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Old 11-30-2018, 12:39 PM
 
17,617 posts, read 10,697,073 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunbiz1 View Post
The enemy would love for you to believe he rules the world, as stated in the title of your thread.
He does not.

It only appears he is due to sin, and sin alone.
God works behind the scenes, ultimately defeating Satan; along with strengthening our faith in the process.
In the Bible the word "world" does not man everything. In Noah's day God destroyed the "world" but only the wicked part of mankind. The word is limited and Satan rules the world of wicked or disobedient mankind, but not the truly faithful. God allows this to prove he does not lie and that man is incapable of successfully ruling himself. So far the evidence in God's favor is overwhelming. The "fallen/disobedient world" is following Satan's "rule".
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Old 11-30-2018, 12:44 PM
 
Location: US
28,025 posts, read 15,113,976 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
There is no battle behind the scenes, as there is no arch enemy called Satan.
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Old 11-30-2018, 12:45 PM
 
Location: US
28,025 posts, read 15,113,976 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vf6cruiser View Post
Satan is still here and is the "prince of the power of the air" because God has a use for him. He tests people, God has tested all of us through the wiles of satan. Adam lost control of the whole world to satan in the garden. Jesus will buy it back in the end. We see satan operating within the parameters God sets when he is released for a short time at the end of the millenium, where he will deceive and turn people against God after living under the wondrous rule of Jesus himself for years. These people who have seen Jesus and know Him receive no hearing or grace just like the angels who fell. These who rebel at the end of the 1,000 years are simply burned up on the spot. After this, the usefulness of satan is gone and God simply tosses him into the lake of fire never to be seen again.
Satan was not in Gan Eden...
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Old 11-30-2018, 01:14 PM
 
3,765 posts, read 1,157,919 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
Nope, he would know the potential. God has not looked at everything in the future or he would not be able to do anything but what he saw being done, thus not all powerful.
Huh? Your god isn’t all powerful?

Your god isn’t omniscient?

How do you know god has limits?
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Old 12-01-2018, 11:46 AM
 
10,785 posts, read 2,765,355 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
God obviously does permit evil. Just look at the way the world is. And as I said, He allows evil, as well as sin to run its course though human history in order to demonstrate the results of rebellion against Him.

God has not forbidden Himself to allow evil. Not is it sinful for God to allow sin and evil. Sin is disobedience to God's stated will. Evil, that is, evil of a moral nature, is that which is in opposition to God. That God permits both sin and evil is necessary in order for both angelic and human volition to function. If created beings could not choose against God they would not have volition.




God said in His revelation to John that it is necessary for Satan to be released from the pit for a short while as stated in Revelation 20:3.
Revelation 20:2 And he laid hold of the dragon, the serpent of old, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; 3] and he threw him into the abyss, and shut it and sealed it over him, so that he would not deceive the nations any longer, until the thousand years were completed; after these things he must be released for a short time.
You have to keep things in context. Satan is presently free. He is not now imprisoned, and he is called the ruler of this age in 2 Corinthians 4:4. But in the Millennial age he will be imprisoned for that thousand year period and unable to influence anyone. This is to demonstrate that even though Satan is unable to influence anyone during the Millennial kingdom, man still will have a sin nature and will still rebel against Jesus' rule. Then when Satan is released for a while at the end of the Millennial kingdom, he will incite those people who have resented Jesus' rule over them to openly rebel against him as per Revelation 20:7-9.



Satan is in rebellion against God. He always will be. He is not working for God. He is being allowed by God to do his best to thwart God's plan. And God is demonstrating that He is in complete control of the situation and will bring things to a close in His time. At that time Satan will be permanently imprisoned in the lake of fire along with all, both angelic and human, who have rebelled against Him.

You may be thinking why God has allowed this to go on for so long, but all of human history is not even a drop in the bucket compared to God's eternal perspective. God knows what He's doing. He has a plan, a purpose, and a reason for allowing Satan's and man's rebellion to go on during human history. And it all has to do with demonstrating the utter futility, as well as the consequences of the creature rebelling against the Creator. Once the demonstration is complete, God will bring it to an end, and the eternal state will continue in the new heavens and new earth. Those who have sided with God will be with God forever, and those who have sided against God will be separated from God forever.
So God is allowing satan to do this...in order to prove God is in control of everything...but the bible even says few people will achieve heaven (so by deduction, that means a MAJORITY of people will choose satan)...?


