Only bible fundamentalists need setting free from the bible (Torah, traditions, Leviticus)

[Cyber Munchkin]

Originally Posted by Eusebius

Hmm, I wonder why your quote of me lower cased "Christ" and "Satan" and "God" and "Jesus"? Did you do that or does your program auto-lower case proper nouns?

You know that happen once when a individual replied to my post and I asked the person if they changed them to a lower case and she said no, so we don't know if it was city-data program that did it or her computer . But it did do it just like with rbbi replying to your post !

[Rbbi1]

Originally Posted by Eusebius

Hmm, I wonder why your quote of me lower cased "Christ" and "Satan" and "God" and "Jesus"? Did you do that or does your program auto-lower case proper nouns?

No, I didn't do that. I have no idea why it did it. I noticed it lower cased my "amen" too, and went in and capped it. Who knows. I've got a Siamese who thinks he should type with me; maybe he stepped on a button, lol....

[Jerwade]

Originally Posted by Eusebius

Hmm, I wonder why your quote of me lower cased "Christ" and "Satan" and "God" and "Jesus"?
Did you do that or does your program auto-lower case proper nouns?

A fear based theology?

[pcamps]

Originally Posted by Eusebius

Or Beelzebub? Anything to keep the children of God from the Scriptures. Paul always wrote to the believers "According as it is written." Therefore Paul was always in the Scriptures and was proving truth in accord with what was written.

When Christ was assaulted by Satan and tried by him Jesus always said "It is written" thus relying on the written word of God. Oh Satan just hates that!!! He sends his messengers here as messengers of light to dissuade believers from the Scriptures.

113 times just in the New Testament the word "written" is referred to.

2Ti 2:15 Endeavor to present yourself to God qualified, an unashamed worker, correctly cutting the word of truth."

You like a typical fundy Euse are reading what you want to see in my post. Yes I know you have Greeked the scriptures to death or whatever you have done to them(Paul called all that stuff dung so that he could gain the excellency of Christ) and studied all the other stuff, but the fountain of life we drink from is none of those things' it's all about Christ and finding him who the scriptures testify of in us.

Jesus answered her, "If you knew the gift of God and who it is that asks you for a drink, you would have asked him and he would have given you living water
Well Euse where is Jesus Christ now so we can ask for that wonderful water he says is our for the taking ?

Fundamentalists need setting free from the bible so that they can walk in the freedom of the Spirit it speaks of. When it's all about that Spirit then the scriptures can be understood for what they were meant for.......... An history of man leaving his glory and returning to it having played out all the characters within its pages. You're all to concerned about who or how many are saved, who is believing right, when is the tribulation and all the other crap you all go back on forth on, rather understanding salvation is and always has been a present moment thing where God is all that where we all fall short of,if we call upon him. He is the ever present help in time of need.

[pcamps]

Originally Posted by Hannibal Flavius

Yeah?


1 John
By this we know that we love the children of God: when we love God and keep His commandments.


Unless one studies and learns the law intimately, he cannot know the laws of Jesus because behind all the laws is a hidden law. If you don't stay in study of the comings and goings of the Temple then you will never be able to see what the laws of Jesus are.


1 Corinthians 9


Say I these things as a man? or saith not the law the same also?
For it is written in the law of Moses, thou shalt not muzzle the mouth of the ox that treadeth out the corn.


Doth God take care for oxen?
Or saith he it altogether for our sakes? For our sakes, no doubt, this is written: that he that ploweth should plow in hope; and that he that thresheth in hope should be partaker of his hope.






The law of Jesus is behind every law of Moses and a person must study and even practice the law so that he can know the hidden meanings of Christ or how would he ever learn the laws of Jesus?

Hanny F..... All that pertains to life and godliness is already within each of us, so close that we can reach out and touch it, but we fumble around with veiled minds thinking we can find within the letter that which can only be found within us.
I have never left you nor forsaken you ........... Nothing has and never will separate you from my love. I am the greater one within you, quit looking everywhere but within for him.


That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might FEEL(ask yourself where is God felt if he's not far from us) after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us.

[Jerwade]

Originally Posted by Cyber Munchkin

You know that happen once when a individual replied to my post and I asked the person if they changed them to a lower case and she said no, so we don't know if it was city-data program that did it or her computer . But it did do it just like with rbbi replying to your post !

God, Satan, Christ - nothing changed.
Perhaps, the person wasn't truthful?

[Rbbi1]

Originally Posted by Jerwade

God, Satan, Christ - nothing changed.
Perhaps, the person wasn't truthful?

I can't speak for the other person, but this person doesn't lie and is astounded that anyone would think anything was amiss over caps. Seriously?

[nateswift]

Originally Posted by nateswift

Is it possible for you to comprehend the difference between "keep the children of God from the Scriptures" and "show the children of God the correct USE OF the Scriptures?"

Originally Posted by Eusebius

Yes, of course it is possible. Why do you ask?

For instance near the end of the first post in this thread he stated:

"Such confidence we have through Christ(Not bible belief) before God. Not that we are competent in ourselves to claim anything for ourselves, but our competence comes from God(not the bible). He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit(not the bible); for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life"

"The letter" is not the Scriptures but is "the letters chiseled in stone" which is the law Paul was talking about. It is the letters of the Mosaic law chiseled in stone which had the curses tied directly to them and therefore those letters (the law) kills since no one in flesh can do the law.

