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You surely prescribe to the notion that if you tell a lie often enough people will start to believe you.
It is clearly stated repeatedly in the New Testament that you must believe on Christ in order to be saved. Your incessant denials will never change that.
Wake up from that primitive, sacrificial, mindset that God punishes or needs any penalty paid to forgive us for ANYTHING. There WAS a barrier that kept human consciousness from joining God consciousness and it WAS our imperfect consciousness missing the mark (not achieving perfection as the Father is perfect). Jesus's human consciousness achieved that perfect resonance (IDENTITY) with God's consciousness joining ALL human consciousness with God. When He died and was born again as Spirit (as we are to do) His Holy Spirit human consciousness remained with the total human consciousness as the Comforter in His name to guide us to the Truth God has "written in our hearts." Nowhere in that process is the requirement to accept what Jesus did. We can simply take advantage of the cover of His perfection (Grace) by following His instructions to love God and each other every day and repent when we don't. If we don't we will simply reap whatever we sow but we are "saved as by fire." As Paul said,
1 Corinthians 3:15 King James Version (KJV)
If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
Romans 2:14
. . . When the Gentiles who have no law do by nature what the law prescribes, these having no law are a law unto themselves. They show the work of the law written in their hearts. Their conscience bears witness to them, even when conflicting thoughts accuse or defend them.
All the nonsense about refusing or rejecting the offer of salvation is "precepts and doctrines of men" designed to promote membership in specific churches who determined what needed to be believed. Jesus saved us ALL we just have to believe Him and follow His instructions about love. We have nothing to do with our salvation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555
You surely prescribe to the notion that if you tell a lie often enough people will start to believe you.
It is clearly stated repeatedly in the New Testament that you must believe on Christ in order to be saved. Your incessant denials will never change that.
Your "precepts and doctrines of men" have certainly taken advantage of that over the past 2000+ years. You misrepresent what it means to believe ON Christ. You pretend that it means you have to believe the "precepts and doctrines of men" ABOUT Jesus and God prescribed by the church leaders. But what it really means is you have to BELIEVE Jesus saved us (have Faith in that), expect to be born again as Spirit upon your death as He was (have Hope in that ) and follow His instructions to love God and each other and repent when we don't. That is the Faith, Hope, and Love we are to rely on but the greatest of these is Love.
Your "precepts and doctrines of men" have certainly taken advantage of that over the past 2000+ years. You misrepresent what it means to believe ON Christ. You pretend that it means you have to believe the "precepts and doctrines of men" ABOUT Jesus and God prescribed by the church leaders. But what it really means is you have to BELIEVE Jesus saved us (have Faith in that), expect to be born again as Spirit upon your death as He was (have Hope in that ) and follow His instructions to love God and each other and repent when we don't. That is the Faith, Hope, and Love we are to rely on but the greatest of these is Love.
I told you, no matter how many times you repeat your lie, you are refuted by, among other verses, Acts 16:30-31.
Acts 16:30 Then he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” 31] They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."
I told you, no matter how many times you repeat your lie, you are refuted by, among other verses, Acts 16:30-31.
Acts 16:30 Then he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” 31] They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."
It is not a lie, it is a more accurate and knowledgeable interpretation of the same verses you use.
It is not a lie, it is a more accurate and knowledgeable interpretation of the same verses you use.
It's a lie, and you have deceived yourself thinking yourself to have superior spiritual understanding. You don't. No one has eternal life unless they come to Jesus for it.
It's a lie, and you have deceived yourself thinking yourself to have superior spiritual understanding. You don't. No one has eternal life unless they come to Jesus for it.
By loving one another we are born of God and know God. To know God and Jesus IS eternal life.
1 John 4:7 (King James Version)
7Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.
John 17:3 (King James Version)
3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
Wake up from that primitive, sacrificial, mindset that God punishes or needs any penalty paid to forgive us for ANYTHING. There WAS a barrier that kept human consciousness from joining God consciousness and it WAS our imperfect consciousness missing the mark (not achieving perfection as the Father is perfect). Jesus's human consciousness achieved that perfect resonance (IDENTITY) with God's consciousness joining ALL human consciousness with God. When He died and was born again as Spirit (as we are to do) His Holy Spirit human consciousness remained with the total human consciousness as the Comforter in His name to guide us to the Truth God has "written in our hearts." Nowhere in that process is the requirement to accept what Jesus did. We can simply take advantage of the cover of His perfection (Grace) by following His instructions to love God and each other every day and repent when we don't. If we don't we will simply reap whatever we sow but we are "saved as by fire." As Paul said,
1 Corinthians 3:15 King James Version (KJV)
If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
Romans 2:14
. . . When the Gentiles who have no law do by nature what the law prescribes, these having no law are a law unto themselves. They show the work of the law written in their hearts. Their conscience bears witness to them, even when conflicting thoughts accuse or defend them.
All the nonsense about refusing or rejecting the offer of salvation is "precepts and doctrines of men" designed to promote membership in specific churches who determined what needed to be believed. Jesus saved us ALL we just have to believe Him and follow His instructions about love. We have nothing to do with our salvation.
Greetings,
Interestingly enough, the term "precepts and doctrines of men" is found right in the Bible (of course, as something that we are to avoid).
But an important question would be, that in dismissing the idea of a necessary atoning sacrifice or the fact that we are commanded to believe on Christ in order to be saved, what would make an alternative doctrine (such as the one(s) you have suggested) not be considered the precepts and doctrines of men?
Many believe the Bible to be the inspired Word of God, and that any doctrine they would adhere to regarding Christ, or God, or salvation, or the Holy Spirit would have to agree with or find its support in Scripture.
What authority apart from the Bible could we trust in formulating what we come to believe about these things? To simply rely on what might make sense to us will not work, as we, then, become the authority. And we don't want to do that, as we wouldn't want to be the ones who would declare simply out of our own thinking what God's truth is regarding these matters.
Jesus constantly appealed to the Scriptures in validating His position, by frequently saying, "It is written". This would also be picked up in the New Testament beyond the gospels.
Jesus said in John 5:39: "You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life; and these are they which testify of Me".
We could live several more lifetimes, and still just scratch the surface of all that the Scriptures have to teach us. We remember in Acts 17:11, where we read about the Bereans: "These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."
I don't wish to go overboard on this topic, but I do believe it is irresponsible to trivialize the importance of the Bible in attempting to establish the truth about the Gospel. It is one thing to disagree with someone based on what might appear to be an improper understanding of what is perceived to be a biblical truth. But to simply dismiss something because it is supported by Scripture is, I believe, not at all wise.
One thing we know and can rejoice in, is that Jesus absolutely promises that He will not cast out anyone who comes to Him. And this is a wonderful promise, considering how desperately we need Him as our Savior.
I think that this is enough for now. May the Lord richly bless you.
One thing we know and can rejoice in, is that Jesus absolutely promises that He will not cast out anyone who comes to Him. And this is a wonderful promise, considering how desperately we need Him as our Savior.
My friend, that is a fact! l just beheld 3 individuals who could not, under any circumstance come to the Master. Can you tell us how the mentally insane, or any member of our broken species born totally disabled, can come to the Saviour? Further, since we are born in sin, what of those children who die who have not come to Him?
What is unceasingly fascinating to me JAA2310, is that you totally ignore Jesus' promise of a guide (well, hey, He only said it three times according to the book you pretend to follow) but you quote the passage concerning searching the scriptures but leave off the conclusion about failing to come to the one the scripture speaks of. You seem to have a blind spot a mile wide. That blind spot seems to be labeled "Sola Scriptura," one of those "doctrines of men."
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May the Lord richly bless you.