What kind of 'grand plan' by God would result in a majority of his prized creations...taking the side of his adversary?


And if that is the truly the case (that a majority of people did reject God/choose Satan), that pretty much means that hell prevailed...in that, satan was able to successfully draw more people away from God, than those that chose God willingly.
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Old 12-01-2018, 12:03 PM
 
Location: New Zealand
4,277 posts, read 665,923 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
So God is allowing satan to do this...in order to prove God is in control of everything...but the bible even says few people will achieve heaven (so by deduction, that means a MAJORITY of people will choose satan)...?


What kind of 'grand plan' by God would result in a majority of his prized creations...taking the side of his adversary?


And if that is the truly the case (that a majority of people did reject God/choose Satan), that pretty much means that hell prevailed...in that, satan was able to successfully draw more people away from God, than those that chose God willingly.
I believe where things have gone astray with everyone believing in fables is that the kingdom OF heaven is not heaven, and that the prophetic in scripture have been taken as historical. Also the belief that Gods plan is to “save” individual people (ie christians) ......these are where the errors have come from.
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Old 12-01-2018, 12:55 PM
 
22,009 posts, read 16,765,082 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
So God is allowing satan to do this...in order to prove God is in control of everything...but the bible even says few people will achieve heaven (so by deduction, that means a MAJORITY of people will choose satan)...?


What kind of 'grand plan' by God would result in a majority of his prized creations...taking the side of his adversary?


And if that is the truly the case (that a majority of people did reject God/choose Satan), that pretty much means that hell prevailed...in that, satan was able to successfully draw more people away from God, than those that chose God willingly.
Humans are only part of God's creation. God is demonstrating to all of creation, however extensive that creation is, and in whatever and in how many different realms of existence there are, the results of the creature being in opposition to the Creator.

Nor is it God's plan that results in anyone taking the side of Satan. That is a matter of volition on the part of those who do. God gave both man and the beings who inhabit the spirit realm the ability to make choices. Since created beings are not God they are capable of failure. God, having foreseen the fall of man, made a way of restoring man to relationship with Him. But man must be free to refuse God's provision for salvation if he is to truly have volition. It is the responsibility of each person to decide whether or not to receive God's offer of salvation.
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Old 12-01-2018, 06:28 PM
 
17,617 posts, read 10,697,073 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Last Amalekite 1Sam15 View Post
Huh? Your god isn’t all powerful?

Your god isn’t omniscient?

How do you know god has limits?
He is all powerful.

He can chose what to see in the future as that is part of his power.



Those claiming he knows all things, Omniscient, are actually limiting his power.


He has a couple of limits.


1. He cannot die
2. He cannot lie
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Old 12-01-2018, 06:31 PM
 
17,617 posts, read 10,697,073 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Humans are only part of God's creation. God is demonstrating to all of creation, however extensive that creation is, and in whatever and in how many different realms of existence there are, the results of the creature being in opposition to the Creator.

Nor is it God's plan that results in anyone taking the side of Satan. That is a matter of volition on the part of those who do. God gave both man and the beings who inhabit the spirit realm the ability to make choices. Since created beings are not God they are capable of failure. God, having foreseen the fall of man, made a way of restoring man to relationship with Him. But man must be free to refuse God's provision for salvation if he is to truly have volition. It is the responsibility of each person to decide whether or not to receive God's offer of salvation.
Satan only wins if everyone rejects God and His son and that ain't gonna happen. Satan lost when Jesus proved faithful. How many are faithful is not an issue.
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Old 12-01-2018, 06:55 PM
 
22,009 posts, read 16,765,082 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
Satan only wins if everyone rejects God and His son and that ain't gonna happen. Satan lost when Jesus proved faithful. How many are faithful is not an issue.
You should have addressed that to rstevens62. Not to me.
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