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Old 04-08-2016, 09:45 AM
 
19,952 posts, read 13,035,689 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RonkonkomaNative View Post
Can you find a loving God in the book of Job?

No.
How about a just and sovereign God? There are more attributes to God than love.
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Old 04-08-2016, 09:53 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Timothy316 View Post
But God doesn't take the wheel from you. Which if we have no freewill we don't even drive the car.

I have had so many freewill discussions I can't even count them all. I have weighed all the evidence, analogies and scriptures that can be heard. What I have determined is that no one can believe in a loving God and believe that we don't have a choice. Love is the reason we have freewill and that is something that those that don't believe in freewill hate to hear. "Whoever does not love has not come to know God, because God is love." 1 John 4:8. This explains so much to me. If there is no freewill then we are robbed of the loving choice to follow and love God. If is forced if there is no freewill. I don't except that those that don't love God don't have a choice to do so. What a horrible belief. Thank Jehovah, it's not true.

Joshua 24:15 "choose for yourselves today whom you will serve..."

I said He allows us the ILLUSION of free will. But if you are ever to really KNOW, in the biblical sense of being one with, Him as sovereign, you will know what I'm telling you. I also once believed I had free will. That's the thing about growing in Him, as Paul said when I was a child I spake of childish things.

Growth in Him changes what you thought was set in stone, just as it changed me to know UR is true, also. It wasn't something I was looking for, He woke me up in the middle of the night to show me. That's the thing, that's why I just encourage people to keep on pressing in, because I know what they will find when they do. Peace

Last edited by Rbbi1; 04-08-2016 at 10:14 AM..
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Old 04-08-2016, 09:54 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
How about a just and sovereign God? There are more attributes to God than love.

AMEN
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Old 04-08-2016, 09:56 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Choir Loft View Post
Love is not the answer.

I am instantly opposed and usually outraged by references to motivations by the Most High of love. Here's why.

Although any sincere student of scripture can recall at least a half dozen references to the love of God from memory, they are IRRELEVANT to the modern culture of America - perhaps the rest of the world as well. The Protestant Church in America has been accused by its own theologians and (some) leadership that it's become irrelevant to our society. Secular voices declare it daily. Why? Because the love of God is misrepresented.

God is first and foremost righteous. Love springs from that. Love is an off-shoot of God's righteousness just like the actions of a caring parent for a difficult young child. One gets up in the middle of the night or at inconvenient times to care for the needs of the child and rarely does one do so because of mushy feelings of affection. Love is not simple passion. Love is responsible actions for the betterment and well being of another person. Love is not selfish. (see definition of it in Corinthians)

The great misfortune of the modern age is that secular and religious definitions of 'love' are nearly always selfish, passionate and demanding. The word is misrepresented. The act has been corrupted. According to the present attitude - God loves humanity without bounds and limits. According to this attitude WE are more important than moral responsibility, divine law, or even God's purposes in the universe. Man has become the center of all things and God is expected to bow before us because WE are of supreme value. According to the Bible, nothing could be further from the truth.

The reason why Jesus died on the cross has been debauched. Preachers today do not themselves understand what happened there or why. Neither do they preach it or write about it. Jesus died because righteousness demanded it. Jesus loved because righteousness demanded it and Jesus rose again from the grave because divine righteousness demanded it. Not all who watched that event would enter paradise and not all who hear the story will enter either.

The crucifixion is one of the most filthy gruesome and disgusting stories in a book filled with ugly stories. There are no pretty words that can describe it, yet Protestantism today seeks always to put lipstick on a pig - as it were. You know the story. Put lipstick on a pig and its still a pig. That's why Protestantism is irrelevant. It tries to put a pretty face on an very very ugly episode in human history. It was the day mankind conspired to murder God.

