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Old 10-23-2018, 03:46 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,955 posts, read 22,099,030 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monastic555 View Post
Requests made to dead Saints have been known to have been answered. For example, a request made to the deceased St. Damien of Molokai. It was a Hawaiian lady who got healed of an incurable disease.
Do you suppose the lady might also have prayed to God? And who was responsible for her cure? God or St. Damien?
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Old 10-23-2018, 05:00 PM
Status: "We The North" (set 25 days ago)
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
25,757 posts, read 13,395,224 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katzpur View Post
Do you suppose the lady might also have prayed to God? And who was responsible for her cure? God or St. Damien?

Tough to prove, I'm thinkin'. Either way.


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Old 10-24-2018, 10:35 AM
 
Location: In Sticky San Antonio TX
1,437 posts, read 2,554,213 times
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It is suggested we are surrounded by a cloud of witnesses. G-d is the G-d of the living, referring to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. I can't imagine any of these other persons are absent from our presence and deaf to our petitions. I believe Satan and demons can answer prayers as well, relative to being present when persons pray. Samuel returning from the dead on request of the sorceress when Saul prayed for him to be brought back is an example of the witness from the dead.

It is not unusual to request others to pray on your behalf. I don't have a problem with others petitioning the saints or VM to collaborate with them in their prayer. I think all my friends pray for me when I ask them. I don't see I am being denied if I have a request for the saints beyond, even my father, mother, or others who have died.
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Old 10-24-2018, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
16,256 posts, read 7,644,495 times
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Well, yes, Kin, but then you don't seem to have a reason to condemn a rival religious tradition.
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Old 10-24-2018, 12:25 PM
 
Location: USA
237 posts, read 87,599 times
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Worship God alone; and pray for one another.
Ya'll seem to be confused about difference between 'worship' and 'prayer'.


petitions to saints seeking intercession is NOT worship to them...



Read your bible; says right there in James 5:16 to pray for one another.
Here, I'll quote it for you:
James 5:16 "therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective".


1 Tim. 2:1–4 also instructs us to pray,petition,ask intercession.....



Saints are (righteous) persons that are already in heaven - Even the Angel Gabriel addressed Mary as 'Hail Full Of Grace' (yep, in your bible too); If you can't accept that, then at least petition Dismas to pray for you (remember JESUS told Dismas "...amen I say to you , today you will be with me in paradise..." Luke 23:43), yep right there in your bible , one of the churches FIRST saints.... the penitent thief .... or do you not believe Jesus??
Certainly TWO righteous persons that you CAN be asking to PRAY (intercession) for you!


you are ALSO welcome to ask fellow Christians to pray for you, just as I now will pray (to God) for all you above to now receive New & special Graces from HIM (directly) to understand this, If it HIS will, and I will petition the Entire Heavenly Choir of Saints and Angels to enjoin this petition (intercede) as I am but lowly sinner still stuck here on earth and my prayers (alone) are weak!

Last edited by CCCyou; 10-24-2018 at 12:40 PM..
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Old 10-24-2018, 08:08 PM
 
Location: Southwestern, USA
15,352 posts, read 12,109,955 times
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I can ask my mom to please ask dad if I can have the car tonight.

It takes another type of person to go straight to dad.

I dunno about Bibiical.

That's my 2 cents...always go to the Source...no need for go-betweens...but, hey if you
are in some sort of shame and feel unworthy, or are scared, that's your issue...go for it, what ever way you feel
comfy with..

CCCyou...incllude me, please. Thank you.
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Old 10-24-2018, 08:28 PM
 
Location: Booth Texas
14,773 posts, read 4,958,159 times
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k
Quote:
Originally Posted by JesusLovingBaptist98 View Post
It is idolatrous and wrong.

Deuteronomy 18:10-12 - There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, or one who practices witchcraft, or a soothsayer, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, or one who conjures spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, or one who calls up the dead. For all who do these things are an abomination to the Lord, and because of these abominations the Lord your God drives them out from before you.

