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Old 04-02-2016, 11:02 AM
 
Location: Oregon
425 posts, read 182,092 times
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. John 20:24-28 . . Now Thomas (called Didymus), one of the twelve, was not with the disciples when Jesus came. So the other disciples told him: We have seen the Lord! But he said to them: Unless I see the nail marks in his hands and put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side, I will not believe it.

. . . A week later his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said: Peace be with you. Then he said to Thomas: Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe.

. . .Thomas said to him: My Lord and my God.

Thomas' response is a pretty interesting look behind the scenes. It reveals that at some time during Christ's association with his apostles, he claimed to be not just a god, rather, the god as per Gen 1:1.

Well; I don't think Thomas accepted Jesus' claim to be the god whom Moses' people know as Yhvh; and in point of fact, I am confident that Thomas never would have accepted his claim to be Yhvh had not Jesus proven it by restoring his crucified body to life as per the prediction recorded at John 2:19-22.

"Jesus answered and said to them: Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. The Jews therefore said: It took forty-six years to build this temple, and will you raise it up in three days? But He was speaking of the temple of his body.

. . .When therefore he was raised from the dead, his disciples remembered that He said this; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had spoken."

FYI: It was extremely important that Christ return to life with his crucified body rather than with a fresh, new body, or a spirit body, because in John 2:19-22 Jesus predicted that he would raise "this" temple in three days; viz: the body he had while speaking to the Jews at the time of that incident.

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Old 04-02-2016, 01:56 PM
 
4,666 posts, read 2,296,516 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NyawehNyoh View Post
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. John 20:24-28 . . Now Thomas (called Didymus), one of the twelve, was not with the disciples when Jesus came. So the other disciples told him: We have seen the Lord! But he said to them: Unless I see the nail marks in his hands and put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side, I will not believe it.
. . . A week later his disciples were
FYI: It was extremely important that Christ return to life with his crucified body rather than with a fresh, new body, or a spirit body, because in John 2:19-22 Jesus predicted that he would raise "this" temple in three days; viz: the body he had while speaking to the Jews at the time of that incident.
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Not a week later, but starting with the day God resurrected Jesus out of the grave - Acts 2:27 - because Jesus was Not in his physical fleshly body the woman at Jesus' grave mistook Jesus for being the gardener.- John 20:14-15

What did Peter ( at 1st Peter 3:18 B ) say but that Jesus was put to death in the flesh, but alive in the spirit.
Jesus had a pre-human spirit body before God sent Jesus to earth. At his resurrection Jesus had again his spirit body.
If Jesus had his physical body then why would Jesus use different materialized bodies to appear to his followers ?
- Luke 24:13-43; John 21:4 B.

Because doubting Thomas was doubting is why Jesus appeared in a locked room - John 20:19; 26 - shut doors when Jesus appeared in front of them. A physical fleshly body can Not do that.
Flesh and blood can Not inherit the kingdom - 1st Cor. 15:50
Jesus took his spirit body back to heaven with him - Acts 1:9
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Old 04-02-2016, 02:16 PM
 
9,169 posts, read 2,823,523 times
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Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Hmmm. Are you aware of the true significance of the phenomenon of names, Rbbi? It has to do with our consciousness itself and its reality. I generally do not discuss things at this level because most people do not have the philosophical mindset to comprehend it. A name is a sequence of symbols that when interpreted by a consciousness evokes identity and associated meanings creating spiritual substance and reality. That is the significance of Adam naming all the creatures. Most people do not think about what our consciousness creates because it seems to be ineffable and transitory (fleeting thoughts). But our consciousness is every bit as real as any material object (if not more so) and so are its creations. This should give anyone pause considering some of the awful things people actually THINK. We are truly created in God's image (imagination??) and likeness (having the same creative imagination??).

Why YES, Mystic I AM aware. No wonder I've felt a drawing towards you in the Spirit, in spite of our differences on some things. I knew you could hear me on some things that others couldn't. Thank you for having the courage to be open with me on this subject; there are few you can discuss such things with. I would love to discuss it with you some time, in your choice of medium. I think we have a more similar walk than you would imagine. I have no ill will towards you whatsoever. Peace and blessings....
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Old 04-02-2016, 02:37 PM
 
9,169 posts, read 2,823,523 times
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@ Cyber Munchkin and Sandra Moore......thanks for the encouragement. I left a lot of details out, but suffice it to say, I had a life changing experience that changed me overnight, in front of all of my shell shocked family who, like I, initially had NO IDEA what had happened to me. I really did wake up a different person, in a naturally dark room that was inexplicably bathed in a brilliant light, after a crying out to G-d prayer one evening on my way to a law class exam.

