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Old 12-03-2018, 02:34 PM
 
Location: New Zealand
4,249 posts, read 659,543 times
Reputation: 451

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannibal Flavius View Post
The enemy came in one day on the Sabbath and began killing Jews, but those stubborn Jews were so loyal to their belief that they wouldn't take up arms on the Sabbath and so they stood there and died. This did change the way they thought but just to imagine such loyalty is magic. I think about those people all the time.

Reminds me of somebody else.

Jesus just stood there and did nothing when he could have killed them all.

Thank God the Jews were brave enough to continue in a culture the world hates them for, God's culture, they die for God.
Jew worship is not the way to go hanni,

Christ’s ‘body’ is to be in the heart of the ‘earth’ for 3 days, it is sown in corruption and raised in glory...... this is not about individuals, the Jew and gentile do not understand the meaning behind the symbols, the symbols are prophetic and if you follow the letter you build a physical society of oppression saying that you are excused to do it because God says it’s okay when it is the scribes, prophets and priests mishandling the things written in the scriptures.

sa 1:1 The vision of Isaiah the son of Amoz, which he saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem in the days of Uzziah, Jotham, Ahaz and Hezekiah, kings of Judah.
The Wickedness of Judah

Isa 1:2 Hear, O heavens, and listen, O earth! For Jehovah has spoken: I have nursed and brought up sons, but they have rebelled against Me.
Isa 1:3 The ox knows his owner, and the ass his master's manger, but Israel does not know; My people have not understood.
Isa 1:4 Woe, sinful nation, a people heavy with iniquity, a seed of evildoers, sons who corrupt! They have forsaken Jehovah; they have scorned the Holy One of Israel. They are estranged backward.
Isa 1:5 Why will you be stricken any more? Will you continue the revolt? The whole head is sick, and the whole heart is faint.

Isa 1:6 From the sole of the foot even to the head, no soundness is in it; only a wound and a stripe and a fresh blow; they have not been closed, nor bound up; nor was it softened with oil.
Isa 1:7 Your land is a desolation; your cities burned with fire. Foreigners devour your land before you; and behold, ruin, as overthrown by foreigners.
Isa 1:8 And the daughter of Zion is left a booth in a vineyard, like a hut in a cucumber field, like a besieged city.
Isa 1:9 Except Jehovah of Hosts had left a remnant for us, a few, we would be as Sodom; we would be as Gomorrah.
Isa 1:10 Hear the Word of Jehovah, rulers of Sodom. Listen to the Law of our God, people of Gomorrah.
Isa 1:11 What good to Me are your many sacrifices, says Jehovah? I am sated with burnt offerings of rams, and the fat of fattened cattle, and the blood of bulls; nor do I delight in the blood of lambs and he goats.
Isa 1:12 When you come to see My face, who has required this at your hand, to trample My courts?
Isa 1:13 Do not add to bringing vain sacrifice; its incense is an abomination to Me. I cannot endure the new moon and sabbath, the going to meeting, and the evil assembly.

Isa 1:14 My soul hates your new moons and your appointed feasts. They are a burden to Me. I am weary of bearing them.
Isa 1:15 And when you spread out your hands, I will hide My eyes from you. Yea, when you multiply prayer, I will not hear. Your hands are full of blood.
Isa 1:16 Wash yourselves, purify yourselves. Put away the evil of your doings from My sight; stop doing evil.
Isa 1:17 Learn to do good, seek justice, straighten the oppressor, judge the orphan, strive for the widow.
Isa 1:18 Come now and let us reason together, says Jehovah: Though your sins are as scarlet, they shall be white as snow; though they are red as the crimson, they shall be like wool.
Isa 1:19 If you are willing and hear, you shall eat the good of the land.
Isa 1:20 But if you refuse and rebel, you shall be devoured with the sword; for the mouth of Jehovah has spoken.

The Unfaithful City

Isa 1:21 Oh how the faithful city has become a harlot! She was full of justice; righteousness lodged in it. But now, murderers!
Isa 1:22 Your silver has become dross; your wine is diluted with water.

