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Old 04-02-2016, 12:07 PM
 
19,952 posts, read 12,995,347 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28 View Post
If Paul was INSPIRED, how was he able to interject HIS opinion? Seems just a bit psychotic to say god inspired a personal opinion??

Didn't Jesus say the same about marriage? That it was better NOT to marry???
No one is suggesting that Paul was not able to use his own writing style. Compare Paul's and John's writing...and you'll see they are written very differently, style-wise. The Holy Spirit inspires, but does not dictate.
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Old 04-02-2016, 12:11 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
No one is suggesting that Paul was not able to use his own writing style. Compare Paul's and John's writing...and you'll see they are written very differently, style-wise. The Holy Spirit inspires, but does not dictate.
And men should not become dictators.
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Old 04-02-2016, 12:15 PM
 
Location: GOVERNMENT of TRAITORS & NAZIS
20,598 posts, read 22,770,552 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
No one is suggesting that Paul was not able to use his own writing style. Compare Paul's and John's writing...and you'll see they are written very differently, style-wise. The Holy Spirit inspires, but does not dictate.
One cannot be inspired to write or speak AND have their own OPINION at the same time. It is either god "writing" or it is Paulie writing his opinion--it cannot be both..unless you are inferring Paulie is god? Which many evangelicals seem to believe.

AND, writing style is not the same as OPINION...
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Old 04-02-2016, 12:32 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28 View Post
One cannot be inspired to write or speak AND have their own OPINION at the same time. It is either god "writing" or it is Paulie writing his opinion--it cannot be both..unless you are inferring Paulie is god? Which many evangelicals seem to believe.

AND, writing style is not the same as OPINION...
Yet...the Holy Spirit did work with the individual styles of the individuals. Just like he uses you to accomplish his will, and he uses me, and everyone else. No--he has not inspired me to write scripture, but he does guide my life.
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Old 04-02-2016, 04:56 PM
 
Location: GOVERNMENT of TRAITORS & NAZIS
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
Yet...the Holy Spirit did work with the individual styles of the individuals. Just like he uses you to accomplish his will, and he uses me, and everyone else. No--he has not inspired me to write scripture, but he does guide my life.
So you rely on YOUR OPINION as you are guided? Again, if the HS is guiding, HUMAN opinion is in direct contradiction of the inspiration, otherwise we would not have HS guidance--we would all get by on personal opinion.
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Old 04-02-2016, 08:25 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
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Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
Why do you believe the Spirit was dictating it? The doctrine of Inspiration does not suggest that Paul went into a trance and just started writing. It means he was inspired and he wrote what God wanted him to write.
Which is why I said "I'd be curious to see how plenary inspirationists explain 1 Cor 7:25"

If you are not a believer in plenary inspiration as I believe most of the fundamentalists here are, then you are off the hook.
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Old 04-02-2016, 08:56 PM
 
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Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
Which is why I said "I'd be curious to see how plenary inspirationists explain 1 Cor 7:25"

If you are not a believer in plenary inspiration as I believe most of the fundamentalists here are, then you are off the hook.
Of course I am. And plenary inspiration allows for the writer's personal style to be visible.
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Old 04-02-2016, 09:10 PM
 
Location: On the Edge of the Fringe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
I'd be curious to see what the writer thinks of 2 Tim 3:16 or 2 Peter 1:21.

I've wondered...why do people feel such a need to discredit the inspired words of God?
I've always wondered, why people are so ignorant as to not realize that the "scripture" to which the nutjob Paul was referring would have been the Torah/Old Testament? See, the new Testament did not exist at that time. Paul wrote that passage about 65 AD While imprisoned by Nero. (Today he would be institutionalized under the Baker act, but anyway....) The New Testament was not officially canonized until the year 692.

SO, again, what did the early Christians have? The Bible did not exist. The onl;y Scripture would be the Torah/old testament

The one that includes passages like
Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. “The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him.” (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)

Then again, if ALL Scripture is USEFUL and inspired, then why not include the Koran, the Bhagtava gita and of even Anton Lavey's Satanic Bible? (The latter being more of a joke than a doctrine.)

Sad that so many people take a book, written by ancients wanders, early followers and a sufferer of mental disorders as some literal guide for living in the 21st century. But hey, if it works for you, go ahead, knock yourself out. I would not choose to ruin my life that way.
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Old 04-03-2016, 07:48 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
Of course I am. And plenary inspiration allows for the writer's personal style to be visible.
You are right, my bad: I should have used the term "verbal inspiration" as in: "At times this view has been criticized as tending toward a dictation theory of inspiration,[19] where God speaks and a human records his words. C. H. Dodd wrote:

The theory which is commonly described as that of 'verbal inspiration' is fairly precise. It maintains that the entire corpus of Scripture consists of writings every word of which (presumably in the original autographs, forever inaccessible to us) was directly "dictated" by the Deity… They consequently convey absolute truth with no trace of error or relativity… No attempt will be made here to formulate an alternative definition of inspiration… That I believe to be a false method. There is indeed no question about the original implications of the term: for primitive religious thought the "inspired" person was under the control of a supernatural influence which inhibited the use of his normal faculties.[19]"

from Wikipedia
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Old 04-03-2016, 08:05 AM
 
9,169 posts, read 2,792,733 times
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What is so hard to fathom about this? Paul was writing a letter. He was perfectly capable of inserting an opinion and stating it was his opinion, and THEN resuming and recounting what the Spirit had made life in him, under the anointing. If you've never experienced the anointing, it's like being moved by a strong wind. You have all your faculties, but you're being "pushed" in one direction and one direction, only.


And I'll go you one further. Paul was "breaking down" principles He had learned of the Risen Lord, so that they would be easily "digestible" to babes, ie. milk. Just like the law of the seed. It's mentioned in there in various ways, broken down for understanding. Peace
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