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Old 10-26-2018, 06:39 PM
 
21,925 posts, read 16,727,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZacharyB View Post
At the moment you were born-again …
you were only forgiven of the sins you had committed up to that point in time!

“For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness,
and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his OLD sins.
Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call
and election sure, for IF you do these things you will never stumble;
for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting
kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.” (2 Peter 1:9-11, NKJV)
“OLD sins” is also in the KJV, RSV, NLT, AMP

“having forgotten his purification from his FORMER sins.” (2 Peter 1:9, NASB)
“FORMER sins” is also in the ESV

forgetting that they have been cleansed from their PAST sins.(2 Peter 1:9, NIV)
“PAST sins” is also in the HCSB

Now for some confirming NT passages …

Paul wrote this to the Corinthian church concerning his words of rebuke
in 1 Corinthians that he had sent to them concerning some particular sin(s).
They really needed to be sorrowful and repent.

“… the pain (from his rebuke) caused you to repent and change your ways.
It was the kind of sorrow God wants His people to have, so you were not
harmed by us in any way. For the kind of sorrow God wants us to experience
leads us away from sin and results in salvation. … worldly sorrow, which lacks
repentance, results in spiritual (eternal) death.” (2 Corinthians 7:8-10, NLT)

“Yes, I am afraid that when I come again, God will humble me in your presence.
And I will be grieved because many of you have not given up your old sins.
You have not repented of your impurity, sexual immorality,
and eagerness for lustful pleasure.(2 Corinthians 12:21, NLT)

Peter is warning believers about God’s destruction of all ungodly and unholy people:
“Then he used the water to destroy the ancient (ungodly) world … the day of judgment,
when ungodly people will be destroyed. … He is being patient for your sake. He does not
want anyone to be destroyed (perish spiritually), but (he) wants everyone to repent.
… what holy and godly lives you should live … (you) make every effort to be found living
peaceful lives that are pure and blameless in his sight. … I am warning you ahead of time
… Be on guard so that you will not be carried away by the errors …” (2 Peter 3:6-17, NLT)

John gives the condition for the Lord to forgive believers’ present sins:
“But if we confess our sins to him, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins
and to cleanse us from all wickedness (unrighteousness).” (1 John 1:9, NLT)
This is an extremely important verse … all men need to be repeatedly purified from all
unrighteousness – from all their sins … We must confess our sins and turn from them
… We must also confess them with our actions … (John) is talking here about repentance
… we must hate our sins and turn from them. This is true repentance.
(The Applied New Testament Commentary; Dr. Thomas Hale)

2 verses later, John reminds believers to ask Jesus to plead our case before the Father:
“My dear children, I am writing this to you so that you will not sin.
But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate who pleads our case before
the Father. He is Jesus Christ, the one who is truly righteous.” (1 John 2:1, NLT)

Believers are responsible for repenting of their sins after they are born-again!
They have been given the Holy Spirit, a totally new nature, and God’s word.
So, they have been enabled to be victorious overcomers over sin, the world,
and the devil. They have no excuse for failing to do this.
In a relational sense, it's true that at the moment a person receives Jesus as Savior only his sins up to the time he becomes a believer are forgiven. Thereafter, every time he commits a sin as a believer he needs, not to repent, but to simply acknowledge the sin to God as per 1 John 1:9 in order to be restored to fellowship and regain, not the indwelling of the Spirit which he can never lose, but the filling of the Spirit.

That's in a relational sense which has to do with the believer's temporal fellowship with God. But in a judicial sense, ALL of our sins were judged, and in that sense, forgiven at the cross. As Colossians 2:13 says, all of our sins have been forgiven.
Col. 2:13 When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions, 14] having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.
The Greek word translated as 'all' in verse 13 is πάντα - panta, the plural form of πᾶς, and means 'each, every, whole, all.' All of our sins were forgiven at the cross in a judicial sense, the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us having been taken out of the way. Sin committed as a believer puts you out of temporal fellowship until you name the sin to God who then forgives that sin in a relational sense. But your eternal salvation is never in jeopardy because of sin committed as a believer.