Isa 1:23 Your princes are rebellious and companions of thieves. Everyone loves a bribe, and is pursuing rewards. They do not judge the orphan, nor does the cause of the widow come to them,
Isa 1:24 and says the Lord, Jehovah of Hosts, the mighty One of Israel, Alas! I will be eased of My foes, and avenge Myself of My enemies.
Isa 1:25 And I will return My hand on you, and refine your dross, as with lye, and turn aside all your alloy.
Isa 1:26 And I will return your judges as at the first; and your advisors, as at the beginning; then you shall be called the city of righteousness, a faithful city.
Isa 1:27 Zion shall be redeemed with justice, and her returning ones with righteousness.
Isa 1:28 And the ruin of the transgressors and of the sinners shall be together. And those who forsake Jehovah shall be consumed.
Isa 1:29 For they shall be ashamed of the trees which you lusted after; and you shall be ashamed of the gardens that you have chosen.
Isa 1:30 For you shall be like a tree whose leaf fades, and like a garden that has no water in it.
Isa 1:31 And the strong shall be for tow, and his work for a spark; and they shall burn both together; and no one shall quench them.

Jer 8:1 At that time, declares Jehovah, they will bring out the bones of the kings of Judah, and the bones of its rulers, and the bones of the priests, and the bones of the prophets, and the bones of those living in Jerusalem, out of their graves.
Jer 8:2 And they shall spread them before the sun and the moon and all the host of the heavens whom they have loved, and whom they have served, and after whom they have walked, and whom they have sought, and whom they have worshiped. They shall not be gathered or buried; they shall be dung on the face of the ground.
Jer 8:3 And death shall be chosen rather than life by all the rest of those who remain of this evil family, who remain there in all the places where I have driven them
, says Jehovah of Hosts.
Sin and Treachery

Jer 8:4 And you shall say to them, So says Jehovah, Shall they fall and not rise up? Or shall one turn away and not return?
Jer 8:5 Why has this people, Jerusalem, turned away to a never ending apostasy? They hold fast to deceit. They refuse to return.
Jer 8:6 I listened and heard. They did not speak so. No man repented because of this evil, saying, What have I done? Everyone turned in their own courses, as a horse rushes into the battle.
Jer 8:7 Also the stork in the heavens knows her seasons, and the turtledove and the swallow and the thrush observe the time of their coming. But My people do not know the judgment of Jehovah.
Jer 8:8 How do you say, We are wise, and the Law of Jehovah is with us? Behold, the lying pen of the scribes has certainly worked deceit.

Jer 8:9 The wise are ashamed; they are terrified and are captured. Behold, they have rejected the Word of Jehovah, and what wisdom is theirs?
Jer 8:10 So I will give their wives to others, their fields to those who shall inherit. For everyone from the least even to the greatest cuts off a profit. From the prophet even to the priest, everyone deals falsely.
Jer 8:11 For they have healed the hurt of the daughter of My people slightly, saying, Peace, peace! And there is no peace.
Jer 8:12 Were they ashamed when they had done hateful things? They were not even at all ashamed, nor did they know how to blush. So they shall fall among those who fall. In the time of their punishment they will wither, says Jehovah.
Jer 8:13 I will utterly consume them, says Jehovah. No grapes will be on the vine, or figs on the fig tree; even the leaf withers. And I will give to them those who pass over them.
Jer 8:14 Why do we sit still? Gather yourselves, and let us enter into the fortified cities; and let us be silent there. For Jehovah our God has made us silent there, and He has made us drink poisonous water, because we have sinned against Jehovah.
Jer 8:15 We looked for peace, but no good came; for a time of healing, but, behold, terror!
Jer 8:16 The snorting of his horses was heard from Dan; all the land trembles at the sound of the neighing of his stallions. For they come and devour the land and its fullness, the city and those who live in it.
Jer 8:17 For behold, I will send serpents among you, vipers for which there is no charm; and they will bite you, says Jehovah.
Jeremiah Grieves for His People


Jer 8:18 My refreshing is beyond grief; my heart is sick within me.
Jer 8:19 Behold, the voice of the cry of the daughter of my people from a distant land! Is not Jehovah in Zion? Or is not her king in her? Why have they provoked Me with their carved images, with foreign vanities?
Jer 8:20 Harvest has passed; the summer has ended, and we are not delivered.
Jer 8:21 For the breaking of the daughter of my people, I am broken. I mourn; horror has taken hold on me.
Jer 8:22 Is there no balm in Gilead? Is there no healer there? Why then has the healing of the daughter of my people not come?