1 Timothy 2:5 - For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus,
Just people doing what they always did, God judges the heart though. But if we are to show the Catholics supposed abominations, let's do speak of the Baptist abominations they commit according to the law of God you quote of Catholics, will you be judged in the same way for your abominations the same way?

Being that Baptists only keep what is wholly Catholic, following wholly Catholic laws, Sabbaths and Holy days created by the Catholic church and which are in contradiction to biblical laws, Sabbaths and Holy days, the Baptist proves without a doubt that the Catholic church is his authority, and thus, he himself, Catholic. Baptists follow the Catholic religion, they can hardly speak against Catholics, and idolatry is not what a Baptists decide it is.
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Old 10-25-2018, 08:38 AM
 
767 posts, read 429,248 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Milwaukee City View Post
Is prayer to saints / Mary biblical? "There is absolutely no basis or need to pray to anyone other than God alone. There is no basis for asking those who are in heaven to pray for us. Only God can hear our prayers. Only God can answer our prayers. No one in heaven has any greater access to God's throne than we do through prayer "[/i]
all prayers does go to God, the God of Israel, Jehovah, (Exo. 6:3). the same God that Jesus said humans must get to know if they want life ,(John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent). true, Jehovah God can hear all prayers, but we must go to him through Jesus. because Jesus is the go between for imperfect mankind and perfect God ,(1Tim. 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus). see also (John 14:6 Jesus said unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man comes unto the Father, but by me). though for now, even if our prayers are directed to Jehovah God. he place Jesus as King over his righteous humans. so when we pray, by means of the Authority given to Jesus from his Father, and he being our King.

Jesus can also answer our prayers ,(Rev. 17:14 These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for He is Lord of lords and King of kings; and those who are with Him are called, chosen, and faithful.) see also (John 14:13,14 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it). Mary and other humans who's in Heaven were just that humans. though righteous they were still born through imperfection. Jesus didn't come from a man, he came from God. so he wasn't born through sin or imperfection.
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Old 10-25-2018, 08:53 AM
 
Location: In Sticky San Antonio TX
1,437 posts, read 2,554,213 times
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Again, I don't know that we reference saints/those in heaven to answer our prayers, but to be one voice with us in prayer. We don't venerate or worship them as much as we would any in our environment we call brothers and sisters. Those in heaven are among those who have already passed through the portal, into another room, and are waiting for us behind the curtain.
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Old 10-25-2018, 09:06 AM
 
767 posts, read 429,248 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monastic555 View Post
Requests made to dead Saints have been known to have been answered. For example, a request made to the deceased St. Damien of Molokai. It was a Hawaiian lady who got healed of an incurable disease.
people seem to forget that there is a demon, satan! who can make things seem as though it's of God. satan has human ministers, who has fooled their flocks into believing they are true men of God ,(2Cor. 11:13-15 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works). satan is the master of trickery, and if we're NOT relying on Jehovah God and Jesus, we will be fooled ,(Ephe. 6:11 Put on the whole Armor of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil). as a "Christian", we should know if it's a trick from satan or directly from Jehovah God and Jesus ,(2Cor. 2:11 Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices).

though satan doesn't have the gift of reading minds, he can still see and hear us. if we believe that the dead can respond to us, he will capitalize on that, and he will run with it. it's like believing that a psychic can actually see and speak to the dead, another trick of satan. just because satan was an wicked angel, doesn't mean he can't do good for some. it's NOT because he care, he doesn't! ,(1Pet. 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walks about, seeking whom he may devour). it's to fool Many into believing what is untrue. so when one of Jehovah God and Jesus follow try to teach the truth, some will refuse to believe it. simply because of what they had experienced. satan can cause harm to one's body or life, read the book of Job. despite what MANY want to believe, it's NOT any dead "saints" who's answering some prayers. it's either Jehovah God, Jesus or satan. peace
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