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Old 04-24-2008, 08:39 PM
 
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I am writing a paper for a class and would like to get your opinions...


Background for the paper:

I am comparing what theologians discussed and wrote about their interpretations when it comes to the Book of Revelation. What came out of it are ideas of Millennialism, the Second Creation, and the Kingdom of Heaven. Post millennialism essentially came from chapter 20 of the Book of Revelation in which Christ's second coming occurs after a "Golden Age" of Christian prosperity and dominance. From here we will see a peaceful end of mankind. This was a widely discussed topic in the 19th century. James Moorhead, however, has written that this idea of "post millennialism" has eroded for the most part.

With this idea of a peaceful end of mankind on earth after the second coming of Christ, contemporary views of how the end of mankind will come about differ quite drastically. Instead of the second coming of Christ, people look more towards global warming, nuclear holocaust, and all that are explained in the "Rapture Index".

What is your take on possibilities on the end of mankind whether optimistic or pessimistic, self induced or predetermined by God and the creation of a "Kingdom of Heaven"...

Last edited by june 7th; 04-26-2008 at 07:13 AM..
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Old 04-24-2008, 09:05 PM
 
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Who said anything about an end to mankind? It's about an end to sin.
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Old 04-25-2008, 04:05 AM
 
Location: land of quail, bunnies, and red tail hawks
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It seems you're confusing many different scenarios regarding Biblical End Times, so it's somewhat difficult to answer your question.

In a nutshell, I believe God has spoken prophetically about what is yet to come on earth. Some of these events may be the result of a natural phenomenon or man's interference, but some will clearly be supernatural in origin. Either way, God has foreseen the events, and they WILL happen.

After a period of upheaval hitherto unknown to man, and after the wrath of God has been poured onto the earth, I believe a remnant of people will inherit what is known as the Millennial Kingdom which is a period of 1000 years where Jesus Christ will dwell on the earth and reign in justice. This will be a very blessed time because Satan will be bound, and people will largely live in peace and prosperity, with longevity, yet they will still retain a sin nature. Sometime near the end of this 1000 years, Satan will be let loose on earth, a period which will culminate in a final great battle where Jesus will be victorious. Satan will be thrown into the lake of fire, the earth will be destroyed by fire, and a new heaven and new earth will be prepared. Somehow, this new heaven and earth will play a part in eternity, but I admit that I don't know how all the pieces fit together. I also think these events will come upon us very, very soon.

As you've stated, there are many different views about this time. Some believe there will be a period of peace preceding the upheaval, others don't. Some believe Christians will be raptured before these events occur, some believe the rapture will occur sometime after these events start, others believe there will be more than one rapture, and yet others don't believe there will be any rapture at all. Then, there are people who believe all these events have already occurred and there is no more prophecy to be fulfilled. For those who think prophecy is still to be fulfilled, there is much disagreement about which prophesied war takes place when.
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Old 04-25-2008, 04:09 AM
 
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Hi Spud.
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Old 04-25-2008, 07:57 AM
 
Location: Mississippi
6,715 posts, read 12,276,202 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAJasper View Post
I am writing a paper for a class and would like to get your opinions...


Background for the paper:

I am comparing what theologians discussed and wrote about their interpretations when it comes to the Book of Revelation. What came out of it are ideas of Millennialism, the Second Creation, and the Kingdom of Heaven. Post millennialism essentially came from chapter 20 of the Book of Revelation in which Christ's second coming occurs after a "Golden Age" of Christian prosperity and dominance. From here we will see a peaceful end of mankind. This was a widely discussed topic in the 19th century. James Morrhead, however, has written that this idea of "post millennialism" has eroded for the most part.

With this idea of a peaceful end of mankind on earth after the second coming of Christ, contemporary views of how the end of mankind will come about differ quite drastically. Instead of the second coming of Christ, people look more towards global warming, nuclear holocaust, and all that are explained in the "Rapture Index".

What is your take on possibilities on the end of mankind whether optimistic or pessimistic, self induced or predetermined by God and the creation of a "Kingdom of Heaven"...
I must warn you in advance that I may not be giving you the answer you are looking for. I am not sure if you are looking for a solely Christian perspective but hopefully I can give you a viewpoint from the "outside".