Gen 1:14 And God said, Let luminaries be in the expanse of the heavens, to divide between the day and the night. And let them be for signs and for seasons, and for days and years.

Both Judaism and Christianity have built man made religions which is the adversary (Satan) believing the prophetic things in the scriptures to be real. Man has taken the writings in the scriptures to fulfill the things written there according to the evil in his heart, professing themselves to be wise and chosen they become fools
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Old 12-03-2018, 03:31 PM
 
Location: US
27,998 posts, read 15,082,761 times
Reputation: 1754
Quote:
Originally Posted by jencam View Post
I'm not sure that even makes sense. They are allowed to, actually commanded to. break the rules for the Sabbath if a life is in danger. In fact the rules on heat can be bent if someone is ill and needs heat. They can use the phone, break any Sabbath rule if a life is in danger and the action is required for that.
Yup...
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Old 12-03-2018, 05:23 PM
 
Location: Booth Texas
14,883 posts, read 4,991,637 times
Reputation: 1520
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meerkat2 View Post
Jew worship is not the way to go hanni,

Christ’s ‘body’ is to be in the heart of the ‘earth’ for 3 days, it is sown in corruption and raised in glory...... this is not about individuals, the Jew and gentile do not understand the meaning behind the symbols, the symbols are prophetic and if you follow the letter you build a physical society of oppression saying that you are excused to do it because God says it’s okay when it is the scribes, prophets and priests mishandling the things written in the scriptures.

sa 1:1 The vision of Isaiah the son of Amoz, which he saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem in the days of Uzziah, Jotham, Ahaz and Hezekiah, kings of Judah.
The Wickedness of Judah

Isa 1:2 Hear, O heavens, and listen, O earth! For Jehovah has spoken: I have nursed and brought up sons, but they have rebelled against Me.
Isa 1:3 The ox knows his owner, and the ass his master's manger, but Israel does not know; My people have not understood.
Isa 1:4 Woe, sinful nation, a people heavy with iniquity, a seed of evildoers, sons who corrupt! They have forsaken Jehovah; they have scorned the Holy One of Israel. They are estranged backward.
Isa 1:5 Why will you be stricken any more? Will you continue the revolt? The whole head is sick, and the whole heart is faint.

Isa 1:6 From the sole of the foot even to the head, no soundness is in it; only a wound and a stripe and a fresh blow; they have not been closed, nor bound up; nor was it softened with oil.
Isa 1:7 Your land is a desolation; your cities burned with fire. Foreigners devour your land before you; and behold, ruin, as overthrown by foreigners.
Isa 1:8 And the daughter of Zion is left a booth in a vineyard, like a hut in a cucumber field, like a besieged city.
Isa 1:9 Except Jehovah of Hosts had left a remnant for us, a few, we would be as Sodom; we would be as Gomorrah.
Isa 1:10 Hear the Word of Jehovah, rulers of Sodom. Listen to the Law of our God, people of Gomorrah.
Isa 1:11 What good to Me are your many sacrifices, says Jehovah? I am sated with burnt offerings of rams, and the fat of fattened cattle, and the blood of bulls; nor do I delight in the blood of lambs and he goats.
Isa 1:12 When you come to see My face, who has required this at your hand, to trample My courts?
Isa 1:13 Do not add to bringing vain sacrifice; its incense is an abomination to Me. I cannot endure the new moon and sabbath, the going to meeting, and the evil assembly.

Isa 1:14 My soul hates your new moons and your appointed feasts. They are a burden to Me. I am weary of bearing them.
Isa 1:15 And when you spread out your hands, I will hide My eyes from you. Yea, when you multiply prayer, I will not hear. Your hands are full of blood.
Isa 1:16 Wash yourselves, purify yourselves. Put away the evil of your doings from My sight; stop doing evil.
Isa 1:17 Learn to do good, seek justice, straighten the oppressor, judge the orphan, strive for the widow.
Isa 1:18 Come now and let us reason together, says Jehovah: Though your sins are as scarlet, they shall be white as snow; though they are red as the crimson, they shall be like wool.
Isa 1:19 If you are willing and hear, you shall eat the good of the land.
Isa 1:20 But if you refuse and rebel, you shall be devoured with the sword; for the mouth of Jehovah has spoken.