By day 2, I had no sense of weight or mass, I literally thought my hand might be able to go through walls, and I attempted it in front of my mother, who was understandably freaked out, and even more so when I told her I could see my body as composed of cells of golden light that were vibrating super fast. I had no idea the Word said, that He quickens (means to speed up) our mortal bodies. He was having the skeptical, cynical, refuse-to-set-foot-in-a-church, unbeliever walk out things before I had any idea they were in a book I had never before read.

For 10 days it seemed as though I was in a cloud, literally between worlds, so quickened it felt like I was about to vanish out of this one altogether, unable to eat anything but a bowl of cereal I forced down every day, having no idea there were such things as spiritual fasts, and He had me on one. The smell of meat cooking made me sick to my stomach, and I was a BIG meat eater and so I kept asking everybody if it was spoiled at every meal, to smell it; I had no idea that it was the blood in it I was spiritually offended by.

Our unbelief limits Him, but not once we've called out to Him in our brokenness. Then it's nothing but a wall that comes crashing down by the power of His Spirit. Peace
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Old 04-03-2016, 10:18 AM
 
Location: Oregon
425 posts, read 182,092 times
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Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4 View Post
the woman at Jesus' grave mistook Jesus for being the gardener.- John 20:14-15
When Jesus revived, he had no clothes to speak of, having lost them to the Romans (Matt 27:35). The shroud is missing from the inventory listed at John 20:23-7 and I think that's because Christ kept it as a temporary garment till he rounded up something suitable.

Anyway; the last time Mary Magdalena saw Jesus, he was practically naked;

. Ps 22:17-18 . . I can count every bone in my body. My enemies stare at me and gloat. They divide my clothes among themselves and throw dice for my garments.

and in a terrible physical condition.

. Isa 52:13-15 . . Many were amazed when they saw him-- beaten and bloodied, so disfigured one would scarcely know he was a person.

So even if Mary had been expecting to encounter her friend out at the cemetery, which of course she wasn't, it wouldn't have been an able-bodied Jesus dressed the way he was. It's no wonder to me that she didn't recognize him right away. Nobody would have, not even his own mother.

Not that long ago I ran into a family friend in a place where I wasn't expecting him only to walk right past before he caught my attention by calling out my name; so Mary's experience wasn't all that unusual; it happens all the time.

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Old 04-03-2016, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Oregon
425 posts, read 182,092 times
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Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4 View Post
What did Peter ( at 1st Peter 3:18 B ) say but that Jesus was put to death in the flesh, but alive in the spirit.
When Christ expired, he went to a place that he labeled paradise (Luke 23:43). I seriously doubt that there are fallen angels in that section of the afterlife.

It's far more likely that Peter wasn't talking about the three days and nights when Jesus was dead, but was talking about the spirit spoken of at Gen 6:3. In other words: the pre-incarnate Word was there in spirit preaching to the antediluvians via Noah's pulpit.

. Noah, a preacher of righteousness.

1Pet 3:18-20 is a pretty good proof text for defending the belief that people continue to exist beyond the demise of their physical bodies because the spirit of Christ didn't preach to the antediluvians after they were dead, rather, before they all died in the Flood.

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Old 04-03-2016, 10:58 AM
 
Location: Oregon
425 posts, read 182,092 times
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Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4 View Post
Because doubting Thomas was doubting is why Jesus appeared in a locked room - John 20:19; 26 - shut doors when Jesus appeared in front of them. A physical fleshly body can Not do that.
Jesus Christ walked on water, restored withered limbs, cured people born blind, healed serious diseases like leprosy, revived the dead, controlled the weather, multiplied fish and bread, turned water into wine, and levitated.

What's one more miracle, more or less? Walking through walls? Disappearing and reappearing? How hard could any of that really be for a man with the powers of God at his disposal?

It's curious how people can say they believe in miracles but yet cannot believe that God is able to make a normal human body pass through solid objects.

It's just downright shameful that folk daring to call themselves Jehovah's witnesses bear false witness about His power over the laws of nature.

Q: Well; if Jehovah has enough power over the laws of nature to pass a physical human body through closed and locked doors, then couldn't He pass Michael through the door as a spirit and then materialize him on the other side as a human in order to communicate with his friends?

A: That would be acceptable if only there were some record of it in the New Testament. But it is an irrefutable fact that the New Testament not even one time, on any occasion, nor under any circumstances, nor in any situation, either attests, alleges, alludes, or states that an angel named Michael appeared to Christ's friends cloaked in a human avatar. That doctrine doesn't come from the New Testament. It's a humanistic fantasy.