For me, I find it very interesting to note that there seemed to be a rapid change in the way people viewed the Rapture as regards the 19th century and otherwise more modern day accounts. After all, if there were any time that Christians in this country should have probably felt the end was nearing it should have most likely been during the 19th century. It seems, that by looking through 19th century history that the United States was particularly dominated by the Christian religion. It was at that time that any form of secularism was attritioned with the label of "atheism" or, worse, "satan worshipping". The country ebbed and flowed on the tides of Christianity and save for the Civil War, most of the 19th century was rather peaceful (yes, I am aware of the War of 1812). Of course, with that present viewpoint, and with the domination of an otherwise peaceful Christian nation at hand, why shouldn't people have thought that the Rapture was approaching just as predicted? After all, if there were ever a "Golden Age" of Christian prosperity and dominance, one needs look no further in America than the 19th century. So, again, is it any wonder that this viewpoint seemed to persist in that day and age?

Most people, still today, seem to have the feeling that Christianity is revolved around America alone. After all, it is rare to find any sect of the Christian belief in any other part of the world that really believes in the Rapture at all. Therefore, to me, it seems that this fundamentalist idealism revolves around the state of political and other current affairs in our American society. I do think that at the turn of the 20th century things began to change in the hearts and minds of Americans as a result of both the technological innovation and the impending disaster that would soon strike the country.

Just little more than three decades prior to the 20th century, the country had been torn assunder by one of the bloodiest Civil Wars in history (up to that point) and America was reeling from it's lost sons and daughters and fathers and mothers. So, is it any wonder that this "Golden Age" of peace and prosperity seemed to be on the decline? To follow that, the 20th century brought forth an impressive amount of technology. Orville and Wilbur Wright flew the first aircraft, Henry Ford refined the automaking industry with his production of the Model T and the world continued on with no Rapture in sight. Is it any wonder that with the advent of all of this soon to be technology that those still familiar with the "old" ways must have felt that the end was nearing?! Horses did not walk down the streets but cars rumbled down them. Airplanes begain buzzing overhead and streetlights were on at night. Pictures were being taken and the young crowds seemed to be a bit more boisterous and loud. How could that not be the end of the world?

So, we move onwards into the twentieth century and we see that World War I occurred after the assassination of Archduke Ferdinand and we became involved after the sinking of the Lusitania. As a result, more technological innovation was wrought with the necessity of the war machine and once again wives and mothers looked upon their husbands and sons coming home wounded or just not coming home at all. After that the country ran into a Great Depression and shortly after that, World War II came to the scene and once again it was more of the same with even more technological advancements. Nuclear bombs were first introduced to the world and shortly thereafter the strongheld fear of Communists arose in America.

The Communists must surely have seemed like a frightful bunch. They impeded on the American way of life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness and, of course, Christianity. When else would there be a better time for the end? As the Cold War progressed, people began to fear the nuclear holocaust that seemed so realistic. Nikita Kruschev stirred up controversy with the Cuban Missile Crisis and Kennedy was killed a little while later. How could this NOT be the end? Aren't these all the signs of society gone wrong?!

Then, of course, the Vietnam War began, hippies marched in the streets, pot was smoked, drugs were taken, and yet, surely this must have seemed like the end! After all, what heathens could dominate such a world?

As we progress onwards through the 70's (with more American boys not coming home or coming home in body bags from Vietnam) we can push right into the 80's when the HIV/AIDs media sensation broke wild. Of course, this must have been a god given sign! How else could an uncurable disease penetrate all these heathen homosexuals and drug addicts?! Surely, it must have been God getting fed up and showing the signs of what was to come.

We can then move onwards into the 90's and the early part of this new millenia. The new rages and concerns seem to be the Iraq War and a Green Planet. Naturally, why do we even wonder if this is part of a "sign of things to come"? After all, America has been there, done that, and showed that the impending Revelation that so many want to happen should have happened so long ago in the 19th century when America was at its' peak of Christian dominance and perserverence. I don't think the Christian right in America will ever stand up to that light again and so I am left in awe at those who still look for signs of the Rapture and the "End Times" in today's modern day and age. After all, if it wasn't the Nazi's, Japanese, Nuclear Holocausts, Communist Invasions, Great Depressions, Civil Wars, and drug abusing hippies running naked in the streets then is there really cause for concern (or in some cases elation?) that these might be the "End Times"? I think not. I think it's just people's fears of modern day politics and current events letting them get the best of their faith.