The Unfaithful City

Isa 1:21 Oh how the faithful city has become a harlot! She was full of justice; righteousness lodged in it. But now, murderers!
Isa 1:22 Your silver has become dross; your wine is diluted with water.

Isa 1:23 Your princes are rebellious and companions of thieves. Everyone loves a bribe, and is pursuing rewards. They do not judge the orphan, nor does the cause of the widow come to them,
Isa 1:24 and says the Lord, Jehovah of Hosts, the mighty One of Israel, Alas! I will be eased of My foes, and avenge Myself of My enemies.
Isa 1:25 And I will return My hand on you, and refine your dross, as with lye, and turn aside all your alloy.
Isa 1:26 And I will return your judges as at the first; and your advisors, as at the beginning; then you shall be called the city of righteousness, a faithful city.
Isa 1:27 Zion shall be redeemed with justice, and her returning ones with righteousness.
Isa 1:28 And the ruin of the transgressors and of the sinners shall be together. And those who forsake Jehovah shall be consumed.
Isa 1:29 For they shall be ashamed of the trees which you lusted after; and you shall be ashamed of the gardens that you have chosen.
Isa 1:30 For you shall be like a tree whose leaf fades, and like a garden that has no water in it.
Isa 1:31 And the strong shall be for tow, and his work for a spark; and they shall burn both together; and no one shall quench them.

Jer 8:1 At that time, declares Jehovah, they will bring out the bones of the kings of Judah, and the bones of its rulers, and the bones of the priests, and the bones of the prophets, and the bones of those living in Jerusalem, out of their graves.
Jer 8:2 And they shall spread them before the sun and the moon and all the host of the heavens whom they have loved, and whom they have served, and after whom they have walked, and whom they have sought, and whom they have worshiped. They shall not be gathered or buried; they shall be dung on the face of the ground.
Jer 8:3 And death shall be chosen rather than life by all the rest of those who remain of this evil family, who remain there in all the places where I have driven them
, says Jehovah of Hosts.
Sin and Treachery

Jer 8:4 And you shall say to them, So says Jehovah, Shall they fall and not rise up? Or shall one turn away and not return?
Jer 8:5 Why has this people, Jerusalem, turned away to a never ending apostasy? They hold fast to deceit. They refuse to return.
Jer 8:6 I listened and heard. They did not speak so. No man repented because of this evil, saying, What have I done? Everyone turned in their own courses, as a horse rushes into the battle.
Jer 8:7 Also the stork in the heavens knows her seasons, and the turtledove and the swallow and the thrush observe the time of their coming. But My people do not know the judgment of Jehovah.
Jer 8:8 How do you say, We are wise, and the Law of Jehovah is with us? Behold, the lying pen of the scribes has certainly worked deceit.

Jer 8:9 The wise are ashamed; they are terrified and are captured. Behold, they have rejected the Word of Jehovah, and what wisdom is theirs?
Jer 8:10 So I will give their wives to others, their fields to those who shall inherit. For everyone from the least even to the greatest cuts off a profit. From the prophet even to the priest, everyone deals falsely.
Jer 8:11 For they have healed the hurt of the daughter of My people slightly, saying, Peace, peace! And there is no peace.
Jer 8:12 Were they ashamed when they had done hateful things? They were not even at all ashamed, nor did they know how to blush. So they shall fall among those who fall. In the time of their punishment they will wither, says Jehovah.
Jer 8:13 I will utterly consume them, says Jehovah. No grapes will be on the vine, or figs on the fig tree; even the leaf withers. And I will give to them those who pass over them.
Jer 8:14 Why do we sit still? Gather yourselves, and let us enter into the fortified cities; and let us be silent there. For Jehovah our God has made us silent there, and He has made us drink poisonous water, because we have sinned against Jehovah.
Jer 8:15 We looked for peace, but no good came; for a time of healing, but, behold, terror!
Jer 8:16 The snorting of his horses was heard from Dan; all the land trembles at the sound of the neighing of his stallions. For they come and devour the land and its fullness, the city and those who live in it.
Jer 8:17 For behold, I will send serpents among you, vipers for which there is no charm; and they will bite you, says Jehovah.
Jeremiah Grieves for His People