I have dealt this this often concerning the misconception that "the letter kills" as if that means "the Sacred Scriptures in general kill so it is best to just not read the Bible but trust God. That thought is incorrect.

The reason that I ask is that you are reading INTO the post you cite the idea that the poster wants the scriptures taken away rather than used properly as the poster himself did. He is fully aware of the proper and improper use of scripture and is berating those who make a fetish out of the Bible, as you do.

I would be interested in your exposition of "the letter kills" if you would like to give me a reference, because on the surface I don't buy it at all. It looks like another rationalization to me. But it also does not mean "the Sacred Scriptures in general kill so it is best to just not read the Bible but trust God," it means that taking the scripture in strict interpretation of what the words say rather than the spirit or intent by which they were written is deadly, so it is best to understand what the motivation for any particular scripture is.

[Hannibal Flavius]

Originally Posted by pcamps

Hanny F..... All that pertains to life and godliness is already within each of us, so close that we can reach out and touch it, but we fumble around with veiled minds thinking we can find within the letter that which can only be found within us.
I have never left you nor forsaken you ........... Nothing has and never will separate you from my love. I am the greater one within you, quit looking everywhere but within for him.


That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might FEEL(ask yourself where is God felt if he's not far from us) after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us.

I think most people who know me think that I keep the laws of Moses, that I may keep kosher or that I even keep the Sabbath in the way it is supposed to be kept but I don't.


While I greatly love an honor the laws of Moses, the only things I really keep are ethical, and moral laws, and to try to love every one. It is extremely hard to not get angry, or filled with pride but to love everyone is all I am about.


A Judaizer is somebody who is telling you that you can only be saved by keeping the laws and just as you believe, I doubt anyone can separate us from the love of God. I think God is a big huge spirit of love that never stops growing, and all that is fine and well for a person who seeks salvation alone.


But there are much greater things than salvation. I study the laws and I am always trying to unlock the poetry contained in the bible where an olive tree is a priest and things of this nature that uses a poetic form. But unless I study the law in and out, I will never learn who Jesus really is because I will never learn who I am.


The law is simply based around the temple, and being that I am the temple, it's comings and goings are about me, and if I do not know myself, I can't really know God who is a spirit comings and going through me.


I can have my simple salvation, but if I really want to understand Revelation or Matthew 24, or if I sincerely want to know Jesus in a very intimate way, the only way to do this is to know the law. If I do not know the law, I would never have a clue what Revelation speaks of because it's understanding pivots on whether a person knows the law or not.


If I had not been head over heels for the law, I would never be able to speak the language of Jesus, never be able to unlock a single parable and Jesus only spoke in Parables, and this is why Jesus looks at the law breakers and says,'' Depart from me, I never knew you lawbreakers.''


Jesus has a secret hidden message contained within the law, it is his own law, a law of freedom taken from a law of chains.


If I try and keep all the laws so that I can learn the laws of Jesus, people would actually say I was a Judaizer or something, but just because I love and honor the law does not make me a man chained down to the letter of the law.


In Act 21 you see that tens of thousands of Jews became believers and after they believed, they became even MORE zealous in keeping the laws in Joy, why do you think that is?


Because they suddenly realize that all the stress in trying to keep the laws has been taken away, and so now they were keeping the laws in joy and not in fear of breaking them. Gentile Christians were very zealous in becoming just like the Jew, just as many Gentile Messianics become very zealous in keeping the laws of Moses today.


Paul could never make them understand and he got angry because it kept coming up over and over about whether gentiles should keep all the laws or not.




There is a HUGE difference in a Jew saying,'' You have to keep these laws for salvation,'' and another Jew saying,'' Be filled with Joy and love the law because the penalties of breaking the laws have been taken off your shoulders.''


Paul had a problem with Jews telling gentiles that they had to keep the laws for salvation but somehow it has been turned around like the law is evil to keep.


Somebody says,'' But I can't stop eating bacon and lobster, am I going to hell?''


One Jewish believer says ,'' YES, you can't be saved unless you stop eating unclean foods.''


But Paul would say to a gentile convert,'' If you can keep any of the laws, these laws will be good for you, but salvation is not on the table, don't tell a gentile he can only be saved by keeping all the laws.''


Paul kept telling them that we were set free from the penalties of the laws, but his words have always been turned on him as if he himself was a lawbreaker, or that he ever stopped keeping the laws, he never stopped.


Just as Jesus said, that you can not keep the laws of Moses and you can even teach others not to keep the laws of Moses but you are going to be the least in the kingdom of heaven.


They still had their salvation EVEN AFTER not keeping the laws and teaching others not to keep it.


Salvation is all fine and well and if that's all a person is after, then who am I to say anything?


Only thing is, there is a huge gulf between the least in the kingdom and the greatest, it just depends how bad a person wants to excel in the after life.


We are studying to be priests of the law.


We are running a race and not everyone wins a race, and while salvation is wonderful and blessed is he who has his salvation, if that is all he has achieved, he is a loser with his salvation standing in the court and not being able to enter the bridal chamber to consummate a wedding, not being able to enter the banquet, not being able to obtain the first resurrection, but he has his salvation.

[Cyber Munchkin]

Originally Posted by Jerwade

God, Satan, Christ - nothing changed.
Perhaps, the person wasn't truthful?

Well, I like to believe the best of someone rather then think they were not truthful . And with this happening to Eusebius and rbbi it shows she was being truthful

"God, Satan, Christ - nothing changed . " you forgot Jesus