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Old 08-20-2018, 10:03 AM
 
Location: Florida
63,104 posts, read 34,367,413 times
Reputation: 10490

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wardendresden View Post
It's time to repeat the Tale of Two Chairs, at least for the benefit of someone's mommy.
There aren't too many churches who teach "version 1", or at least I have never been to one which teaches God turned His back on people (He spoke to Abraham, his sons, Moses, sent the prophets, sent Christ etc). The Bible does not teach such thing, so any church teaching it, is not a Bible based church. For whatever reason, your guy on the video seems to think it is a common teaching.

Last edited by Finn_Jarber; 08-20-2018 at 10:40 AM..
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Old 08-20-2018, 10:05 AM
 
21,903 posts, read 16,711,964 times
Reputation: 8732
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wardendresden View Post
You have no respect for the words of Jesus. Period.

You've done it again, proving your own paganism in worshipping the Bible while denying its message.


You may love your Bible but you don't follow His commandments.

You speak of Peter Enns. Read his latest book, The Sin of Certainty where he rebukes those of your ilk for being so certain they miss the truth altogether.
I do hope that you're not going to start to cry. Hey, if you don't want to listen to me, I'm fine with that. After all, I don't listen to anything you have to say either.

By the way, in one of his parables Jesus has God calling a man a fool. Luke 12:20. So do be sure to rebuke God as well.
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Old 08-20-2018, 10:11 AM
 
Location: New England
32,239 posts, read 21,123,632 times
Reputation: 2280
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
There aren't too many churches who teach "version 1", or at least I have never been to on which teaches God turned His back on people. The Bible does not teach such thing, so any church teaching it, is not a Bible based church. For whatever reason, your guy on the video seems to think it is a common teaching.
Well, if you believe in separation from God, then of cause you believe God has turned his back on you and will remain that way until you go through all the channels and loop holes that YOU believe make you a christian.
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Old 08-20-2018, 10:13 AM
Status: "6' - 220" (set 1 day ago)
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
25,855 posts, read 13,436,135 times
Reputation: 11686
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
I do hope that you're not going to start to cry. Hey, if you don't want to listen to me, I'm fine with that. After all, I don't listen to anything you have to say either.

This, in a nutshell, is why there are 35,000+ denominations of Christianity.
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Old 08-20-2018, 10:14 AM
 
Location: USA
15,906 posts, read 8,177,909 times
Reputation: 2103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wardendresden View Post
It's time to repeat the Tale of Two Chairs, at least for the benefit of someone's mommy.

There are really TWO broad views of how God responds to mankind Sophiesmommy. You have chosen the same on I grew up believing, but have now discarded along with fundamentalism.

Watch the video carefully. The speaker accurately describes both views. But it is YOU who must decide which one looks more like Jesus:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUWLcQAsgHs


Who is the speaker?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruxy_Cavey

Thanks for posting that video, Warden.
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Old 08-20-2018, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Denver, CO
9,293 posts, read 5,500,064 times
Reputation: 4052
Default From The Sin of Certainty

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Even the scholar you look up to, Peter Enns, agrees that the Bible is the word of God.
''Is the fact of diversity fundamentally contrary to the Bible being the word of God? My answer is no. And the way in which we can begin to address this is issue is to confess at the outset along with the historic Christian church, that the Bible is the word of God.''

''Moreover, inasmuch as Scripture is the word of God, I would expect multiple layers of meaning insofar as no one person, school, or tradition can exhaust the depth of God's word.''

''How do we incorporate certain data with full integrity without sacrificing the truth that the Bible is God's book for his people?''

''Inspiration and Incarnation puts forward a less problematic model of Scripture while also encouraging faith that the Bible is God's word.''

''Paul's midrashic hermeneutic is firmly at home in Second Temple Judism (rather than modern evangelical hermeneutics ), and Paul's letters are God's word . . .''

Inspiration and Incarnation, Peter Enns, pp.96, 151, 157, 173, 175
So stop being a judgmental fool. On the other hand, be a judgmental fool. That's really your problem. No one else's.
From Peter Enns' book, The Sin of Certainty: (chapters given only---it is an e-book)

Quote:
It is so easy to slip into 'right thinking' mode---that we have arrived at full faith. We know what church God goes to, what Bible translation God prefers, how God votes, what movies God watches, and what books God reads. We know the kinds of people God approves of. God has winners and losers, and we are the winners, the true insiders. God likes all the things we like. We speak for God and think nothing of it.

All Christians I've ever met who take their faith seriously sooner or later get caught up in thinking that God really is what we think God is, that there is little more worth learning about the Creator of the cosmos. God becomes the face in the mirror."
Chapter The Lie: It's All Your Fault

Quote:
"Wanting clarity is seeking some sort of control."
Chapter Down the Mine Shaft

Quote:
"Dying now the way Jesus says to means letting go already of every comfort, familiarity, joy, and sorrow--and of the false sense of control those things give us. Letting go of these things is a dying process."
Chapter The Truth: God Wants You Dead

You are a control freak, Mike, and the Bible means nothing to you except for your own view of it and your prideful ability to interpret it.