Jer 8:18 My refreshing is beyond grief; my heart is sick within me.
Jer 8:19 Behold, the voice of the cry of the daughter of my people from a distant land! Is not Jehovah in Zion? Or is not her king in her? Why have they provoked Me with their carved images, with foreign vanities?
Jer 8:20 Harvest has passed; the summer has ended, and we are not delivered.
Jer 8:21 For the breaking of the daughter of my people, I am broken. I mourn; horror has taken hold on me.
Jer 8:22 Is there no balm in Gilead? Is there no healer there? Why then has the healing of the daughter of my people not come?



Gen 1:14 And God said, Let luminaries be in the expanse of the heavens, to divide between the day and the night. And let them be for signs and for seasons, and for days and years.

Both Judaism and Christianity have built man made religions which is the adversary (Satan) believing the prophetic things in the scriptures to be real. Man has taken the writings in the scriptures to fulfill the things written there according to the evil in his heart, professing themselves to be wise and chosen they become fools
Do you know what all those scriptures are about?

The kingdom of Ephraim appointed pagan festivals just like Christianity, and this paganism was brought into Jeruslem where God said this to them because their new moons and Sabbaths were now mixed in the paganism they learned from the kingdom of Ephraim.

The kingdom of Ephraim took on Christmas and Easter and both Jeremiah, and Ezekiel show this. Their sin was so heinous to God that he ended the kingdom of Ephraim.

What happened AFTER God said all those scriptures you quoted?

Some of the people of Judah had fallen into the same paganism of Ephraim, the same paganism as Christianity and so every scripture you quoted is about God's anger and sadness about his people involving themselves in paganism.

No offense, but if you want to show Judah as sinful people for what they did, how can you do that without being honest to admit that you commit the same sins that Judah was commiting then?

But Judah changed, the Jews no longer involve themselves in Paganism, do you know why?

Because after some of the Jews took up Easter and the winter solstice in following the lead of pagans in Ephraim, God took the whole nation into Babylon where he refined them as gold and he stripped the paganism from them and they returned to Jerusalem and the ways of God where they would now reject all paganism altogether, and now God cannot look at their holy days and new moons as abominations as unholy or unacceptable because of the fact that their adultery against God has ended in Babylon, and this isn't opinion, it is historical fact, God was angry at Judah for doing the exact same things that Christians do today, and these same Christians are pointing out Judah's sin 700 years before Jesus came where that sin no longer applies to them, it applies to Christians.

Reality

Jews no longer involved themselves in Paganism after Babylon and somehow Christians who are involved in paganism, who have rejected God's ways is telling a non pagan Jew about the sin of his former paganism the Christian is committing and the Jew is not.......

I understand that most people don't get how bizarre this is, but it is in fact, bizarre.

I do not worship Jews, but do you know what the first thing Jesus came doing? The first thing Jesus said?

Jesus was so freaking bold to quote Isaiah 61 to say that in their hearing, the prophesy had been fulfilled.

Do you realize exactly what Jesus was claiming to have fulfilled?

Jesus was so freaking bold to say that in their hearing, Isaiah 60 and Isaiah 61 was fulfilled in their hearing?

Do you know what Isaiah 60 and 61 says about Gentiles in redundancy?

Read Isaiah 60 and 61 and tell me what Jesus was saying about Jews and Gentiles.

For the nation or kingdom that will not serve thee shall perish, YEA, those nations shall be utterly ruined.........

If Jesus came to make Gentiles husbandmen to the tree and vines of Israel to work in their fields and gardens, is it speaking of fields and gardens with trees and vines?

No, nevertheless, what Jesus said he fulfilled was to make Gentiles servants to Israel to give them peace.
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Old 12-03-2018, 06:04 PM
 
Location: New Zealand
4,249 posts, read 659,543 times
Reputation: 451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannibal Flavius View Post
Do you know what all those scriptures are about?

