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Old 01-07-2017, 04:31 PM
 
86 posts, read 28,470 times
Reputation: 26

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God has chosen to reveal Himself to us as being
a Triune Godhead of 3 Persons or 3 Manifestations.
He has revealed Himself as being One God in 3 Persons.
What is not so clear is exactly WHY He chose to do this.
All Scriptures are from the NKJV.

Let us begin with Father God and the Word (Jesus Christ)
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with
(Father) God, and the Word was God” (John 1:1)
“And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us” (John 1:14)
“Christ came, who is over all, the eternally blessed God.
Amen.” (Romans 9:5)
Note: “Christ” is the Greek word for the Hebrew word “Messiah”

Now let us introduce the Holy Spirit
The archangel Gabriel instructed the virgin Mary …
“… you shall call His name JESUS. He will be great, and
will be called the Son of the Highest … the Holy Spirit (God)
will come upon you … therefore, also, that Holy One who
is to be born will be called the Son of God” (Luke 1:31-35)
“Now the birth of Jesus Christ was as follows:
When His mother Mary had been betrothed to Joseph,
before they came together (she was a virgin) she was
found to be with child of the Holy Spirit” (Matthew 1:18)

So, we see that Joseph was not Jesus’ father,
but the Holy Spirit (God) was His father.
This explains why the Bible can say that God had a “Son”.
The Word from heaven became God’s “Son” on earth.

More details about the Second Person of the Triune Godhead
“For a Child is born to us, a Son is given to us …
And He will be called: … Mighty God …” (Isaiah 9:6)
“… and they shall call His name Immanuel, which is translated,
‘God with us’.” (Matthew 1:23)
– so said an angel of the Lord
“The Father and I are one.” (John 10:30) – so said Jesus
Jesus was (and is) the Creator and the Sustainer of all things:
“God who created all things through Jesus Christ” (Ephesians 3:9)
“Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things” (1 Corinthians 8:6)
“sustains all by the mighty power of His command” (Hebrews 1:3)
“it is His power that holds everything together” (Colossians 1:17)
And Jesus is the Giver of eternal life:
“My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.
And I give them eternal life” (John 10:27)
Truly, Jesus is everything, including … the bread of life – the light of the world
– I AM (the God of Exodus 3:14) – the door (to salvation) – the good shepherd
– the resurrection and the life – the way, the truth, and the life (John 6:35,
John 8:12, John 8:24/58, John 10:9, John 10:11, John 11:25, John 14:6).

More details about the Third Person of the Triune Godhead
“If you love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray to the Father,
and He will give you another Helper (Comforter, Advocate, etc.),
that He may abide with you forever — the Spirit of truth, whom the
world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him;
but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you.
I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.” (John 14:15-18)
– “another” is the Greek word “allos” (meaning “another of the same kind”)
“If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him,
and We will come to him and make Our home with him.” (John 14:23)
– Father God and Jesus promise to indwell the true believer as the Holy Spirit.
Many NT verses teach that believers are indwelt by the Holy Spirit.
“But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name,
He will teach you all things …” (John 14:26)
One of the more famous passages is …
“Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit
… You have not lied to men but to God.” (Acts 4:3-4)

There are about 30 NT verses in which all 3 Persons of the Trinity are mentioned
… as if They are indeed equal.

There is a lot more, but this should suffice to prove …
the Holy Bible reveals to us that God wishes to reveal Himself
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Old 01-07-2017, 05:02 PM
 
17,711 posts, read 8,875,130 times
Reputation: 1486
If God is Holy and Spirit, then Ananias lied to God himself, not a separate entity.

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Old 01-07-2017, 05:12 PM
 
4,569 posts, read 2,267,926 times
Reputation: 338
As gospel writer John wrote about Jesus at Revelation 1:5 and Revelation 3:14 B that the pre-human Jesus was the beginning of the creation by God. According to Psalm 90:2 God is from everlasting meaning God had No beginning. Thus, the pre-human Jesus was Not before the beginning as God was before the beginning. Rather, Jesus is first born of every creature according to Colossians 1:15
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Old 01-07-2017, 07:12 PM
 
19,952 posts, read 12,973,053 times
Reputation: 1957
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
If God is Holy and Spirit, then Ananias lied to God himself, not a separate entity.