As Hebrews 10:10 says, Christ died once for all. He died once for all people, and for all the sins that will ever be committed by anyone and everyone. He died for the sins of those who will never receive Him as Savior and will spend the eternal future in the lake of fire. Therefore the issue in salvation isn't sin, because all sin was judged and paid for at the cross. The issue in salvation is whether a person will simply receive Jesus as Savior. He died for all the sins you will ever commit as a believer - Judicially. That is why God is able to forgive the sin you commit as a believer in a relational sense when you simply name the sin.
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Old 10-26-2018, 07:16 PM
 
101 posts, read 33,145 times
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Mike,
I'd say you are ignoring (not dealing with) verses in the OP.


These 2 verses have been brought to my attention recently …

“Repent of your wickedness and pray to the Lord.
Perhaps he will forgive your evil thoughts (i.e. sins).” (Acts 8:22, NLT)

“Dear friends, if we deliberately continue sinning after we have
received knowledge of the truth, there is no longer any sacrifice
that will cover these sins” (Hebrews 10:26, NLT)
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Old 10-26-2018, 08:23 PM
 
21,925 posts, read 16,727,596 times
Reputation: 8737
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
In a relational sense, it's true that at the moment a person receives Jesus as Savior only his sins up to the time he becomes a believer are forgiven. Thereafter, every time he commits a sin as a believer he needs, not to repent, but to simply acknowledge the sin to God as per 1 John 1:9 in order to be restored to fellowship and regain, not the indwelling of the Spirit which he can never lose, but the filling of the Spirit.

That's in a relational sense which has to do with the believer's temporal fellowship with God. But in a judicial sense, ALL of our sins were judged, and in that sense, forgiven at the cross. As Colossians 2:13 says, all of our sins have been forgiven.
Col. 2:13 When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions, 14] having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.
The Greek word translated as 'all' in verse 13 is πάντα - panta, the plural form of πᾶς, and means 'each, every, whole, all.' All of our sins were forgiven at the cross in a judicial sense, the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us having been taken out of the way. Sin committed as a believer puts you out of temporal fellowship until you name the sin to God who then forgives that sin in a relational sense. But your eternal salvation is never in jeopardy because of sin committed as a believer.

As Hebrews 10:10 says, Christ died once for all. He died once for all people, and for all the sins that will ever be committed by anyone and everyone. He died for the sins of those who will never receive Him as Savior and will spend the eternal future in the lake of fire. Therefore the issue in salvation isn't sin, because all sin was judged and paid for at the cross. The issue in salvation is whether a person will simply receive Jesus as Savior. He died for all the sins you will ever commit as a believer - Judicially. That is why God is able to forgive the sin you commit as a believer in a relational sense when you simply name the sin.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZacharyB View Post
Mike,
I'd say you are ignoring (not dealing with) verses in the OP.


These 2 verses have been brought to my attention recently …

“Repent of your wickedness and pray to the Lord.
Perhaps he will forgive your evil thoughts (i.e. sins).” (Acts 8:22, NLT)

“Dear friends, if we deliberately continue sinning after we have
received knowledge of the truth, there is no longer any sacrifice
that will cover these sins” (Hebrews 10:26, NLT)
Are you not ignoring the verses that I posted? Did you even make any attempt to understand what I said? If all sin was forgiven at the cross as Colossians 2:13 states, if Christ died once for all as stated in Hebrews 10:10, that means that His death paid for every sin that anyone will ever commit. Otherwise, any sin that the believer commits after salvation would be a sin that Jesus didn't die for and therefore could not be forgiven. Yet, because Jesus did die for every sin the believer will ever commit after salvation all the believer has to do when he sins is what 1 John 1:9 states.
1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
To confess or name your sin is not repentance. The word for repent in the Greek is μετανοέω - metanoeó and it means to change your mind about something. As far as Peter telling Simon in Acts 8:22, Simon had to understand that he couldn't buy the gift of God with money. But as far as committing a sin goes, you simply name it and because it was judged at the cross, God forgives it.

Regarding Hebrews 10:26, that verse is simply restating what the writer of Hebrews said in Hebrews 10:18 which is 'Now where there is forgiveness of these things, there is no longer any offering for sin.'