The kingdom of Ephraim appointed pagan festivals just like Christianity, and this paganism was brought into Jeruslem where God said this to them because their new moons and Sabbaths were now mixed in the paganism they learned from the kingdom of Ephraim.

The kingdom of Ephraim took on Christmas and Easter and both Jeremiah, and Ezekiel show this. Their sin was so heinous to God that he ended the kingdom of Ephraim.

What happened AFTER God said all those scriptures you quoted?

Some of the people of Judah had fallen into the same paganism of Ephraim, the same paganism as Christianity and so every scripture you quoted is about God's anger and sadness about his people involving themselves in paganism.

No offense, but if you want to show Judah as sinful people for what they did, how can you do that without being honest to admit that you commit the same sins that Judah was commiting then?

But Judah changed, the Jews no longer involve themselves in Paganism, do you know why?

Because after some of the Jews took up Easter and the winter solstice in following the lead of pagans in Ephraim, God took the whole nation into Babylon where he refined them as gold and he stripped the paganism from them and they returned to Jerusalem and the ways of God where they would now reject all paganism altogether, and now God cannot look at their holy days and new moons as abominations as unholy or unacceptable because of the fact that their adultery against God has ended in Babylon, and this isn't opinion, it is historical fact, God was angry at Judah for doing the exact same things that Christians do today, and these same Christians are pointing out Judah's sin 700 years before Jesus came where that sin no longer applies to them, it applies to Christians.

Reality

Jews no longer involved themselves in Paganism after Babylon and somehow Christians who are involved in paganism, who have rejected God's ways is telling a non pagan Jew about the sin of his former paganism the Christian is committing and the Jew is not.......

I understand that most people don't get how bizarre this is, but it is in fact, bizarre.

I do not worship Jews, but do you know what the first thing Jesus came doing? The first thing Jesus said?

Jesus was so freaking bold to quote Isaiah 61 to say that in their hearing, the prophesy had been fulfilled.

Do you realize exactly what Jesus was claiming to have fulfilled?

Jesus was so freaking bold to say that in their hearing, Isaiah 60 and Isaiah 61 was fulfilled in their hearing?

Do you know what Isaiah 60 and 61 says about Gentiles in redundancy?

Read Isaiah 60 and 61 and tell me what Jesus was saying about Jews and Gentiles.

For the nation or kingdom that will not serve thee shall perish, YEA, those nations shall be utterly ruined.........

If Jesus came to make Gentiles husbandmen to the tree and vines of Israel to work in their fields and gardens, is it speaking of fields and gardens with trees and vines?

No, nevertheless, what Jesus said he fulfilled was to make Gentiles servants to Israel to give them peace.
You are right that it isn’t talking about physical vines and trees, and in the same way the rest of scriptures were not talking about historic, literal things, the people reading them literally have made it into their history in their endeavour to obey God, the scriptures are not about historical nations and historical individual man, woman, etc


You are looking at everything as historical, a historical Jesus talking about a historical nation that was born out of a historical man and woman called Abraham and Sarah, after there was an historical flood in the days of Noah and then putting a spiritual spin on it.

The signs and symbols point to the process of building the kingdom of God on earth

The Jews took the prophetic things and turned them into a religion, the same as what Christianity has done and that is what is prophecied.
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Old 12-03-2018, 06:18 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,972 posts, read 22,151,097 times
Reputation: 10714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vf6cruiser View Post
But scripture sure did.......He wanted us to figure out it was impossible to keep and we needed HIM a merciful and gracious God to forgive us and give us eternal life after the cross........

23 for fall have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

We are as likely to keep the law as we are to jump to the moon..........

The law reveals sin but cannot fix it. (Romans 3:20)

If the law worked then faith would be irrelevant. (Romans 4:14)

The law brings wrath upon those who follow it. (Romans 4:15)

The purpose of the law was to increase sin. (Romans 5:20)

Christians are not under the law. (Romans 6:14)

Christians have been delivered from the law. (Romans 7:1-6)

The law is good, perfect and holy but cannot help you be good, perfect or holy. (Romans 7:7-12)
If you're talking about the Law of Moses, I agree with you. On the other hand, Jesus Christ did say, "If ye love me, keep my commandments." I'm thinking that was not merely a suggestion.
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Old 12-03-2018, 06:50 PM
 
Location: Booth Texas
14,883 posts, read 4,991,637 times
Reputation: 1520
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meerkat2 View Post
You are right that it isn’t talking about physical vines and trees, and in the same way the rest of scriptures were not talking about historic, literal things, the people reading them literally have made it into their history in their endeavour to obey God, the scriptures are not about historical nations and historical man, woman, etc


You are looking at everything as historical, a historical Jesus talking about a historical nation that was born out of a historical man and woman called Abraham and Sarah, after there was an historical flood in the days of Noah and then putting a spiritual spin on it.

