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Old 04-12-2018, 08:08 AM
Status: "Amused by BF." (set 6 days ago)
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
23,262 posts, read 12,056,137 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SumTingy View Post
I wish the moderators were more on top on this forum. Many who post here are not Christian. They use the “Christian” tag to worm their way in so they can confront, argue and muddle the faith. Their belief has nothing to do with Jesus. They only use Him as a talisman or for straw man arguments. It is wrong, disrespectful, and disgraceful.
This is a forum for discussing Christianity - not a "Christian forum."

I am not a Christian but most of my family is and I used to be. If you want your own little playpen wherein everyone amens each other - there are plenty on the net which do not allow anything close to free speech. I've been banned from a few.

Seek and ye shall find. You won't be missed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
I guess they think it gives them the right to judge others and call God a "psychotic monster".
I personally don't call "God" a psychotic monster. I call that character in the OT who slaughtered everything out of pique a psychotic monster. I refer to it as "god" or a "godling" to differentiate it from whatever real "God" may exist.

We return you now to Rain's pleasant thread.
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Old 04-12-2018, 10:37 AM
 
Location: East Coast
30,138 posts, read 19,964,744 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
I guess they think it gives them the right to judge others and call God a "psychotic monster".
Then you make this judgement because universaists don't believe the scriptures teach eternal hell

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
They are deceived / brainwashed by other universalists.
You hate the thought that ET does not exist, it is the only reason you believe there is a God(your religious mind created it and condemned you into believing it), a very sad state to live out of if you ask me.
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Old 04-12-2018, 11:03 AM
 
1,401 posts, read 389,842 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RainMusic View Post
If you are a Universalist believer in Jesus Christ saving ALL, please feel free to post your personal experience of when and how you came to this persuasion.

Indeed Very Many: Universalism in the Early Church


Indeed Very Many: Universalism in the Early Church

In light of the very specific and plentiful teaching on hell this is an egregious heresy that gives false hope to many.......certainly any who spread this will certainly have it brought up later.......I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole.

This pollyanna view is in severe contrast to an experience my sister related from long ago in Palm Springs. She had a colleague and somehow the eternal came up and this gal said she had a story that related. We've all heard of the near death experiences and how most relate how the folks go gloriously towards a white light and feel great and can't wait to go back. Well this gal went in for surgery and she said while she was under apparently things didn't go well and she started slipping away........but it wasn't towards a white light. She said a horrible darkness engulfed her and she said a tornado like vortex was swirling all around her. Then to her horror she realized the things swirling around were snakes.........

Whether it was real or not the experience changed her life, and she couldn't wait to become a believer in Christ......there was no doubt she was headed for hell in her mind.........YMMV
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Old 04-12-2018, 11:25 AM
 
Location: On a road heaven bound !
10,290 posts, read 8,039,494 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
They are deceived / brainwashed by other universalists.
You know Finn, I believe the teaching of universalism brings much- confused thoughts and ideas of Hell, it is definitely a human minds theory. It is not God's thoughts, Spirit-led that are taught. Ur has twisted God's truth of hell into some unbelievable theories of what it's not about. It's just another game Satan has fooled, blinded people into believing to keep them in bondage to a mind of denying Christ and all that He taught about Hell.

Yes, Satan was there in the early church beginning his work of deception. He has tried since the beginning of time to stop the will of the Father.

Now, Jesus says those who do not believe in Him and abide in Him in what He taught by loving, honoring, and obeying His commandments, which by the way everything He spoke came from the Father, as He never spoke anything according to His own will and thoughts, but all His thoughts came from the Father, so everything He spoke especially about Hell those who do not believe Him, will one day stand at the Throne of God, judged for rejecting, denying this truth, and put in this place that scripture warns us about. And this Hell is for sure a place that God is not and satan so knows this and will do anything to keep one person blinded in a lie to God's truth.

So, to me, the torment of Hell, (ET) will be a life without our loving Heavenly Father. There will be no second chance as this judgment will be set for all eternity!

We, and what I mean we are that everyone born into this world has never been without God the Father in it, with us sustaining life.

Ur has taught and twisted the whole teaching of Hell, denying such a place as Satan knows ppl are very familiar with fear as fear can be a good emotion for our lives, protecting us from a danger. But in this case, this fear of hell is creating a denial especially to what Jesus warned us about hell. And this lie is keeping ppl in unbelief in Jesus and what He taught us of that which is to come for those who will reject and deny Him and the Father's will.
They have assumed, twisted something way beyond what is taught in scripture and again to keep those in denying Hell so they will not believe and trust God with His truth but walk and believe their own truth or satan truth.