In other words, because Jesus offered Himself once for all as Hebrews 10:10 says, there is no need for any other offering. No matter how much a believer sins, the one offering of Jesus has already paid for it. That is what is being said in both Hebrews 10:18 and in 10:26. The same thing is being said in different ways.

Listen. If Hebrews 10:26 was saying that willful sin was not covered by the one time sacrifice of Jesus, then you couldn't be forgiven of willful sin no matter how much you name it as per 1 John 1:9. And no matter how much you may 'repent.' The only reason that any sin, willful or not, is because the sin was judged and judicially forgiven at the cross.

The whole point of this section in Hebrews is that all sin has been taken care of by the one time sacrifice of Jesus so that if you sin willfully, just remember that sin is not the issue anymore because there's no more sacrifice for sin – it was taken care of at the cross. That is what both Hebrews 10:18 and 10:26 are saying. So while sin has consequences in time in the form of divine discipline (see Hebrews 12:5-11), and the believer can lose eternal rewards at the judgment seat of Christ, the believer's eternal salvation is not at risk.
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Old 10-26-2018, 10:15 PM
 
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For ALL of Humanity have been forgiven, not just the believer's.
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Old 10-26-2018, 11:51 PM
 
40,129 posts, read 26,779,715 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
For ALL of Humanity have been forgiven, not just the believers.
Amen. Humanity was "missing the mark" but once Jesus "hit the mark" the pressure was off of the rest of us.
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Old 10-27-2018, 06:51 AM
 
5,441 posts, read 4,872,309 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rbbi1 View Post
How do you figure that? You're the one basically promoting nothing major happens until you physically die, literally. You DIE TO SELF in this life, and THAT is how your spirit man matures. Death of the body, has absolutely no benefit to your Spirit man at all. All it does is rob Him of a temple to dwell in; it is a THIEF, and an enemy. Why do you think the last enemy to be OVERCOME is death?

You don't overcome death by dying, you overcome it BY NOT DYING. Death is our enemy, but man has been dying for so long he now thinks it's "normal". In reality, it's not, it's a byproduct of the fall in the garden. He said He was going to do a thing in the last days that we would not believe even if someone told us. It's because HE has to tell you, personally. Ask Him. Blessings....
Amen. Blessings to you and yours....
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Old 10-27-2018, 06:54 AM
 
5,441 posts, read 4,872,309 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rbbi1 View Post
No, first baptism is water to symbolize being baptized into the likeness of His death. Second baptism is to be baptized in His Spirit, which is the Holy Ghost and is fire, and it is being baptized into the likeness of His life, which is one of power, the power of the Holy Ghost, symbolic of being raised up like being resurrected from the dead (the water one is like being lowered into a grave). Jesus told John that BOTH baptisms were necessary for ALL RIGHTEOUSNESS. Thus also, the scripture about those who have a form of Godliness, but deny the POWER thereof. In proper context, it all makes perfect sense. Out of context, it's a mess.....Blessings...
Amen again. He shall baptize with the Holy Ghost and FIRE.
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Old 10-27-2018, 06:57 AM
 
5,441 posts, read 4,872,309 times
Reputation: 1127
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZacharyB View Post
Mike,
I'd say you are ignoring (not dealing with) verses in the OP.


These 2 verses have been brought to my attention recently …

“Repent of your wickedness and pray to the Lord.
Perhaps he will forgive your evil thoughts (i.e. sins).” (Acts 8:22, NLT)

“Dear friends, if we deliberately continue sinning after we have
received knowledge of the truth, there is no longer any sacrifice
that will cover these sins” (Hebrews 10:26, NLT)
Amen. Keep preaching!
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Old 10-27-2018, 06:59 AM
 
5,441 posts, read 4,872,309 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
For ALL of Humanity have been forgiven, not just the believer's.
This is such false doctrine that it doesn't even belong on a Christian forum. Sad.
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Old 10-27-2018, 07:32 AM
 
Location: New England
32,278 posts, read 21,136,395 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scgraham View Post
This is such false doctrine that it doesn't even belong on a Christian forum. Sad.
The trouble with you fundies is you live your life in fear of having wrong beliefs. If God hasn't forgiven all, then i just did for him.
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