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Again, if studying those things is developing the characteristics of the spirit of God/love in you, great. But plenty of people exhibit those characteristics at a high level who have nothing to do with studying your book, in your way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pleroo
So, yes, the fruit of the spirit (love, joy, peace, patience, etc. -- not cursing) very much has everything to do with knowing what spirit is operating within a person. And if the spirit of God is operating within a person, and they are walking in that spirit, why do you think that it is not those people who would, eventually, be the ones bringing healing to others?
I believe people had the spirit of God before Pentecost, that is not what we are talking about. We are talking about the indwelling of a powerful Holy spirit that doesn't heal symbolically, it means you can put your hands on a blind person and expect a healing. There is no such thing today.
The fruit of the spirit of God is love, but love has nothing to do with obtaining an anointing or obtaining a powerful spirit that allows you to do greater things than Jesus did.
The spirit of Pentecost is a very particular spirit, and there isn't anyone who can work in any of it's gifts today.
What would the wise virgins tell the foolish?
How does a person obtain an extra vessel in order to first purchase oil, and then to fill that vessel up?
How did the wise virgins purchase oil, and where do they tell the foolish virgins where to buy the oil, and exactly what is the oil?
That parable is instruction for a person who wants to receive an anointing and an anointing is not the Holy spirit of Pentecost, it is a spirit that comes teaching, but where do the wise tell the foolish to go? The feasts teach what these things are.
Whatever that parable means, everyone should find out and do what it says to do.
One can decide the Holy Spirit as often as God seems it justified said person. As it is not a matter of how hard you try, but of God's Grace. I myself have received it and backslid and sinned and received it again. So I believe I'll take this life experience over some yahoo Zealot on an internet forum.
Btw...Posts like the OP are an excellent example of why so many are leaving the church, as well as why so many find religious fundamentalists to be insuffersble.
One can decide the Holy Spirit as often as God seems it justified said person. As it is not a matter of how hard you try, but of God's Grace. I myself have received it and backslid and sinned and received it again. So I believe I'll take this life experience over some yahoo Zealot on an internet forum.
Btw...Posts like the OP are an excellent example of why so many are leaving the church, as well as why so many find religious fundamentalists to be insuffersble.
I am completely oblivious, tell me how you received the Holy spirit, and how in the world did you backslide, in your sin to receive it again?
How did you know you lost it? Was it because you lost the power to heal the blind and deaf?
Why don't we have an educational study on Pentecost. Pentecost begins a counting from the Passover Sabbath to count the omer for 7 weeks.
At what point did you receive the Holy spirit and how many people have you healed from having the gifts of the Holy spirit?
I would be very interesting to hear you preach a sermon to educate us on Shavuot and counting the omer and how you yourself received the great and powerful Holy spirit where you can ask anything of God and expect to receive it.
So you think that you backslid and lost the spirit temporarily?
Do you know what was promised to those actual people who actually received the Holy spirit of Pentecost?
What happens on Shavuot? What do the priests do, and what does Shavuot promise? What is the mission of Christ on this day?
This is one of 7 Holy days of visitations by Christ to those who count the omer in order to receive the spirit.
What do you know of Shavuot, I mean that you yourself has had the spirit of Shavuot, tell us about it.
11While the people were listening to this, Jesus proceeded to tell them a parable, because He was near Jerusalem and they thought the kingdom of God would appear imminently. 12So He said, “A man of noble birth went to a distant country to lay claim to his kingship and then return. 13Beforehand, he called ten of his servants and gave them ten minas.a ‘Conduct business with this until I return,’ he said. 14But his subjects hated him and sent a delegation after him to say, ‘We do not want this man to rule over us.’ 15When he returned from procuring his kingship, he summoned the servants to whom he had given the money, to find out what each one had earned. 16The first servant came forward and said, ‘Master, your mina has produced ten more minas.’ 17His master replied, ‘Well done, good servant! Because you have been faithful in a very small matter, you shall have authority over ten cities.’ 18The second servant came and said, ‘Master, your mina has made five minas.’ 19And to this one he said, ‘You shall have authority over five cities.’ 20Then another servant came and said, ‘Master, here is your mina, which I have laid away in a piece of cloth. 21For I was afraid of you, because you are a harsh man. You withdraw what you did not deposit and reap what you did not sow.’ 22His master replied, ‘You wicked servant, I will judge you by your own words. So you knew that I am a harsh man, withdrawing what I did not deposit and reaping what I did not sow? 23Why then did you not deposit my money in the bank, and upon my return I could have collected it with interest?’ 24Then he told those standing by, ‘Take the mina from him and give it to the one who has ten minas.’ 25‘Master,’ they said, ‘he already has ten!’ 26‘I tell you that everyone who has, will be given more;{Are we speaking of money? NO. but the one who does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him.27And these enemies of mine who were unwilling for me to rule over them, bring them here and slay them in front of me.’â€
The Triumphal Entry ~ The final entry of all who walk and proceed, the coronation of the king after his 7 years.