To be honest, one does not know the complete truth of what will really happen to those who will be placed there. But we do know God will not be there and I believe that there will be its self an awful, terrible, scary state of mind, body, and soul. Being place somewhere without God will be a torment. Just the thought of being without God, will that scares me to try and survive a place somewhere ppl have no restraints, conscience, and are left to the darkness of their own imaginations and minds.

The truth is no one has ever experienced such a place, everything has been a speculation of what it's all going to be. All we have is the parable of the rich man and Lazarus that we are given and is somewhat of what it will be like for those who are judged and placed there. One will never be able to escape from such a place as God has set its time for all eternity.

I know this post most likely will be mocked, picked apart, criticised, torn into pieces as Satan hates God's truth and those who trust and walk with God. He will do anything to stop God's word and truth from setting someone free from such false teaching as universalism. As it keeps one blinded and walking in the wrong direction, a direction of denial, a life of unbelief, and denying Christ Jesus' love setting them free. As Jesus said the truth shall set you free, amen.
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Old 04-12-2018, 11:32 AM
 
Location: Panama City, FL
2,569 posts, read 725,377 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SumTingy View Post
I wish the moderators were more on top on this forum. Many who post here are not Christian. They use the “Christian” tag to worm their way in so they can confront, argue and muddle the faith. Their belief has nothing to do with Jesus. They only use Him as a talisman or for straw man arguments. It is wrong, disrespectful, and disgraceful.
If they were taking note of this thread, they would tell you that it against the TOS to label others "NOT CHRISTIAN" just because they do not believe as you do.

My belief has EVERYTHING to do with Jesus Christ - the whole of salvation of humanity is wrapped up in HIM.

What is disGRACEful is when you do not teach God's grace. That is what those who preach eternal torment do - they say that God is not full of grace and mercy. They like to think they can hoard God's grace and only give it to whom they approve of. That is very arrogant and it is as if you are making yourself God.

I am still open to the possibility of annihilation. Why? Because of the vast amount of injustice and wickedness in the world. I am not sure if people who have raped and murdered children and hated everything that is good will ever find God's grace. But even so, I do not believe God would punish the super wicked with eternal torment, much less the ignorant average person who tries to do what is right but doesn't know everything about God's plans. For you to believe that a person has to know exactly what God's thoughts are to be qualified for his grace is outrageous.
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Old 04-12-2018, 11:42 AM
 
Location: Panama City, FL
2,569 posts, read 725,377 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber Munchkin View Post
You know Finn, I believe the teaching of universalism brings much- confused thoughts and ideas of Hell, it is definitely a human minds theory. It is not God's thoughts, Spirit-led that are taught. Ur has twisted God's truth of hell into some unbelievable theories of what it's not about. It's just another game Satan has fooled, blinded people into believing to keep them in bondage to a mind of denying Christ and all that He taught about Hell.

Yes, Satan was there in the early church beginning his work of deception. He has tried since the beginning of time to stop the will of the Father.

Now, Jesus says those who do not believe in Him and abide in Him in what He taught by loving, honoring, and obeying His commandments, which by the way everything He spoke came from the Father, as He never spoke anything according to His own will and thoughts, but all His thoughts came from the Father, so everything He spoke especially about Hell those who do not believe Him, will one day stand at the Throne of God, judged for rejecting, denying this truth, and put in this place that scripture warns us about. And this Hell is for sure a place that God is not and satan so knows this and will do anything to keep one person blinded in a lie to God's truth.

So, to me, the torment of Hell, (ET) will be a life without our loving Heavenly Father. There will be no second chance as this judgment will be set for all eternity!

We, and what I mean we are that everyone born into this world has never been without God the Father in it, with us sustaining life.

Ur has taught and twisted the whole teaching of Hell, denying such a place as Satan knows ppl are very familiar with fear as fear can be a good emotion for our lives, protecting us from a danger. But in this case, this fear of hell is creating a denial especially to what Jesus warned us about hell. And this lie is keeping ppl in unbelief in Jesus and what He taught us of that which is to come for those who will reject and deny Him and the Father's will.
They have assumed, twisted something way beyond what is taught in scripture and again to keep those in denying Hell so they will not believe and trust God with His truth but walk and believe their own truth or satan truth.

To be honest, one does not know the complete truth of what will really happen to those who will be placed there. But we do know God will not be there and I believe that there will be its self an awful, terrible, scary state of mind, body, and soul. Being place somewhere without God will be a torment. Just the thought of being without God, will that scares me to try and survive a place somewhere ppl have no restraints, conscience, and are left to the darkness of their own imaginations and minds.

The truth is no one has ever experienced such a place, everything has been a speculation of what it's all going to be. All we have is the parable of the rich man and Lazarus that we are given and is somewhat of what it will be like for those who are judged and placed there. One will never be able to escape from such a place as God has set its time for all eternity.

