Question For Reformed Theology Students (doctrine, church, Revelation, believe) - Christianity - - City-Data Forum

AmbassadorNY · 05-13-2008, 01:50 PM

I have a question and wonder if you all have studied this topic, particularly 1 scripture. But first, I'll tell you what I believe that leads up to the ONLY scripture of confusion. Then I'll get into what I found out about such scripture.

What I believe, as consistent to what Reformed Theology teaches:

*I believe if we are among the elect class, then we cannot and will not fall away from The Lord. I believe we are preserved until the end and no one can snatch us out of the hands of the Lord, as written in scripture.
(John 10: 27-30, taken from Interlinear Greek/English) "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give eternal life to them, and they shall never perish to the age; and not anyone shall pluck them out of My hand. My Father who has given them to Me is greater than all, and no one is able to pluck out of my Father's hand. I and the Father are one!")

*I believe in predestination (Ephesians 1 speaks for itself)

I do not believe salvation can be earned by works.

I believe no one can come to the Lord unless effectually called by the Holy Spirit.

I believe that The Chosen Ones who fall away for a period of time will see that it was only temporary and that they can never fall away completely; They will absolutely remain in faith until their last breath.

I believe that if one has professed to be a true follower of Christ (or "chosen"), and eventually fell away and turned their back on God completely (apostasy), and then died in that same mindset, then they were falsely assured of their salvation at one point but were never really chosen to begin with. In other words, if you remain in faith until you die, you will reside in heaven with the Lord.

RE: Book of Life
B]I believe the names of the Elect/Chosen ones/Saints have been written in the Book of Life, which belonged to Christ since the foundation of the world's beginning.[/b] I believe if God wrote one's name in the Book of Life, it will not be erased, because God doesn't choose people and then realize He was wrong, and consequently be considered imperfect.

Scriptures to back this up:

Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Rev 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in thebook of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Rev 3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

HOWEVER... I ask you about this one scripture:

REVELATIONS 22:19 "And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and [from] the things which are written in this book."

RESEARCH I DID SHOWED (in NKJV Thompson Chain Reference Bible) THAT IN THE MAJORITY TEXT (M-Text), THE WORDS ACTUALLY READ: "MAY GOD add to him..." and "...MAY GOD TAKE AWAY his part..."

Interlinear Greek says "God WILL take away his part..."

(Majority Text ALSO reads "take away his part from the TREE OF LIFE)"

Has anyone done studying on this? It's a tough scripture to come to a final conclusion on. I tried looking up info on what the Majority Text is and I just got confused with information overload. Could someone who's done research on translation of this scripture please help out? I think you know what I'm getting at.... It's the only scripture in the Bible that I've found after endless research, that speaks of one's name being removed from the Book of Life.

Thanks everyone, and God Bless.

Junos · 05-13-2008, 02:10 PM

He that adds to the Bible, all the plagues shall be added to him; he that takes from it, all the blessings shall be taken from him; and, doubtless, this guilt is incurred by all those who lay hinderances in the way of the faithful, which prevent them from hearing their Lord's "I come," and answering, "Come, Lord Jesus."

I believe that if you add to it or take away from it you will be thrown into the lake of fire. No and, if's or buts. Just my thought!

Mark S. · 05-13-2008, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Junos

He that adds to the Bible, all the plagues shall be added to him; he that takes from it, all the blessings shall be taken from him;

How can you apply the Scripture quoted above to that conclusion, since "the Bible" did not even exist during the time of John's vision?

Junos · 05-13-2008, 02:28 PM

Commentary "Wesly's Notes" for Rev. 22. Matthew Henry's commentary says .. All are condemned who should dare to corrupt or change the word of God, either by adding to it, or taking from it.

AmbassadorNY · 05-13-2008, 02:36 PM

Mark, true, I believe they were referring to the plagues mentioned in Revelation. "Book", as referred to in this passage ("And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy...") appears to have a connotation of a "small book" in Greek. The Bible was not "put together" yet when John spoke these words.

AmbassadorNY · 05-13-2008, 02:38 PM

I read Matthew Henry's commentary on this as well, and he describes it as "a warning", however he writes very little in explanation.

Anyone familiar with the M-Text? (or rather, "Majority Text")

AmbassadorNY · 05-13-2008, 04:12 PM

The question here is whether one can be recorded by God in the Lamb's Book of Life, (which is written from the foundation of the world), as spoken of in Ephesians, and then be removed from it by God, who originally wrote it there? The Book of Life is supposed to contain all the names of those chosen by God to be a saint and predestinates them to reside in heaven after they die.

Actually, if you think about it, would one of God's chosen ones ever change the words of the book knowing what the last scripture says about such an act?

The key context here is "God will take away"

World Citizen · 05-13-2008, 06:57 PM

You are looking at words and not using spiritual discernment... Are you a Universalist?

AmbassadorNY · 05-13-2008, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by World Citizen

You are looking at words and not using spiritual discernment... Are you a Universalist?

I am truly seeking help here in finding the answer to this. I've been working on it for weeks and even called a pastor at a church about it. He told me if I dont understand it, don't read it.

I was furious. If the thread is offensive, I can remove it. I am seriously only trying to get some help that's all.

AmbassadorNY · 05-13-2008, 10:53 PM

Another question that may seem silly... World Citizen, are you familiar with Reformed Theology? That is what I study.

I would probably prefer an angle from someone who shares the same belief system as Reformers. No offense to anyone here though. I just don't want any 'confusing' doctrine to enter the picture... or the topic. My apologies to anyone who may become offended at my statement, I mean no harm.