(Zechariah 9:9-13; Matthew 21:1-11; Mark 11:1-11; John 12:12-19) 28After Jesus had said this, He went on ahead, going up to Jerusalem
This is what took place after Jesus came as the great prophet and spent a certain amount of days appointed for a prophet until he in fact, came to the end of the days of his prophesy, and then he followed and was anointed as a priest after an exact number of days WALKY AS THE RABBI. After an exact amount od days Jesus came into his Triumphal Entry on the very day set in accordance of the law being the coronation of the king.
Part 1 of 2: Rosh HaShanah
HAMELECH: THE CORONATION OF THE KING
The recognition of G-d as King is vividly pictured in the Jewish view of Adam's understanding of his Divine Creator being King over all the Universe. It was late on the sixth day since G-d began the Creation of the world, when Adam opened his eyes and saw the beautiful world around him, and he knew at once that G-d created the world, and him too. Adam's first words were:
"The L-rd is King forever and ever!" and the echo of his voice rang throughout the world. "Now the whole world will know that I am King," G-d said, and He was very pleased. This is the first Rosh HaShanah! The first New Year. It was the birthday of Man, and the Coronation Day of the King of Kings!
MESSIANIC UNDERSTANDING
A theme and term associated with Rosh HaShanah in Hebrew is HaMelech (the King). It was mentioned earlier in this chapter that the shofar blown on Rosh HaShanah is known as the last trump, which Rav Sha'ul (the apostle Paul) mentioned in First Thessalonians 4:16-17. At this time, the believers in the Messiah who are righteous (tzaddikim) according to Yom HaDin (the Day of Judgment) will be taken to Heaven in the rapture (natzal) along with the righteous who had died before this time. On Rosh HaShanah, the coronation of the Messiah Yeshua as King will happen in Heaven (Revelation 5). Yeshua, who had come to earth during His first coming to play the role of the suffering Messiah, Messiah ben Joseph (Yosef), will be crowned as King over all the earth in preparation for His coming back to earth to reign as King Messiah (Messiah ben David) during the Messianic age, the Millennium, or in Hebrew eschatology, the Athid Lavo (Revelation 19:16; 20:4).
Daniel 7:9-14 speaks of this in the Tanach.
I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit...the judgment was set, and the books were opened. [This is Rosh HaShanah, Yom HaDin, the Day of Judgment. The books are the book of the righteous, the book of the wicked, and the book of remembrance] ... I saw... one like the Son of man [this is understood to be the Messiah Yeshua (Matthew 24:30; 26:64)] coming with the clouds of heaven [the clouds are the believers in the Messiah (Hebrews 12:1; Revelation 1:7)]...And there was given Him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve Him: His dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and His kingdom that which shall not be destroyed (Daniel 7:9-10,13-14).
John (Yochanan) saw this same thing in the Book of Revelation.
After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven [the gates of Heaven are opened on Rosh HaShanah, according to Isaiah (Yeshayahu) 26:2 and Psalm (Tehillim) 118:19-20]: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet [Rosh HaShanah is known as the last trump] talking with me [Rosh HaShanah is known as Yom Teruah, the Day of the Awakening Blast or loud shout(1 Thessalonians 4:16-17)]..And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne [this is HaMelech, the coronation of the Messiah; the coronation ceremony is described in Revelation 5] (Revelation 4:1-2).
The description given here in Revelation matches the account in Daniel 7:9-14.
THE ENTHRONEMENT CEREMONY OF A KING
There are four parts to the enthronement of a Jewish king.
