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This is all true in a purely secular sense, but the thread is not on how we view something like this but rather how God does.
But what is 'ok' from a human nature and secular standpoint does not line up with what is OK from a sin standpoint.
We don't get to decide what we get a free ticket on because 'Hey, I'm only human'.
Is masturbation a sin? I'd say it can be. It depends on whether it's something done in the context of God's design for sex. If it is, then I'd say it's OK. If not, then I'd say it's a sin.
I realize the thread is asking about how god views masturbation, and as such, how one is to determine whether or not it is a sin. I also cannot help but bring my secular mindset to whatever I respond to, as I am treading water in a sea of "secularism." It is primarily all June knows. (Emphasis on "primarily" but not necessarily limited to...) As such, perhaps I should not have responded. --Then again, there has been some aspect of this thread that has remained in June's mind that she has found more than just "compelling."
June is the first to admit that without a real context within which to fully understand the Christian notion of "sin" that she is posting to the wind.
June spends alot of time these days shouting into a drum, only to hear her own echo...
But nonetheless, sometimes even semi-secularly minded human beings are driven to better understand various aspects of certain belief systems. I guess I can't help but wonder whether there exists some aspect within any given belief system, (in this case, Christianity) wherein my connection with the divine is both dependent upon, but at the same time not limited to my acceptance of myself as a fully human being. --Because it seems to me that there is a dual process which exists within us; that in somehow embracing my own humanity, (sexuality included) that I am thereby also embracing the divine. June was not/is not denying either of those aspects. But I also need to make something else clear: I understand that it is not a case of getting a "free ticket" in exclusively deciding what the rules are based soley on the fact that we are "human." I respect that.
--But we are human. Perhaps the real question is "What is the nature of sin?" and within that, how does one understand the various aspects of one's humanity in relation to the sacred/divine. How does one embrace both aspects of oneself, the fully human as well as the divine, while at the same time adhering to what god wants within that dual existence/process. Where, within that, does "masturbation" lie?
June is the first to admit that she is clueless, and as such, the least qualified to address the OP. -But then again, something compelled her to attempt to understand OP, as well.
June wrote;--"Because it seems to me that there is a dual process which exists within us; that in somehow embracing my own humanity, (sexuality included) that I am thereby also embracing the divine."
No, we all lie and we lie everyday. If we didn't there would be chaos in the world. Can you imagine everyone telling the truth to everyone. There would be so much hate in the world. I am just being honest here. We lie to keep the peace and to make people happy. Is that really wrong? I guess in some cases it is, but if we lie and it doesn't hurt anyone and actually makes a person feel better about themselves it is ok. As for masturbation, I really don't think that my salvation hinges on the fact that I like a little pleasure every couple hours. LOL, just kidding, every once in a while.
June wrote;--"Because it seems to me that there is a dual process which exists within us; that in somehow embracing my own humanity, (sexuality included) that I am thereby also embracing the divine."
Be careful. Your sounding like a Christian.
Be even more careful. What I wrote is an underlying attribute/principle of nearly every major religious belief system. June thinks alot. That's where the need for caution really originates!
P.S. June knows how to read music. She studied piano once upon a time...
No, we all lie and we lie everyday. If we didn't there would be chaos in the world. Can you imagine everyone telling the truth to everyone. There would be so much hate in the world. I am just being honest here. We lie to keep the peace and to make people happy. Is that really wrong? I guess in some cases it is, but if we lie and it doesn't hurt anyone and actually makes a person feel better about themselves it is ok. As for masturbation, I really don't think that my salvation hinges on the fact that I like a little pleasure every couple hours. LOL, just kidding, every once in a while.
A bit off topic, but I have to give my opinion. I disagree with we all lie everyday. I think there are ways of being honest and not hurtful. In my opinion, if I lie to someone about something, I am hurting them by not being honest. The key is finding the way to be honest in a manner that is not hurtful. Either that or following the principle that if you got nothing nice to say, just don't say anything at all. I believe that honesty is always the best policy.
There are ways of helping people feel better about themselves without lying to them. Thats just my opinion.
[quote=mari4him;3138708]A bit off topic, but I have to give my opinion. I disagree with we all lie everyday. I think there are ways of being honest and not hurtful. In my opinion, if I lie to someone about something, I am hurting them by not being honest.
I think that you just proved my point. Saying we don't lie everyday is a lie and telling a person half truths is a lie too. Don't worry though it didn't hurt me when you said that.
No, we all lie and we lie everyday. If we didn't there would be chaos in the world. Can you imagine everyone telling the truth to everyone. There would be so much hate in the world. I am just being honest here. We lie to keep the peace and to make people happy. Is that really wrong? I guess in some cases it is, but if we lie and it doesn't hurt anyone and actually makes a person feel better about themselves it is ok. As for masturbation, I really don't think that my salvation hinges on the fact that I like a little pleasure every couple hours. LOL, just kidding, every once in a while.
With all due respect, I disagree. There ARE people who do not lie everyday. (I, for one, make a conscious effort not to lie...don't always succeed, but at least I try...) The quoted statement sounds an awful lot like a justification to lie, reasoning that "because everybody does it, it's no big deal". Problem with that logic is not everbody does...
A bit off topic, but I have to give my opinion. I disagree with we all lie everyday. I think there are ways of being honest and not hurtful. In my opinion, if I lie to someone about something, I am hurting them by not being honest. The key is finding the way to be honest in a manner that is not hurtful. Either that or following the principle that if you got nothing nice to say, just don't say anything at all. I believe that honesty is always the best policy.
There are ways of helping people feel better about themselves without lying to them. Thats just my opinion.
Right on! Couldn't have said it better...
Bud
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