Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
If you believe in Christ today and have eternal life, but lose it tomorrow, then it was never "eternal" at all.
The reason people get their undergarments so in a twist is because they do not consider that they have Salvation by faith.
When the body is regenerated and one is in the immortal form, then they can never, ever, lose their eternal salvation. But those who are at present born again in spirit, but who continue to dwell in the Adam nature, must not revert to the old nature, and continue in the old nature, while they wear that [Adam] nature's flesh.
If one does let the old man nature get the upper hand, then one must repent of that, no matter what the deeds done in that flesh are, and they must humbly confess and accept the restitution in Christ.
Believers can backslide as long as they are in Adam's nature, which nature they are to "reckon dead" and "die daily" to, and not be subject to, and not obey it in its lusts.
If a once saved by faith born again in Christ believer backslides into the carnal nature, and does not repent, but continues to live in a state of unrepentant sin, then that one is in danger of never entering into the inheritance in Christ which is laid up for them in heaven, but which they have by faith, while in Adam's flesh/nature.
Only when we shed Adam will the flesh nature of the old man, Adam, be gone forever, and then we will never be tempted to sin again, for we will be in the New Man flesh nature, which cannot sin.
For now, "examine yourselves to see whether ye be in the faith".
I agree that Once saved, always saved is not according to scriptures. St. Peter says in 5th chapter of Acts that God gives the Holy Ghost to those who obey him. . Then if we truly have the Holy Spirit, He does the work in us, and we have nothing of which we can boast. According to Jesus, ”When ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do,” Luke 17:10.
Bob Prince
I am 79 year old semi-retired physician, with 2 children, 9 grand children, and 7 great gr.children. I would like to add the following post which I wrote a couple of months ago.
Any comments will be greatly appreciated:
Bob Prince, MD
ARE DENOMINATIONS IN KEEPING WITH GOD’S WILL?
Many people in our day are convinced that, “If you believe that Jesus is the Son of God and accept Him as your personal Savior, you are saved, and that there is nothing you can do to cause you to lose that salvation." But our Savior Himself made high expectations of those who would be His true followers. In the 14th chapter of John, He said, “If ye love me, keep my commandments,” also “Whosoever forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple,” Luke 14:33. In Acts chapter 5, St. Peter said that God gives the Holy Ghost to “them that OBEY Him.” So we must repent and have a mind to obey Christ if we are to receive His Holy Spirit, and I believe that Spirit gives us the power to resist committing willful sins. We know that we are prone to make mistakes every day, but that, “If we confess our sins , he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness,” I John 1:10.
St. Paul wrote to the Corinthians “That ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you, but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment,” I Cor 1:10. Now we know that Jesus told His Apostles, “He that heareth you heareth me, and he that despiseth you despiseth me; and he that despiseth me despiseth him that sent me” Luke 10:16. He also said, “He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me, and he that receiveth me, receiveth him that sent me,” John 13:20. Also we know that Jesus personally struck Paul down on the road to Damascus and that St. Paul declared his credentials in several of his epistles that he was called of Christ Jesus to be an Apostle. [SIZE=3]Jesus also prayed to his Father in John 17:11, that his followers should be one as He and the Father were one.
So if we are to be obedient to Christ and also to take heed to all the admonitions of His Apostles, it seems like an impossible task. But if we truly have the Holy Spirit, then He does the work in us, and we have nothing of which we can boast. According to Jesus, ”When ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do,” Luke 17:10.
Does it make any sense that denominational differences are looked upon as being perfectly normal in our day, with people generally believing that almost all ‘conventional denominations” are branches of the Christian church and that all who have accepted Jesus Christ as their “personal” Savior are assured of going to heaven when they die?
Do we really believe that our all-wise, all-powerful Father in heaven looks down on this earth and approves of all those who claim to have been called of Him to preach the Gospel, even though they are often preaching things that are exactly opposite of what others are preaching.