1) The giving of the decree. Associated with this is a declaration. This can be seen in Psalm (Tehillim) 2:6-7, as it is written, "Yet have I set my king upon My holy hill of Zion. I will declare the decree...." Next, a rod/scepter is given, which is an emblem of a king. Scriptures that refer to the scepter include Genesis (Berei****) 49:17; Numbers (Bamidbar) 24:17; Esther 4:11; 5:2; 8:4; Psalm 45:6; and Hebrews 1:8. Scriptures that refer to a rod are in Psalm (Tehillim) 2:9; Isaiah (Yeshayahu) 11:1,4; and Revelation 2:27; 12:5; 19:16. The scepter is an emblem of a king or royal office and a rod refers to the king ruling and reigning righteously in all matters (Isaiah 11:1,4-5). Yeshua is the King Messiah (Isaiah 11:1,4-5; Jeremiah 23:5-6; Zechariah 9:9; Luke 1:32-33; John [Yochanan] 1:47-49).
2) The ceremony of the taking of the throne (Revelation 5). The king sits on the throne and is anointed as king. The word Christ in English comes from the Greek word Christos and in Hebrew is Mashiach, meaning "the anointed one." Yeshua came as a prophet during His first coming (Deuteronomy [Devarim] 18:15), was resurrected as the priest (John [Yochanan] 20:9,17), and is coming back to earth again as King. Kings in Israel were anointed (2 Samuel 5:3-4; 1 Kings [Melachim] 1:39-40, 45-46; 2 Kings 9:1-6).
I believe that a person is a prophet who needs to say,'' I am no prophet,'' and he quiets the fallen spirit and raises his own child, and when that child is finally formed, it is caught up to heaven.
A person stays in study on the Temple and it's ways to know thyself.
I am completely oblivious, tell me how you received the Holy spirit, and how in the world did you backslide, in your sin to receive it again?
How did you know you lost it? Was it because you lost the power to heal the blind and deaf?
Why don't we have an educational study on Pentecost. Pentecost begins a counting from the Passover Sabbath to count the omer for 7 weeks.
At what point did you receive the Holy spirit and how many people have you healed from having the gifts of the Holy spirit?
I would be very interesting to hear you preach a sermon to educate us on Shavuot and counting the omer and how you yourself received the great and powerful Holy spirit where you can ask anything of God and expect to receive it.
So you think that you backslid and lost the spirit temporarily?
Do you know what was promised to those actual people who actually received the Holy spirit of Pentecost?
What happens on Shavuot? What do the priests do, and what does Shavuot promise? What is the mission of Christ on this day?
This is one of 7 Holy days of visitations by Christ to those who count the omer in order to receive the spirit.
What do you know of Shavuot, I mean that you yourself has had the spirit of Shavuot, tell us about it.
Wow..that's a lot of questions!
As far as what I know about Shavout....the answer is nothing. As I recall that's a Jewish precept, and I'm not Jewish.
I have never healed anybody with hands on..nor do I make it a practice to "preach" to others on matters concerning how to obtain the Holy Spirit. I only know what works for me, and can merely offer my own testimony on my experience with God. As I recall, this is what Jesus asked of us. I don't recall Him ever using the word "shavout" in the gospels, either.
The Mission of Christ today is the same it has always been. He serves as a conduit for the HolySpirit, which, again, is a gift from the Grace of God.
I am also not a Pentecostal, rather, I consider myself Ecumenical. I even practice tenets of Zen Buddhism.
Getting in touch with the Holy Spirit is above all a very personal thing. Everybody's testimony on their experience with it tends to differ. Therefore, any advice I were to give you may not work for you.
Besides, given your rather lengthy posts on the matter, I would dare say you're not really looking for advice but rather are instead attempting to find opinions that you can disagree with and publicly denigrate them. This is also not something that Jesus suggested we do. Quite the opposite, really. (see His admonishments to pray or speak with the Father in private.)
Besides, and lastly, if I were to go into detail on my experiences on this issue, I would be straying way off-topic.
Feel free to take any of that in any way you choose. Still, best of luck in your own personal path.
That will be the extent of my advice to you, my friend.'
I believe people had the spirit of God before Pentecost, that is not what we are talking about. We are talking about the indwelling of a powerful Holy spirit that doesn't heal symbolically, it means you can put your hands on a blind person and expect a healing. There is no such thing today.
That's exactly what I was talking about: people who are operating in, and out of, the spirit of God (the characteristics of that spirit being love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, gentleness, etc., etc., etc.). If anyone is going to eventually be healing others, it's them.