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Old 04-03-2016, 12:25 PM
 
Location: On a road heaven bound !
10,290 posts, read 8,064,433 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rbbi1 View Post
@ Cyber Munchkin and Sandra Moore......thanks for the encouragement. I left a lot of details out, but suffice it to say, I had a life changing experience that changed me overnight, in front of all of my shell shocked family who, like I, initially had NO IDEA what had happened to me. I really did wake up a different person, in a naturally dark room that was inexplicably bathed in a brilliant light, after a crying out to G-d prayer one evening on my way to a law class exam.

By day 2, I had no sense of weight or mass, I literally thought my hand might be able to go through walls, and I attempted it in front of my mother, who was understandably freaked out, and even more so when I told her I could see my body as composed of cells of golden light that were vibrating super fast. I had no idea the Word said, that He quickens (means to speed up) our mortal bodies. He was having the skeptical, cynical, refuse-to-set-foot-in-a-church, unbeliever walk out things before I had any idea they were in a book I had never before read.

For 10 days it seemed as though I was in a cloud, literally between worlds, so quickened it felt like I was about to vanish out of this one altogether, unable to eat anything but a bowl of cereal I forced down every day, having no idea there were such things as spiritual fasts, and He had me on one. The smell of meat cooking made me sick to my stomach, and I was a BIG meat eater and so I kept asking everybody if it was spoiled at every meal, to smell it; I had no idea that it was the blood in it I was spiritually offended by.

Our unbelief limits Him, but not once we've called out to Him in our brokenness. Then it's nothing but a wall that comes crashing down by the power of His Spirit. Peace
Amen, I just now saw your reply !

Yes, unbelief will hinder our lives in Him ! Big times !!!!
I have so many stories (testimonies) I could share of God's supernatural intervention with my life and especially that place of brokenness . I believe He has kept me and brought me through so many things I can not count them, especially when it came to death, yet finely I believe because of that one milestone He has gotten me to the place I will never doubt anything in Him again !

And I'm not saying I won't sin or that I am perfect, as some may take that sentence and run with it. Every day temptations we are faced with and try to lead us astray from Him, yet it is a part of life and what truly strengthen our faith . But I do have to say it is getting easier to look in my life knowing with all my heart somewhere, somehow ..... He has given me the way of escape to come out from under it, amen !! And if I should fall He promises to be there to pick me up and He has given me my precious Advocate with the Father, my Lord God and Savior Jesus Christ...
"My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world. By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. ..(1John 2:1-3)

And believe me, I put on my running shoes and run as fast as I can if I ever have to, too Him, as there is no other place we can go but too Him, amen !

Blessing's to you !
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Old 04-03-2016, 12:35 PM
 
9,169 posts, read 2,823,523 times
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Originally Posted by Cyber Munchkin View Post
Amen, I just now saw your reply !

Yes, unbelief will hinder our lives in Him ! Big times !!!!
I have so many stories (testimonies) I could share of God's supernatural intervention with my life and especially that place of brokenness . I believe He has kept me and brought me through so many things I can not count them, especially when it came to death, yet finely I believe because of that one milestone He has gotten me to the place I will never doubt anything in Him again !

And I'm not saying I won't sin or that I am perfect, as some may take that sentence and run with it. Every day temptations we are faced with and try to lead us astray from Him, yet it is a part of life and what truly strengthen our faith . But I do have to say it is getting easier to look in my life knowing with all my heart somewhere, somehow ..... He has given me the way of escape to come out from under it, amen !! And if I should fall He promises to be there to pick me up and He has given me my precious Advocate with the Father, my Lord God and Savior Jesus Christ...
"My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world. By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. ..(1John 2:1-3)

And believe me, I put on my running shoes and run as fast as I can if I ever have to, too Him, as there is no other place we can go but too Him, amen !

Blessing's to you !

Amen, where can we go, for He has the words of life! And there is no life like it. If they only knew what they were missing, eh? Peace
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Old 04-03-2016, 12:37 PM
 
9,169 posts, read 2,823,523 times
Reputation: 659
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyawehNyoh View Post
-
. . . A week later his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said: Peace be with you. Then he said to Thomas: Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe.

. . .Thomas said to him: My Lord and my God.

Thomas' response is a pretty interesting look behind the scenes. It reveals that at some time during Christ's association with his apostles, he claimed to be not just a god, rather, the god as per Gen 1:1.



=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Something to think about. The flesh man of Him was Thomas's Lord, the Spirit man of Him was Thomas's G-d. Peace
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