Day of the Lord...It's more than a Screen Name (Gospel, doctrine)
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I've been accused of so many things since I've been on CD (R&P), which hasn't been long. I was even accused of being blasphemous and self-righteous because of the screen name that I use. There's a reason for it, just like my being here. It wasn't an accident I stumbled across CD in 2006.
There's been so many questions and disagreements about the end times. Here's what I believe, and here's what the screen name means. Once again, I will state my purpose; to spread God's message of the salvation through Jesus Christ His Son to acheive an eternal, immortal life in heaven with God.
"Day of the Lord" is derived from the many times this term is used in the Bible to refer to the rapture of the church, as well as Jesus' second coming. Some seem to be confused by the fact that they are not one in the same, so I want to clear that up if possible. There will be a 2nd coming, but it's actually in two phases.
1 Thessalonians 5:1-2
"Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night."
Let me just take a moment to dissect these two verses.
NOW = change in topic.....NOT "now", as in right this minute.
Like we would say in conversation; "Now, I want to talk about something else." TIMES (plural)= (greek=chronos) = chronology EVENTS (plural)= epoch (kairos) = happenings
"Times" and "events" that lead up to the "day of the Lord" FIRST "YOU" = