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Old 08-06-2017, 07:21 AM
 
Location: US
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere View Post
"Do not kill," as I recall the commandment.
Do not murder...You are thinking of the wrongly translated COT...
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Old 08-06-2017, 07:24 AM
 
Location: US
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hljc View Post
Keep in prayer and never have fear , and always pray for traveling mercies , and there will be no need to kill for self defense , as God will protect you , and if a hazard did come up call the name of Jesus Christ at the assailant for your protection ..... If people live in hostile wicked area ,never fear, as fear will keep the Lord`s hand away
And remember to never go to the doctor when sick...
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Old 08-06-2017, 07:25 AM
 
Location: US
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
In 1611, when the King James Version was translated the term kill meant to take a human life without good cause, as in murder, in modern English. Many words have changed meaning in the last 400 years.

I mean think about it. We kill cows and chicken for food. Hunters kill deer.

Receiveth thee a bible translation which beest less than 40 years fusty. Receiveth thyself a mod'rn translation so thee can und'rstand what the bible actually sayeth.
Do you have any academic proof of this?...
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Old 08-06-2017, 07:28 AM
 
Location: US
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
I don't think I've ever heard anyone say that before.

I don't think it's ever "God's will" that ANYONE dies violently at the hand of another person.
What about the conquest of the land of Canaan where G-d commands them to wipe them all out?...
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Old 08-06-2017, 07:30 AM
 
Location: US
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Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
Read 2kings 20 about king Hezikiah who asked God to put His will aside regarding his death. So God did...
Go ooon....
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Old 08-06-2017, 07:31 AM
 
Location: US
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere View Post
We'd have to go back to the original Greek (or whatever it was) for a precise definition of "kill," as in "Thou shalt not kill."


I was hoping there would be some Bible scholars here who would already have done that?


I'm not saying you can't make a good argument for killing. But to do so is to interfere with the divine plan for the life of that person as designed by the author of life itself. Just as suicide is wrong for that reason (not that you can't also make a good case for suicide on occasion), so even "justified" killing of another is wrong, IMHO. Better to lose your life on this earth than to lose your eternal life in heaven.
Why Greek?...It was originally written in Hebrew...
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Old 08-06-2017, 07:32 AM
 
Location: New England
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
What about the conquest of the land of Canaan where G-d commands them to wipe them all out?...
Did God command them, or did they in their ignorance believe everything they devized and did from the heart was God putting them up to it ?.
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Old 08-06-2017, 07:51 AM
 
Location: US
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere View Post
We'd have to go back to the original Greek (or whatever it was) for a precise definition of "kill," as in "Thou shalt not kill."


I was hoping there would be some Bible scholars here who would already have done that?


I'm not saying you can't make a good argument for killing. But to do so is to interfere with the divine plan for the life of that person as designed by the author of life itself. Just as suicide is wrong for that reason (not that you can't also make a good case for suicide on occasion), so even "justified" killing of another is wrong, IMHO. Better to lose your life on this earth than to lose your eternal life in heaven.
Here is what the Hebrew says:

Shemot - Exodus - Chapter 20

13 You shall not murder. You shall not commit adultery. You shall not steal. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.




The words לֹ֖א תִּרְצָֽח [lo taratza] means "No murder"...

As opposed to this:

וְהַֽחֲרַמְתֶּם [V'h'cha'ram't'm]...And kill them...Where G-d has commanded...


3 Now, go, and you shall smite Amalek, and you shall utterly destroy all that is his, and you shall not have pity on him: and you shall slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.' "

עַתָּה֩ לֵ֨ךְ וְהִכִּֽיתָ֜ה אֶת־עֲמָלֵ֗ק וְהַֽחֲרַמְתֶּם֙ אֶת־כָּל־אֲשֶׁר־ל֔וֹ וְלֹ֥א תַחְמֹ֖ל עָלָ֑יו וְהֵמַתָּ֞ה מֵאִ֣ישׁ עַד־אִשָּׁ֗ה מֵֽעֹלֵל֙ וְעַד־יוֹנֵ֔ק מִשּׁ֣וֹר וְעַד־שֶֹ֔ה מִגָּמָ֖ל וְעַד־חֲמֽוֹר:
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Old 08-06-2017, 07:54 AM
 
Location: US
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otterhere View Post
Again, I don't recall the word being "murder," but "kill." Maybe it's my Catholic upbringing... :P
It is your English Christian edited Old Testament...The Hebrew word is murder...Not kill...
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Old 08-06-2017, 08:00 AM
 
Location: US
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ben Shunamit View Post
I do not care to join the discussion here of what is permissible in self-defense (others are doing just fine without my help), but on the subject of the ten commandments, I would like to contribute the following.

Some folks think that the Biblical command says, "Thou shalt not murder."

This is false, and its falsehood can be proved from the Bible itself. Exodus 20:13 says, "Lo tirtzach." Don't kill. The word "kill" (or, some contend, "murder") is spelled Resh Tsadhe Ches. Can we find this word elsewhere in the Bible where it will be perfectly clear whether it means "kill" or "murder?" In this particular case, yes! In Numbers 35:26-8, after extensive discussion of intentional vs. accidental killing and its relation to the cities of refuge, the Bible uses the word "rotzeach" (killer), spelled with the same root letters, to refer to an INNOCENT killer while describing the rules applying to him and those who would avenge his accidental victim's death. It also uses the same word, "ratzach," to describe the PERMISSIBLE killing of the accidental killer if the avenger of the blood finds him outside the city of refuge.

Without any doubt whatsoever, the proper translation of "Lo tirtzach" is "Don't kill." There are certainly exceptions to this commandment, as listed in the Bible itself, but that is what the words mean.

If you wish to study this further and do not read Hebrew, you should consult an orthodox rabbi with the references, or perhaps take a look at an interlinear translation [Zondervan?] of the Bible in a Christian bookstore. Obviously, if you read Hebrew, you need only look at those verses in any Chumash.
Shemot - Exodus - Chapter 20

13 You shall not murder. You shall not commit adultery. You shall not steal. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
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