]I personally believe that Jesus gave the perfect formula for solving this gross confusion when he said in John 7:17 that, “If any man will do His will, he shall know of the doctrine whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.” I believe that if we have truly repented and pray earnestly for Christ and His Father to show us any area of our life where we are not doing His will, they will show this to us and give us the Holy Spirit. That Spirit will make it possible for us to be obedient to them, which is impossible for us to do if we have a carnal mind. “Because the carnal mind is enmity against God for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his” Romans 8:7-9.
Jonathan Edwards wrote in 1851, “I am come now to the last distinguishing mark of holy affections that I shall mention: XII. Gracious and holy affections have their exercise and fruit in Christian practice. . . John 15:14, ‘Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.’. . If the old nature be indeed mortified, and a new and heavenly nature infused, then may it well be expected, that men will walk in newness of life, and continue to do so to the end of their days. . . Some may be ready to object against what has been said of Christian practice being the chief evidence of the truth of grace, that this is a legal doctrine, and that this making practice a thing of such great importance in religion, magnifies works, and tends to lead men to make too much of their own doings, to the diminution of the glory of free grace, and does not seem well to consist with the great gospel doctrine of justification by faith alone. It is our works being the price of God’s favor, and not their being the sign of it, that is the thing which is inconsistent with the freeness of that favor. . . It is not the worthiness or loveliness of our works, or anything in us, which is in any wise accepted with God, as a balance for the guilt of sin. Thus we are justified only by the righteousness of Christ, and not by our righteousness.” (A Treatise Concerning Religious Affections; Worcester edition.)
We know that Jesus said, “Not everyone that saith to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he that doeth the will of my Father in heaven” Matt. 7:21. .Jesus made it perfectly clear that, “He that hath my commandments and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me; and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him and make our abode with him. He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings” John 14:21 & 24. And as we said, He told His Apostles that if we hear them we hear Christ Himself, so we are expected to have no divisions among us, as St. Paul admonished the Corinthians.
We certainly acknowledge that Christ has had true disciples in all ages of time since His crucifixion and resurrection, but I believe that, as the time of His return to earth draws nearer, He is calling for those who have truly repented and whose primary goal in life is to do God’s will, that we lay down our denominational differences and follow Him. I believe we should be careful not to judge others too harshly, since they must answer to their maker and not to us. But I firmly believe that if we are truly doing His will, Jesus promised us, “We SHALL KNOW of the doctrine whether it be of God" or whether we speak of ourselves.
If the reader sees anything in this document that is not backed up by scripture, you would do me a favor by bringing it to my attention.
Bob Prince
May 5, 2010
Last edited by Robert M Prince; 07-28-2010 at 05:52 AM..
Reason: appearance
Here are the passages that I feel prove this believe wrong. Please chime in with your thoughts and passages:
Matthew 13:20 Jesus' explanation of the Parable of the Sower:
"The one who received the seed that fell on rocky places is the man who hears the word and at once receives it with joy. But since he has no root, he lasts only a short time. When trouble or persecution comes because of the word, he quickly falls away."
Mark 13:13 Jesus says:
“All men will hate you because of me, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.”
Galatians 5:1 Paul says:
"It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery."
I agree with this, sin is death and separation from God. None of us have recieved our salvation yet. We have not arrived.
Philippians 2:12 Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed—not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence—continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, Ephesians 3:7
I became a servant of this gospel by the gift of God's grace given me through the working of his power. No decision, no choice, all God. John 6:44 "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day. Matthew 11:27 "All things have been committed to me by my Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.
Romans 8:13 For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live, Galatians 1:4 who gave himself for our sins to rescue us from the present evil age, accordingto the will of our God and Father, Ephesians 1:11 In him we were also chosen, [ Or were made heirs] having been predestined according to the plan of him who works out everything in conformity with the purpose of his will, Philippians 2:13
for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose.
A Gift already given cannot be bought by one's own decision. Gift-God's mercy in Christ- Salvation Gift-Grace in our time of need-while we were sinners and now. Gift-Holy Spirit, the Power of God to accomplish God's will in us. Gift-Fullness in Christ-all the above.