God wants you dead--so that you can live again by being obedient to Jesus.
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Old 08-20-2018, 10:21 AM
 
Location: Denver, CO
9,293 posts, read 5,500,064 times
Reputation: 4052
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
I do hope that you're not going to start to cry. Hey, if you don't want to listen to me, I'm fine with that. After all, I don't listen to anything you have to say either.

By the way, in one of his parables Jesus has God calling a man a fool. Luke 12:20. So do be sure to rebuke God as well.
Yep, but Jesus words in Matthew were in the Sermon on the Mount. He was speaking to potential followers which you have proven you are incapable of doing.
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Old 08-20-2018, 10:30 AM
 
Location: Gulf Coast Texas
28,506 posts, read 15,466,875 times
Reputation: 11420
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wardendresden View Post
It's time to repeat the Tale of Two Chairs, at least for the benefit of someone's mommy.

There are really TWO broad views of how God responds to mankind Sophiesmommy. You have chosen the same on I grew up believing, but have now discarded along with fundamentalism.

Watch the video carefully. The speaker accurately describes both views. But it is YOU who must decide which one looks more like Jesus:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUWLcQAsgHs


Who is the speaker?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruxy_Cavey
Watched the video... my comments

The gospel round 1

Incorrect assertion (1:57) - With the exception of Adam, we do not start life with an intimate relationship w/ God and then turn our back on Him. We are physically born dead to God. We don't choose to turn our back... we are already separated from God when we are physically born.

Incorrect assertion (2:23) - God turned His back on us. That's false. Otherwise, He would have not sent Christ - which was His plan from Genesis 3.

Incorrect assertion (3:29) - Jesus did not die to put wrath aside. He died as a sacrifice for sin because when there is sin there needs to be a death that pays for it. And Jesus' death is sufficient to pay for the sins of the entire world.

The gospel round 2

Incorrect assertion (6:23) - God does not push people away in judgment - this is not true. John 8. He told the Pharisees they would die in their sin. How come he can recall the first part of John 8 with the woman, but miss the latter part of chapter 8 when he judges the Pharisees?

So he seems to use false statements and attach them to certain people he thinks are associated with the first gospel. In other words - he sets up a straw man to knock down.
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Old 08-20-2018, 10:36 AM
 
Location: New England
32,239 posts, read 21,123,632 times
Reputation: 2280
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
Watched the video... my comments

The gospel round 1

Incorrect assertion (1:57) - With the exception of Adam, we do not start life with an intimate relationship w/ God and then turn our back on Him. We are physically born dead to God. We don't choose to turn our back... we are already separated from God when we are physically born.

Incorrect assertion (2:23) - God turned His back on us. That's false. Otherwise, He would have not sent Christ - which was His plan from Genesis 3.

Incorrect assertion (3:29) - Jesus did not die to put wrath aside. He died as a sacrifice for sin because when there is sin there needs to be a death that pays for it. And Jesus' death is sufficient to pay for the sins of the entire world.

The gospel round 2

Incorrect assertion (6:23) - God does not push people away in judgment - this is not true. John 8. He told the Pharisees they would die in their sin. How come he can recall the first part of John 8 with the woman, but miss the latter part of chapter 8 when he judges the Pharisees?

So he seems to use false statements and attach them to certain people he thinks are associated with the first gospel. In other words - he sets up a straw man to knock down.
God according to evangelicals has separated himself from us because of our sin, how is that any different from turning his back on us. You know perfectly well you believe there is a gulf between God and man unless man reaches out to Jesus that separation who back turning still exists. If God has not turned his back on us then there is nothing to be concerned about , right?. Is not that a fair statement?.

Last edited by pcamps; 08-20-2018 at 11:01 AM..
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Old 08-20-2018, 10:54 AM
 
Location: Florida
63,104 posts, read 34,367,413 times
Reputation: 10490
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
Watched the video... my comments

The gospel round 1

Incorrect assertion (1:57) - With the exception of Adam, we do not start life with an intimate relationship w/ God and then turn our back on Him. We are physically born dead to God. We don't choose to turn our back... we are already separated from God when we are physically born.

Incorrect assertion (2:23) - God turned His back on us. That's false. Otherwise, He would have not sent Christ - which was His plan from Genesis 3.

Incorrect assertion (3:29) - Jesus did not die to put wrath aside. He died as a sacrifice for sin because when there is sin there needs to be a death that pays for it. And Jesus' death is sufficient to pay for the sins of the entire world.

The gospel round 2

Incorrect assertion (6:23) - God does not push people away in judgment - this is not true. John 8. He told the Pharisees they would die in their sin. How come he can recall the first part of John 8 with the woman, but miss the latter part of chapter 8 when he judges the Pharisees?

So he seems to use false statements and attach them to certain people he thinks are associated with the first gospel. In other words - he sets up a straw man to knock down.
Yes, it fails at many levels.
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