Yes. Ananias lied to God the Spirit. He is not a separate entity, but is God himself. He is the same essence as God the Father.

I'd encourage you to check out discussion thread between Mike555 and Katzpur. I think Mike did an excellent job explaining it.
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Old 01-07-2017, 07:14 PM
 
19,952 posts, read 12,973,053 times
Reputation: 1957
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4 View Post
As gospel writer John wrote about Jesus at Revelation 1:5 and Revelation 3:14 B that the pre-human Jesus was the beginning of the creation by God. According to Psalm 90:2 God is from everlasting meaning God had No beginning. Thus, the pre-human Jesus was Not before the beginning as God was before the beginning. Rather, Jesus is first born of every creature according to Colossians 1:15
Nothing of the sort is stated there. In fact, we see Jesus worshiped in Revelation 5, and God the Father permitted it.

And Colossians 1:15 states he is the Firstborn. Not first born. There is a difference. I'd suggest you study what "firstborn" often means in Hebrew culture. It's not about birth or creation.
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Old 01-07-2017, 08:28 PM
 
4,221 posts, read 1,964,288 times
Reputation: 220
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZacharyB View Post
God has chosen to reveal Himself to us as being
a Triune Godhead of 3 Persons or 3 Manifestations.
He has revealed Himself as being One God in 3 Persons.
What is not so clear is exactly WHY He chose to do this.
All Scriptures are from the NKJV.

Let us begin with Father God and the Word (Jesus Christ)
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with
(Father) God, and the Word was God” (John 1:1)
“And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us” (John 1:14)
“Christ came, who is over all, the eternally blessed God.
Amen.” (Romans 9:5)
Note: “Christ” is the Greek word for the Hebrew word “Messiah”

Now let us introduce the Holy Spirit
The archangel Gabriel instructed the virgin Mary …
“… you shall call His name JESUS. He will be great, and
will be called the Son of the Highest … the Holy Spirit (God)
will come upon you … therefore, also, that Holy One who
is to be born will be called the Son of God” (Luke 1:31-35)
“Now the birth of Jesus Christ was as follows:
When His mother Mary had been betrothed to Joseph,
before they came together (she was a virgin) she was
found to be with child of the Holy Spirit” (Matthew 1:18)

So, we see that Joseph was not Jesus’ father,
but the Holy Spirit (God) was His father.
This explains why the Bible can say that God had a “Son”.
The Word from heaven became God’s “Son” on earth.

More details about the Second Person of the Triune Godhead
“For a Child is born to us, a Son is given to us …
And He will be called: … Mighty God …” (Isaiah 9:6)
“… and they shall call His name Immanuel, which is translated,
‘God with us’.” (Matthew 1:23)
– so said an angel of the Lord
“The Father and I are one.” (John 10:30) – so said Jesus
Jesus was (and is) the Creator and the Sustainer of all things:
“God who created all things through Jesus Christ” (Ephesians 3:9)
“Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things” (1 Corinthians 8:6)
“sustains all by the mighty power of His command” (Hebrews 1:3)
“it is His power that holds everything together” (Colossians 1:17)
And Jesus is the Giver of eternal life:
“My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.
And I give them eternal life” (John 10:27)
Truly, Jesus is everything, including … the bread of life – the light of the world
– I AM (the God of Exodus 3:14) – the door (to salvation) – the good shepherd
– the resurrection and the life – the way, the truth, and the life (John 6:35,
John 8:12, John 8:24/58, John 10:9, John 10:11, John 11:25, John 14:6).

More details about the Third Person of the Triune Godhead
“If you love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray to the Father,
and He will give you another Helper (Comforter, Advocate, etc.),
that He may abide with you forever — the Spirit of truth, whom the
world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him;
but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you.
I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.” (John 14:15-18)
– “another” is the Greek word “allos” (meaning “another of the same kind”)
“If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him,
and We will come to him and make Our home with him.” (John 14:23)
– Father God and Jesus promise to indwell the true believer as the Holy Spirit.
Many NT verses teach that believers are indwelt by the Holy Spirit.
“But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name,
He will teach you all things …” (John 14:26)
One of the more famous passages is …
“Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit
… You have not lied to men but to God.” (Acts 4:3-4)

There are about 30 NT verses in which all 3 Persons of the Trinity are mentioned
… as if They are indeed equal.