Recieve-Recieve-Recieve! Believe you have recieved and believe the Holy Spirit working in you continually will bring God's will for you to completion.
We know the Holy Spirit was given at Pentecost (Power of God). He was not given immediately. The Parable of the Sower is the example of the ones who do not and do have the Holy Spirit. The Spirit will continue to produce fruit. This is why one will know them by their fruit. We cannot bear lasting fruit without the Spirit(Power of God). The Seal.
Satan can masquerade as an angel of light. Even good deeds. Luke 11:14-26 Appearance of a clean house.
Also know when one is prompted to pray, do a good deed, have a great thought and put it into action, to worship, even the time to buy a certain item and weight the cost, every good thing comes from God. Every good thought and act in you is prompted by the Power of God, the Holy Spirit. You are not your own, you have been bought with a price, the Precious blood of Jesus.
It does not matter if one says they choose, we have already been bought with the blood of Christ.
Now those who do not have the Spirit(Power of God) will continually be tossed back and forth, like the waves of the sea.
Acts 22:14 "Then he said: 'The God of our fathers has chosen you to know his will and to see the Righteous One and to hear words from his mouth.
Ezekiel 18: 19-24
Live by the Spirit.
I am 79 year old semi-retired physician, with 2 children, 9 grand children, and 7 great gr.children. I would like to add the following post which I wrote a couple of months ago.
Any comments will be greatly appreciated:
Bob Prince, MD
ARE DENOMINATIONS IN KEEPING WITH GOD’S WILL?
God's will is to have the gospel proclaimed through out all the world.
The queston is how?
A benefits to denominations are:
organization
no doctrinal division (unity)
financial \ spiritual support of other believers in other parts of the world
financial \ spiritual support \ and the ability to send missionaries
In the NT these people that is mentioned believers are from:
Antioch, Pisidia: Acts 13:14; Gal 1:2
Antioch, Syria: Acts 11:26 (Paul's home base)
Athens: Acts 17:34
* Babylon: 1 Peter 5:13 (probably included this list in Acts 2:9 )
Berea: Acts 17:11
Caesarea: Acts 10:1,48
Cenchrea: Rom 16:1
Colossae: Col 1:2
Corinth: Acts 18:1
Crete: Titus 1:5
Cyrene: Acts 11:20
Damascus: Acts 9:19
Derbe: Acts 14:20; Gal 1:2
Ephesus: Acts 18:19
Hierapolis Col 4:13
Iconium: Acts 14:1; Gal 1:2
Jerusalem: Acts 2:5
Joppa: Acts 9:36, 38
Laodicea: Rev 1:11, Col 4:15
Lydda: Acts 9:32
Lystra: Acts 14:6; Gal 1:2
Pergamum: Rev 1:11
Philadelphia: Rev 1:11
Philippi: Acts 16:12
Puteoli, Italy: Acts 28:13-14
Rome: Rom 1:7
Sardis: Rev 1:11
Sharon: Acts 9:35
Smyrna: Rev 1:11
Tarsus: Acts 9:30
Thessalonica: Acts 17:1
Thyatira: Rev 1:11; Acts 16:14
Troas: Acts 20:6-7
The known regions listed in the Bible
Region of Phoencia: Acts 11:19
Region of Samaria: Acts 8:14, 25
Churches of Judea: Gal 1:22
Churches of Galatia: Gal 1:2
Churches of Asia: 1 Cor 16:19
Churches of Macedonia: 2 Cor 8:1
Was there "denominations" in the NT?
Was there collections for the church of Jerusalem?
Was there a coucil Acts 15:1
Was the decisions of the council in Jersusalem applyn elsewhere amoung the other churches Acts 16:4
Pau'ls list: 1 Corinthians 12:27-29
"And in the church God has appointed first of all...
Firstly let me state very clearly I am only referring to genuine and sincere saved and born again Christians.
Once a sincere person comes to Christ by faith, they are then genuinely and sincerely saved and born again Christian.