I know this post most likely will be mocked, picked apart, criticised, torn into pieces as Satan hates God's truth and those who trust and walk with God. He will do anything to stop God's word and truth from setting someone free from such false teaching as universalism. As it keeps one blinded and walking in the wrong direction, a direction of denial, a life of unbelief, and denying Christ Jesus' love setting them free. As Jesus said the truth shall set you free, amen.
You just could not keep out of this thread, could you? I invited people who believe in Universalism to post their experiences in this thread and you did not have enough self control to refrain from posting your foolish drivel about Satan, and all your other fearful blah, blah, blah and once again taking the parable of Lazarus and the Rich man completely literally. Go ahead and insert your crazy, fearful dogma here. Let the fearful, hateful people take over this thread. I figured it would happen eventually because some people REALLY HATE GOD"S GRACE. You lurk for months UNTIL God's grace appears and then you have to pop out of solitude to shoot down such talk of MERCY. You are the one who is deceived with the MANY.

It is ridiculous that you actually believe God is going to LOSE a contest with SATAN and lose any soul that He/God desires. You make God sound powerless. Well God is not powerless. He will GET ALL HE DESIRES.

In your way of thinking, a parent must sit around wringing his hands over children who may not have had a relationship with God in this world and been taken away early. That is pathetic. Shame on you and all who teach that God is unmerciful and has allowed children to slip away into eternal hell because he gave everyone free will. Read the book of Romans and you will soon find out that there is NO FREE WILL. Do you really think God would leave something as important as the very SALVATION of souls up to imperfect, sinful, mortals? How foolish!

I wonder how well you would hold up if you were living in a place like Syria or Yemen? You seem to be easily frightened. If America becomes a living hell hole (and it could), I wonder who will keep the faith unto the end? The timid ETers or those who trust God completely.

Last edited by RainMusic; 04-12-2018 at 11:50 AM..
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Old 04-12-2018, 11:43 AM
 
37,477 posts, read 25,224,572 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RainMusic View Post
If they were taking note of this thread, they would tell you that it against the TOS to label others "NOT CHRISTIAN" just because they do not believe as you do.

My belief has EVERYTHING to do with Jesus Christ - the whole of salvation of humanity is wrapped up in HIM.

What is disGRACEful is when you do not teach God's grace. That is what those who preach eternal torment do - they say that God is not full of grace and mercy. They like to think they can hoard God's grace and only give it to whom they approve of. That is very arrogant and it is as if you are making yourself God.

I am still open to the possibility of annihilation. Why? Because of the vast amount of injustice and wickedness in the world. I am not sure if people who have raped and murdered children and hated everything that is good will ever find God's grace. But even so, I do not believe God would punish the super wicked with eternal torment, much less the ignorant average person who tries to do what is right but doesn't know everything about God's plans. For you to believe that a person has to know exactly what God's thoughts are to be qualified for his grace is outrageous.
Well said, Rain!
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Old 04-12-2018, 11:52 AM
 
Location: On a road heaven bound !
10,290 posts, read 8,039,494 times
Reputation: 17783
Quote:
Originally Posted by RainMusic View Post
You just could not keep out of this thread, could you? I invited people who believe in Universalism to post their experiences in this thread and you did not have enough self control to refrain from posting your foolish drivel about Satan, and all your other fearful blah, blah, blah and once again taking the parable of Lazarus and the Rich man completely literally. Go ahead and insert your crazy, fearful dogma here. Let the fearful, hateful people take over this thread. I figured it would happen eventually because some people REALLY HATE GOD"S GRACE. You lurk for months UNTIL God's grace appears and then you have to pop out of solitude to shoot down such talk of MERCY. You are the one who is deceived with the MANY.

It is ridiculous that you actually believe God is going to LOSE a contest with SATAN and lose any soul that He/God desires. You make God sound powerless. Well God is not powerless. He will GET ALL HE DESIRES.

In your way of thinking, a parent must sit around wringing his hands over children who may not have had a relationship with God in this world and been taken away early. That is pathetic. Shame on you and all who teach that God is unmerciful and has allowed children to slip away into eternal hell because he gave everyone free will. Read the book of Romans and you will soon find out that there is NO FREE WILL. Do you really think God would leave something as important as the very SALVATION of souls up to imperfect, sinful, mortals? How foolish!

I wonder how well you would hold up if you were living in a place like Syria or Yemen? You seem to be easily frightened. If America becomes a living hell hole (and it could), I wonder who will keep the faith unto the end? The timid ETers or those who trust God completely.
I believe you are the one deceived if you are trusting this teaching and do hope that one day you are set free. The anger spew is definitely not of one who knows the true grace of God. I'm sorry you feel the way you do, I apologize I didn't truly realize this thread was for universalist ONLY !