Jesus died because of sin - not because of love. Most of the words in our language that were once forbidden in polite society are forbidden no more. The F bomb has been replaced by the N word. Patriotism has been corrupted into aggressive international militarism. Freedom as a political reality is unknown. Sin is worshipped and approved as the satisfying act of a passionate spirit. And LOVE, particularly the love of heaven, has been corrupted to justify it. THIS is why I oppose the word.

"I love you" as a phrase has been so commonly applied that it no longer has substance. It means less than "good morning" or "sorry about that". Love with respect to divine motivations does not exist except as an excuse to SIN.

This tells the tale and this tells all. The love of God NEVER justifies sin. Until and unless SIN is understood, the word should not be used. According to the Bible LOVE implies spiritual responsibility on the part of God and man.

Responsibility is another unpopular word at present. No one is responsible for anything. Yet the Biblical teaching on the subject links love with spiritual and earthly responsibility and SIN.

There is NO love from God when a sinner rejects God's love. Divine love is not automatic and it is not a license to sin. Never was. Never will be. The only prayer God will hear is the prayer of repentance. When uttered by a humble spirit - the reply of heaven is love.......but not till then. Ever.

and that's me, hollering from the choir loft...

Can't rep you CL, but I can AMEN you. You said it better than me. Peace
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Old 04-08-2016, 10:13 AM
 
Location: Georgia
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How much time do you spend trying to find ways to make people question Gods goodness? Have you really nothing better to do with your time than trying to discourage Faith in God?!
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Old 04-08-2016, 10:17 AM
 
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It IS G-d's goodness, ALL OF IT (if you're referring to what I said about Job), because He has a plan and He can see the end from the beginning and so can any He decides to share it with. Peace
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Old 04-08-2016, 10:27 AM
 
19,952 posts, read 13,035,689 times
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Originally Posted by bryan85 View Post
How much time do you spend trying to find ways to make people question Gods goodness? Have you really nothing better to do with your time than trying to discourage Faith in God?!
I honestly don't think they do. It's what shows that they not only don't believe, but they act as if they believe there is no God.
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Old 04-08-2016, 10:33 AM
 
9,169 posts, read 2,816,373 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
How about a just and sovereign God? There are more attributes to God than love.

Hey Vizio.....I think you should know that someone hacked your computer and wrote this under your name awhile ago.
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Old 04-08-2016, 10:50 AM
 
Location: Georgia
3,550 posts, read 1,232,040 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
I honestly don't think they do. It's what shows that they not only don't believe, but they act as if they believe there is no God.
They are free to believe or not believe. However, it says a lot about someone thats purpose in life appears top be to discourage others belief in God!
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Old 04-08-2016, 10:51 AM
 
6,823 posts, read 3,158,682 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
How about a just and sovereign God? There are more attributes to God than love.
The God I know has little to do with your bible stories, Viz.

God does not stress me. God does not punish me. God does not expect me to submit to men.

Male fantasy is all over the bible. Men were inspired alright. Soft porn is what they find inspiring.

Men have created attributes of God. Men cannot control their behavior unless they see some sort of punishment down the pike. The problem is some men seem to think I have the same requirements.
Your God, according to men, want women to submit to rampant sinners. That does not really make any sense.

I do not have the same requirements. I do not submit to men. I never substitute my own good judgement for theirs. Ever. I do not allow men to make decisions for me. Ever. I do not submit to sinners. The idea is astonishingly silly.

I just read Jeff. To paraphrase, he believes Christians live in real despair. Somehow, that seems to translate to loving and being loved by God. Poor Fundamentalist Christian men have little joy. They seem to fight demons all the time. It seems a sad and terrible existence.

I do find these Fundamentalist Christian men to be rather "uptight". I understood the frat-boy euphemism, when you used this word in a discussion with me.

So, here. Allow me.

Uptight? Perhaps you have not been getting any lately. Since your wife must submit, she should do her wifely duty, and bake you a nice cake. Your favorite cake.

My favorite cake, if that is even possible, is dark 72% chocolate with a fudge frosting. Not too sweet, perfect, and moist. What's yours?
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