with God. In the name of Jesus Christ, those who seek Him with a sincere and humble heart will be forgiven.

There is no such thing as universal salvation. Those that do not make peace with God are doomed for all eternity. Justice will reign in heaven even if it doesn't on earth.

Forgiveness leads to peace with God and the restoration of law and order.

and that's me, hollering from the choir loft...
It could be the so-called "false prophets" are the ones you listen to.
It is so easy to denounce someone who does not believe the way you do instead of being like the original Bereans who searched the Scriptures to see if these [teachers] have it correct.

Abbot never said there won't be a reckoning for what people do. In fact, I know of no one who believes the truth that "God will have all mankind to be saved for . . . Christ gave Himself a ransom for all" that there won't be a day of reckoning.

If your teachers who you follow are not being obedient to 1 Timothy 4:10,11; 2:4-6, then I suggest you either confront them on it and ask them why they are disobedient or find ones who are obedient.
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Old 05-22-2016, 10:48 AM
 
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Originally Posted by mitchellmckain View Post
The purpose of punishment is to alter behavior and thus to make it forever means it is a failure. Yet I think it is a fact that people make hellish choices about who they are and refuse to change. So yes, I think people do make choices of significance affecting their eternal destiny.

Cruel and unusual punishment is beyond compensation:

There is no empirical study that has ever been completed, which illustrates that punitive damages under man’s thoughts of justice have any constructive function, other than, that of being excessive in nature.

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Old 05-22-2016, 11:04 AM
 
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Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
The same faith I have in Jesus Christ is the same God given faith I have to know that none are lost.



Jesus taught--Few will find the road that leads off into life( in Gods kingdom)--yet you claim to have faith in him, yet try to teach the opposite of his words. Does that work?
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Old 05-22-2016, 11:10 AM
 
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Originally Posted by kjw47 View Post
Jesus taught--Few will find the road that leads off into life (in Gods kingdom)--yet you claim to have faith in him, yet try to teach the opposite of his words. Does that work?
Few be it, that find the road or path, now.
But I wouldn't limit his eternal power.
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Old 05-22-2016, 03:27 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
595 posts, read 209,744 times
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Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
Few be it, that find the road or path, now.
But I wouldn't limit his eternal power.
Neither would I, but a God of love and creator of life would limit His own power. It is a fundamental choice -- either you value love and freedom or you value power and control. I believe in a God who chose love and freedom over power and control. Becoming a helpless human infant to live among us and die at our hands shouts this choice quite loudly, and it is the only choice consistent with the creation of life and free will. On the other hand, power and control is the obsession of those who seek to turn religion into a tool of manipulation and thus this points clearly to a human alteration of religion for such a purpose.

Last edited by mitchellmckain; 05-22-2016 at 03:40 PM..
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Old 05-22-2016, 03:58 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,427,722 times
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Originally Posted by kjw47 View Post
Jesus taught--Few will find the road that leads off into life( in Gods kingdom)--yet you claim to have faith in him, yet try to teach the opposite of his words. Does that work?
Jesus was talking about the law of Moses when He brought up the point that few find the path to life by that means which was a cramped gate.

For us of the nations, grace is not cramped. It is very broad. But it is not the broad way Jesus was talking about.
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Old 05-22-2016, 05:29 PM
 
17,691 posts, read 8,866,529 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mitchellmckain View Post
Neither would I, but a God of love and creator of life would limit His own power. It is a fundamental choice -- either you value love and freedom or you value power and control. I believe in a God who chose love and freedom over power and control. Becoming a helpless human infant to live among us and die at our hands shouts this choice quite loudly, and it is the only choice consistent with the creation of life and free will. On the other hand, power and control is the obsession of those who seek to turn religion into a tool of manipulation and thus this points clearly to a human alteration of religion for such a purpose.
... but? It appears that you give humanity the greater influence, over its own destiny?
However, the love of power, does not nullify the power of love to accomplish its goal.

(BTW - I do not believe Jesus is God, but he did exemplify the creators love for all humanity)
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Old 05-22-2016, 06:01 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
595 posts, read 209,744 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
However, the love of power, does not nullify the power of love to accomplish its goal.
The "power of love" is an oxymoron. The moment what you call love becomes a means to power, it ceases to be love at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
It appears that you give humanity the greater influence, over its own destiny?
[/i]
Life is a phenomenon of self-organization but it doesn't happen in a vacuum. Thus the idea of design is inconsistent with the nature of life itself, but on the other hand this doesn't mean there are no parents, farmers, shepherds, and teachers, who create life in the only rational way possible which is by participation in the lives of those whom they guide and care for.

But spirit of living things are 100% a product of the free will choices they make. And these choices are not a product of circumstance (no matter what they excuses) but are responses to those circumstances. This too is part of the nature of life. However, man was never meant to navigate the moral landscape of life on his own. Thus without the intervention of God there is no possibility of salvation (Matthew 19:26). But God (and the nature of life) requires us to make a choice whether to give ourselves into His hands or not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
(BTW - I do not believe Jesus is God, but he did exemplify the creators love for all humanity)
I do. I am Trinitarian but there are few other Christian images of God which I can believe in. Why am I Trinitarian? The reasons may surprise you... a lot.
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Old 05-22-2016, 06:31 PM
 
17,691 posts, read 8,866,529 times
Reputation: 1485
Quote:
Originally Posted by mitchellmckain View Post
The "power of love" is an oxymoron. The moment what you call love becomes a means to power, it ceases to be love at all.

Life is a phenomenon of self-organization but it doesn't happen in a vacuum. Thus the idea of design is inconsistent with the nature of life itself, but on the other hand this doesn't mean there are no parents, farmers, shepherds, and teachers, who create life in the only rational way possible which is by participation in the lives of those whom they guide and care for.

But spirit of living things are 100% a product of the free will choices they make. And these choices are not a product of circumstance (no matter what they excuses) but are responses to those circumstances. This too is part of the nature of life. However, man was never meant to navigate the moral landscape of life on his own. Thus without the intervention of God there is no possibility of salvation (Matthew 19:26). But God (and the nature of life) requires us to make a choice whether to give ourselves into His hands or not.

I do. I am Trinitarian but there are few other Christian images of God which I can believe in. Why am I Trinitarian? The reasons may surprise you... a lot.
Many are pessimistic and view a glass of water as half-empty, others see it as half-full.
Personally, I would rather drink it, and end-the-dilemma between the two alternatives.

For me, heaven and hell are two inflectional points of an apparent path that all life follows.
It's called life and death; and if you are able to make that choice, then you would be omnipotent.

However, I do not believe there has ever been a separation from that which created all things.
And I doubt that anything you have to say about being a Trinitarian would surprise me?

Last edited by Jerwade; 05-22-2016 at 06:53 PM.. Reason: spelling error.
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