The signs and symbols point to the process of building the kingdom of God on earth

The Jews took the prophetic things and turned them into a religion, the same as what Christianity has done and that is what is prophecied.
Understanding the history is the key to understanding the prophesies.

The big problem that people don't understand is not knowing the history and as somebody that read the bible and still didn't understand, I can witness just how hard it is to understand. I had probably read the bible 150 times in 40 years and I still didn't know who I was reading about.

It isn't a nation, it is two nations, it isn't one people, it is two people, it isn't one kingdom, it is two kingdoms.

People read the name,'' Israel or House of Israel,'' and they automaticaly assume it is speaking of Jews every time when it isn't speaking of Jews at all.

Paul for instance, how many people know that Paul wasn't a Jew? Paul had become a Jew but his people were of a different nation who kept a different religion for 300 years, and because his people separated from Judah and Jerusalem, God ended their nation and scattered them to the 4 corners of the earth where they have remained lost till this day, EXCEPT, except for the 7000 reserved from the house of Israel that have become one with Jews, and Paul is explaining how he is one of those 7000 members along with the disciples themselves, and how he was adopted and grafted into Judah living as a Jew amongst Jews....

If you don't know the history, you don't even have a clue what Paul is saying in very many scriptures because you think he is OBVIOUSLY speaking of the Jewish nation and the Jewish people and this is because it looks so obvious to even people who study the bible all their lives.

But the house of Israel were never Jews, and try and understand that the ten tribes of Israel practiced their own invented religion in Paganism living beside another nation practicing Judaism.

It would be exactly the same to show a nation of Christians living next to a nation of Jews for 300 years, and then you take all the history of the people in that Christian nation and try to say it is the history of the Jewish nation....

I can't express just how different these two people were, they are two nations with two different people because of the fact that the house of Israel called the Torah a strange thing, and this made them a different people and yet people still mix them up and think they are the same people.


Understand and try to see it as it is, we are talking about a first born and a second born, and we have MANY WAYS to compare this..

Ishmael is the first born, and his people and nations are not the same people as the people of Isaac and his nation.

Esau is not Jacob even though they were twins, his people and his kingdom are not the people and kingdom of Jacob and neither can you take the history of Ishmael or Esau to make it their brother's history, they are not the same people.

The way Christians look on Cain and Abel, they should look on Israel and Judah.

The way a Christian looks at Ishmael and Isaac, he should look at Israel and Judah.........

They are not the same people, God promised that he would take those ten tribes of Israel to seed them into all nations that one day they would bear fruit and come back in a marriage with Judah and this is the first hope a first born ever had.

Messiah did not bring a covenant for Judah and Gentiles, Messiah brought a covenant ONLY for Judah and Gentiles who came repenting of the sins of the lost ten tribes that they would be the fruit from God seeding Israel into the nations.

Jesus came bringing a covenant for Ephraim and Judah but Ephraim had already been lost 700 years, and this is why John and Jesus went into the land of the house of Israel to offer a betrothal to non Jews, and Messiah couldn't possibly bring a covenant for Ephraim and Judah until he found the fruit from the seeds God planted.

Jesus never offered the Jew a betrothal, ONLY the Gentile needed an adoption, only the Gentile needed to be grafted, the Jew is already a Jew.

Gentiles are grafted into Israel in order to grasp the covenant or they have no covenant, if a person can't prove that they are under Ephraim or Judah, well, why would they even speak of a covenant......

ADOPTED, GRAFTED.

These are the words used because of the fact that the covenant only pertains to Ephraim and Judah.