Last edited by GCSTroop; 04-25-2008 at 08:05 AM..
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Old 04-25-2008, 09:29 AM
 
Location: USA
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The world will end at the time apointed by GOD. When someone dies, the world has ended for him or her. The world has ended for lots and lots of folks!

But, according to the bible, there is coming an absolute end to the entire physical universe. Those who believe the Bible, know the Truth. Those who don't, think those who do are crazy. Those who do think those who don't, are crazy.

I am fully convinced the Bible is the Word from GOD. If you want to know my beliefs, study the Bible. You answer the question!
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Old 04-25-2008, 09:55 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GCSTroop View Post
I must warn you in advance that I may not be giving you the answer you are looking for. I am not sure if you are looking for a solely Christian perspective but hopefully I can give you a viewpoint from the "outside".
Interesting post, Troop. I've told you before, you need to quit your mechanic job and be a teacher!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAJasper View Post
What is your take on possibilities on the end of mankind whether optimistic or pessimistic, self induced or predetermined by God and the creation of a "Kingdom of Heaven"...
A challenge for you!

I put forth a challenge in this thread: The kingdom of God and I didn't really get any responses regarding it. The challenge was.. pick any verse in the NT that refers to "the Kingdom of God" or "the kingdom of Heaven" (I did a search for these verses and pasted them in the thread) and see if there are any verses that refer to a literal reign, and not the kingdom of God which believers enter upon a new birth, or the heavenly kingdom waiting for the faithful (heaven).

I feel like I'm repeating myself () but this thread 1000 year reign of Christ...already here, or coming? explains abit how I view the 1000 year reign.

In short, regarding your questions, this is what I believe:

The kingdom of heaven came with power on the day of Pentecost. This is not a literal kingdom, but spiritual.. Christ reigning in our hearts. Christ made it abundantly clear different times that His kingdom was not a physical, worldly kingdom wielding worldly power, but rather of a different country.
Luke 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

This "1000 years" is a figurative length of time, a time we are in right now.. the gospel era. Prophecy has been fulfilled.. and as joedrsaved mentioned, the world could end for each one of us at any time (by death).. and Christ could appear at any time in the clouds (second coming), when time will be over, all will be judged and go to their reward. We don't need to look for anything else.
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Old 04-25-2008, 10:00 AM
 
Location: NW Arkansas
3,978 posts, read 7,628,957 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joedrsaved View Post
The world will end at the time apointed by GOD. When someone dies, the world has ended for him or her. The world has ended for lots and lots of folks!

But, according to the bible, there is coming an absolute end to the entire physical universe. Those who believe the Bible, know the Truth. Those who don't, think those who do are crazy. Those who do think those who don't, are crazy.

I am fully convinced the Bible is the Word from GOD. If you want to know my beliefs, study the Bible. You answer the question!
My sentiments exactly...well said.
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Old 04-25-2008, 10:07 AM
 
7,812 posts, read 10,704,138 times
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Default Listen to your mother:

Quote:
Originally Posted by cg81 View Post


pick any verse in the NT that refers to "the Kingdom of God" or "the kingdom of Heaven" (I did a search for these verses and pasted them in the thread) and [b]see if there are any verses that refer to a literal reign, and not the kingdom of God which believers enter upon a new birth, or the heavenly kingdom waiting for the faithful (heaven).




This "1000 years" is a figurative length of time, a time we are in right now.. the gospel era. Prophecy has been fulfilled.. and as joedrsaved mentioned, the world could end for each one of us at any time (by death).. and Christ could appear at any time in the clouds (second coming), when time will be over, all will be judged and go to their reward. We don't need to look for anything else.
I'm thinking refer to the above.

And pull out the text book!
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Old 04-25-2008, 10:36 AM
 
Location: DFW area
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Well said by everyone here!
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