1 John 5:12-13
12He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life.
13I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.
They are given ETERNAL LIFE at the exact moment they come to Christ.
Now if it can be taken away, then the Bible is a lie and contradicts itself because then it was not eternal life to begin with, it was only temporary life.
So ask yourself, is the Bible telling the truth or is it lying?
Secondly, once a sincere person comes to Christ by faith, the Bible says this:
John 10:28 I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand.
Was Jesus lying or was He telling the truth? NOTE carefully, He said, I GIVE THEM ETERNAL LIFE and they shall NEVER PERISH!! NO ONE can snatch them out of my hand! In other words, SEALED FOREVER, SAVED FOREVER!
The only people who are lost are the ones who were never born again and saved in the first place!! Many claim to be saved and even attend Church for years, then they leave Christ, and people say, "look, he was saved but now lost". But the truth is that person was never saved in the first place!
Critics of the “once saved, always saved” doctrine claim that it gives Christians a license to sin. They presume that those who believe in eternal security intend to accept salvation, and then continue to willingly sin and not care at all!
But this is inaccurate, because anyone who has been truly saved is a new creature (2 Corinthians 5:17), has the conviction of the Holy Spirit (John 14:26; 1 Thessalonians 4:8), and now wants to live for Christ. Someone who continues to willingly and blatantly live in sin and not care about sinning at all, has not truly accepted Christ to begin with (1 John 2:19; 1 John 3:6; James 1:26).
I find this thread to be of no value for one simple reason and that is because those participating in this discussion don't even agree on what it means to "be saved". Some believe to "be saved" means (I am going to heaven when I die). Thus the "once saved always saved" topic seems to me an ignorant notion on its face. If you are "always saved" by having "accepted Christ" by "making a decision" (which is another carnal notion), what need have you to "work out your own salvation with fear and trembling" ???
God's will is to have the gospel proclaimed through out all the world.
The queston is how?
A benefits to denominations are:
organization
no doctrinal division (unity)
financial \ spiritual support of other believers in other parts of the world
financial \ spiritual support \ and the ability to send missionaries
[end quote]
I believe that God's will is perfectly expressed in His Word (the Bible). How can all the thousands of denominations be considered as having the benefits of "no doctrinal division (unity)."
I believe that if we are truly doing the will of God, as Christ said in John 10th chapter, "we shall know of the doctrine whether it be of God or man." The Holy Spirit will help us to discern what doctrines come from man and which ones are backed up by God.
God's will is to have the gospel proclaimed through out all the world.
The queston is how?
A benefits to denominations are:
organization
no doctrinal division (unity)
financial \ spiritual support of other believers in other parts of the world
financial \ spiritual support \ and the ability to send missionaries
[QUOTE)
I believe that God's will is perfectly expressed in His Word (the Bible). How can all the thousands of denominations be considered as having the benefits of "no doctrinal division (unity)."
I believe that if we are truly doing the will of God, as Christ said in John 10th chapter "we shall know of the doctrine whether it be of God or man."
Critics of the “once saved, always saved” doctrine claim that it gives Christians a license to sin. They presume that those who believe in eternal security intend to accept salvation, and then continue to willingly sin and not care at all!
But this is inaccurate, because anyone who has been truly saved is a new creature (2 Corinthians 5:17), has the conviction of the Holy Spirit (John 14:26; 1 Thessalonians 4:8), and now wants to live for Christ. Someone who continues to willingly and blatantly live in sin and not care about sinning at all, has not truly accepted Christ to begin with (1 John 2:19; 1 John 3:6; James 1:26).
I strongly agree that "Someone who continues to willingly and blatantly live in sin and not care about sinning at all, has not truly accepted Christ to begin with (1 John 2:19; 1 John 3:6; James 1:26)." But Jesus also said in 10th chapter of MaTTHEW, "He that endureth to the end shall be saved," SO PERSEVERENCE IN FAITH MUST BE NECESSARY, ALSO.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