This is the reason no Gentiles have come under the covenant of Jesus for 2000 years, the covenant is not for Gentiles and when the Gentile stops seeking adoption into Israel to become one with Jews, that covenant is over.

Christians stopped being grafted and adopted 2000 years ago, and we are waiting on the day of Jezreel when ALL NATIONS come to join, everyone, but that day has still not come.

There is Judah and Ephraim, and Ephraim is still lost except for the 7000 in each generation that Paul tells us about but 7000 is nothing.

The number of the members of non Jewish Ephraim is so great that Ephraim's name is synomous with,'' The sands of the seas.''

It is not the Jewish nation that God promises such great numbers, it is the Gentile nations who join Judah, and this is going to happen, but for now, Christians are claiming a covenant they aren't in because they don't know history.

Christians don't know the names, you mention,'' Ephraim,'' and people don't get it and all of Revelation is about Ephraim and Judah, the flesh and the spirit, the first born and the second born.

Last edited by Hannibal Flavius; 12-03-2018 at 07:01 PM..
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Old 12-05-2018, 11:44 AM
 
2,321 posts, read 631,299 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _000_ View Post
He did say this to you.



John 15:10
If ye keep my commandments,
ye shall abide in my love;
even as I have kept my Father's commandments,
and abide in his love.



If you do not keep His commandments
then Jesus will not love you.

You preach the Performance Based Acceptance (PBA) of man.......do well and be blessed, fail and be cursed. The problem all humans have (including Popes and Pastors) we all WANT to do well but we live in fleshly bodies of sin that care nothing about the law or the spirit. The law INCREASES sin and was designed to drive us in our failure to the mercy and grace of Christ who will save us in spite of our failure.

Instead we all pump iron and go valiantly forth reading our Tony Robbins books and think we can achieve perfection in the law......Jesus looks on as we all fail but endlessly keep trying, instead of accepting the free gift by faith.......
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Old 12-06-2018, 12:44 PM
 
Location: US
27,998 posts, read 15,082,761 times
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Originally Posted by Vf6cruiser View Post
You preach the Performance Based Acceptance (PBA) of man.......do well and be blessed, fail and be cursed. The problem all humans have (including Popes and Pastors) we all WANT to do well but we live in fleshly bodies of sin that care nothing about the law or the spirit. The law INCREASES sin and was designed to drive us in our failure to the mercy and grace of Christ who will save us in spite of our failure.

Instead we all pump iron and go valiantly forth reading our Tony Robbins books and think we can achieve perfection in the law......Jesus looks on as we all fail but endlessly keep trying, instead of accepting the free gift by faith.......
I care about the Law...
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Old 12-06-2018, 01:06 PM
 
Location: Booth Texas
14,883 posts, read 4,991,637 times
Reputation: 1520
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vf6cruiser View Post
You preach the Performance Based Acceptance (PBA) of man.......do well and be blessed, fail and be cursed. The problem all humans have (including Popes and Pastors) we all WANT to do well but we live in fleshly bodies of sin that care nothing about the law or the spirit. The law INCREASES sin and was designed to drive us in our failure to the mercy and grace of Christ who will save us in spite of our failure.

Instead we all pump iron and go valiantly forth reading our Tony Robbins books and think we can achieve perfection in the law......Jesus looks on as we all fail but endlessly keep trying, instead of accepting the free gift by faith.......
Our claim is that we repent and we are forgiven our sins as the punishment for sin was taken away, the sin does not stop being sin, the law never stops judging sin. Jesus didn't come to abolish the law, and his whole life proves this. Jesus didn't come saying there was no law, he helped people and then said,'' Sin no more.'' There are so many pro law scriptures that most Christians don't like to admit, and it is just like Jesus speaking of the law where Christians just don't believe what he says, they assume Jesus is wrong in what he says of the law and that would make Jesus wrong in very many scripture, in half of what he said. I can quote Revelation showing the people who are being born again, and what it was that enabled tnem to be born again was keeping the commandments of God where it says,'' These are those who have the testimony of Jesus who keep the commandments of God.''

So many scriptures telling people that if they really love God, they should keep his commandments and this is proof of their love..........
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Old 12-06-2018, 01:36 PM
 
Location: New Zealand
4,249 posts, read 659,543 times
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Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
I care about the Law...
Me too
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