There is a lot more, but this should suffice to prove …
the Holy Bible reveals to us that God wishes to reveal Himself
Total misunderstanding. The son of God is the servant of God. The Holy Spirit is the servant of God.

The servant of God is One with the Father.

The Lord and I are One.

Seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness.

Everyone must be taught by God. Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. I am the spirit, the power and the light.

Follow me and you will live.
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Old 01-07-2017, 08:32 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,272 posts, read 20,878,318 times
Reputation: 9954
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
I'd encourage you to check out discussion thread between Mike555 and Katzpur. I think Mike did an excellent job explaining it.
Katzpur didn't do such a bad job either , and amazingly enough, neither Mike nor Katzpur felt the need to insult one another. Can you even imagine such a thing as an evangelical and an LDS Christian actually having a civil dialogue with the intent, not so much of convincing the other person, but simply for the purposes of building bridges of understanding? No, I didn't think so.
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Old 01-07-2017, 11:02 PM
 
17,711 posts, read 8,875,130 times
Reputation: 1486
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
If God is Holy and Spirit, then Ananias lied to God himself, not a separate entity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
Yes. Ananias lied to God the Spirit. He is not a separate entity, but is God himself. He is the same essence as God the Father.

I'd encourage you to check out discussion thread between Mike555 and Katzpur. I think Mike did an excellent job explaining it.
I had no problem with their discussion, however, I am not a believer of Trinitarianism.
For there is but one God, and one mediator (conciliator) between God and humanity.
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Old 01-08-2017, 03:33 AM
 
7,859 posts, read 6,666,416 times
Reputation: 1371
Many people will believe what they want depending on their custom , and on the witness of Jesus Christ and some have ought with the traditional churches , and will in no way change their views , only Jesus will judge us for knowing His identity for His faith .....
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Old 01-08-2017, 08:07 AM
 
782 posts, read 296,042 times
Reputation: 229
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
I had no problem with their discussion, however, I am not a believer of Trinitarianism.
For there is but one God, and one mediator (conciliator) between God and humanity.

Sh'ma Yisra'eil Adonai Eloheinu Adonai echad.
Hear, Israel, the Lord is our God, the Lord is One.

The Sh'ma prayer is the oldest statement of faith in the Judeo-Christian tradition. The Hebrew language also reveals the simplicity of the answer to all the confusion Christian leadership has created about the nature of God. Instead of relying upon pagan ideology to explain God's nature as Christianity attempts to do, Hebrew reveals the answer clearly and simply.

Echad is the Hebrew word for one, but isn't the only word. Echad does not imply an absolute 'one'. The word for the solitary condition of 'one' is yachid. Why then does the ancient Sh'ma prayer end in a plural word instead of singluar?

Echad implies a unity of one rather than a solitary one. For example, the motto of the United States is e pluribus unum - latin for 'one of many'. 'One' in this instance is used to describe a group of fifty unique states gathered into a single political unity. Thus the United States of America is a single nation composed of many parts - one of many "e pluribus unum". Today we say 'the United States IS a nation' rather than 'the United States are a nation'. Similarly, if we used the Hebrew word to describe this one-ness we'd use the word echad to say 'the Lord is God' rather than 'the Lord are God'. God is one, not a committee.

Yachid implies a solitary one, an absolute one. The sh'ma reveals a unity of separate but equal parts.

Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[a] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.” - Genesis 1:26

In the quoted passage above who is God talking to? Who is us in the portion, "Let us make mankind in our image"? Is God talking to Himself or is He talking to a committe of some sort?

Some Jewish scholars prefer to inperpret this as the Master of the Universe speaking to a committee of angelic beings. But in Deuteronomy 14:1a the Word of God addresses men by saying, "You are sons of the Lord your God..." Angels are not referred to as sons of God, but the Bible does so for mankind. Therefore, God is quoted as talking to Himself in the Genesis passage.

Who then is the 'us' of Genesis? It is the One God - Master of the Universe - the echad spoken of in the Sh'ma. God is a single being - a unity of existence and of purpose - an echad one.

There is no trinity as pagans understand it. There is no three separate divine beings. There is one God only - echad.

Hope this helps.

and that's me, hollering from the choir loft...
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