You want people to study feasts and laws. I believe that learning to walk in the spirit that exhibits the characteristics of the spirit of God is "studying" (ie. living) exactly what they ought to be to experience any further powerful indwelling of God's spirit. So, like I said, if studying the feasts is in some way leading you [generic you] to a place where that spirit, with all it's attending characteristics, is filling you up (however slowly) and flowing out to those around you, you're on the right track. If not, in my opinion, you [again generic 'you'] are not.
Ps. I'm with Jerwade ... physical healing is the least important in my book. It's the inner (spiritual, if you will) healing that is vital, and real (not symbolic).
That's exactly what I was talking about: people who are operating in, and out of, the spirit of God (the characteristics of that spirit being love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, gentleness, etc., etc., etc.). If anyone is going to eventually be healing others, it's them.
You want people to study feasts and laws. I believe that learning to walk in the spirit that exhibits the characteristics of the spirit of God is "studying" (ie. living) exactly what they ought to be to experience any further powerful indwelling of God's spirit. So, like I said, if studying the feasts is in some way leading you [generic you] to a place where that spirit, with all it's attending characteristics, is filling you up (however slowly) and flowing out to those around you, you're on the right track. If not, in my opinion, you [again generic 'you'] are not.
Ps. I'm with Jerwade ... physical healing is the least important in my book. It's the inner (spiritual, if you will) healing that is vital, and real (not symbolic).
No, That is just now how things are designed and it is not how it works. The Holy spirit came to those who counted the omer in their keeping of Pentecost, and that spirit was designed to go away just as the first rain comes and then goes. We wait upon the promise of the second rain and it is not going to fall on people just because they love, it is going to be given to the people who are actually members of the religion that offers the promise. Those first disciples received a warning and we are also promised a warning before the second promise of rain, and while the first rain and spirit was shared from hand to hand, the second rain will not be shared for a very good reason. It is not going to fall on Hindus, on Muslims, or on Christians, it is promised to fall on the people who watch, prepare, and pray for the rain. It is PROMISED not to fall on a single person who isn't already keeping the feast of Tabernacles and if it is this year, we will see people shine, literally shine with power and this power will not be shared. It is not going to fall on just anyone because it is an unlimited power and those who follow God's bidding are going to receive it. Gentiles who have done what pleases God in order to become priests are going to receive this power and everyone will run to them saying,'' Give us this oil.''
The answer will be,'' NO, go to and purchase the oil yourself.''
The anointing God promises does not fall on people who love, it falls on gentiles who do what God asked them to do in order for them to be called,'' God's priests.''
An anointing is not the Holy spirit of Pentecost, but it can be obtained by anyone who completes the requirements that God asks a person to fulfill in order to become a priest.
Just as all these people claim to have a Holy spirit of Shavuot who reject Shavuot, they are claiming something impossible because they aren't in the same religion as the people who actually keep Pentecost and why would the gifts of the Holy days be given to people who will not accept them?
If any person or nation will not keep Tabernacles, they shouldn't be hoping for a Holy spirit at all, they should be waiting upon death because Zechariah insinuates that you die if you aren't already in acceptance of God's appointed Holy days.
1Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom. 2And five of them were wise, and five were foolish. 3They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them: 4But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps. 5While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept. 6And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him. 7Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps. 8And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out. 9But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves. 10And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut. 11Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us. 12But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not. 13Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.
Even if you could convince a Christian what this parables means, he has just begun. Even if you told him exactly how to obtain an extra vessel, and you explained to him where to buy the oil and he goes out and does just that, he has just begun.
The oil you buy allows you to become a priest in order to receive an anointing to learn, but you are just now given that anointing, you don't learn overnight, you learn AFTER YEARS.
Even after the virgins are told where to buy oil, they still don't know Christ because they still don't know the feasts and it is the feasts that teach exactly who Christ is, and it is the feasts that allow a person to understand what Jesus is saying in all these parables. But even if you convinced a person today, and that person went out and found oil to buy to put in the vessel they had found, he has just begun a 7 year journey.
He can't just come back and walk into the marriage chamber because there is no time to learn, and why would God indwell a person full of power to make him a priest if in fact, he knows nothing of the temple, or the comings and goings of the Temple in order to teach?
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