I do hope though one day that anger is healed!

Blessings to you !
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Old 04-12-2018, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Panama City, FL
2,569 posts, read 725,377 times
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Romans Chapter 8 New Living Translation

14 For all who are led by the Spirit of God are children 8:14 Greek sons; also in 8:19. of God.

15 So you have not received a spirit that makes you fearful slaves. Instead, you received God’s Spirit when he adopted you as his own

children. 8:15a Greek you received a spirit of sonship. Now we call him, “Abba, Father.” 8:15b Abba is an Aramaic term for “father.”

16 For his Spirit joins with our spirit to affirm that we are God’s children. 17 And since we are his children, we are his heirs. In fact, together

with Christ we are heirs of God’s glory. But if we are to share his glory, we must also share his suffering.

18 Yet what we suffer now is nothing compared to the glory he will reveal to us later. 19 [u]For all creation is waiting eagerly for that

future day when God will reveal who his children really are. 20Against its will, all creation was subjected to God’s curse.
But with

eager hope, 21 the creation looks forward to the day when it will join God’s children in glorious freedom from death and decay.


22 For we know that all creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time. 23And we believers also groan,

even though we have the Holy Spirit within us as a foretaste of future glory, for we long for our bodies to be released from sin and suffering.

We, too, wait with eager hope for the day when God will give us our full rights as his adopted children, 8:23 Greek wait anxiously for sonship.

including the new bodies he has promised us. 24 We were given this hope when we were saved. (If we already have something, we don’t

need to hope 8:24 Some manuscripts read wait. for it. 25 But if we look forward to something we don’t yet have, we must wait patiently and confidently.)

26 And the Holy Spirit helps us in our weakness. For example, we don’t know what God wants us to pray for. But the Holy Spirit prays for us

with groanings that cannot be expressed in words. 27 And the Father who knows all hearts knows what the Spirit is saying, for the Spirit

pleads for us believers 8:27 Greek for God’s holy people. in harmony with God’s own will. 28 And we know that God causes everything to

work together 8:28 Some manuscripts read And we know that everything works together. for the good of those who love God and are called

according to his purpose for them. 29 For God knew his people in advance, and he chose them to become like his Son, so that his Son would

be the firstborn 8:29 Or would be supreme. among many brothers and sisters. 30 And having chosen them, he called them to come to him.

And having called them, he gave them right standing with himself. And having given them right standing, he gave them his glory.

Nothing Can Separate Us from God’s Love

31 What shall we say about such wonderful things as these? If God is for us, who can ever be against us? 32 Since he did not spare even his

own Son but gave him up for us all, won’t he also give us everything else? 33 Who dares accuse us whom God has chosen for his own? No

one—for God himself has given us right standing with himself. 34 Who then will condemn us? No one—for Christ Jesus died for us and was

raised to life for us, and he is sitting in the place of honor at God’s right hand, pleading for us.

35Can anything ever separate us from Christ’s love? Does it mean he no longer loves us if we have trouble or calamity, or are persecuted, or

hungry, or destitute, or in danger, or threatened with death? 36 (As the Scriptures say, “For your sake we are killed every day; we are

being slaughtered like sheep.”8:36 Ps 44:22.) 37 No, despite all these things, overwhelming victory is ours through Christ, who loved us.

38 And I am convinced that nothing can ever separate us from God’s love. Neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, 8:38 Greek nor

rulers. neither our fears for today nor our worries about tomorrow—not even the powers of hell can separate us from God’s love. 39 No power

in the sky above or in the earth below—indeed, nothing in all creation will ever be able to separate us from the love of God that is revealed

in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Last edited by RainMusic; 04-12-2018 at 01:10 PM..
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Old 04-12-2018, 12:00 PM
 
Location: Panama City, FL
2,569 posts, read 725,377 times
Reputation: 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber Munchkin View Post
I believe you are the one deceived if you are trusting this teaching and do hope that one day you are set free. The anger spew is definitely not of one who knows the true grace of God. I'm sorry you feel the way you do, I apologize I didn't truly realize this thread was for universalist ONLY !

I do hope though one day that anger is healed!

Blessings to you !
You may think I am deceived, but you would be wrong. Am I angry when people teach that God is like a diabolical monster - that God is like Satan? Yes, that does make me angry. You do it because you only deal in fear, not in love. Whoever fears is not made perfect in love. I do not expect you to change. You may or may not come to a knowledge of the truth in this world, but I'm not worried that God will send you to eternal torment for distorting his image. However, I do think you will be surprised when you realize that is what you are doing.
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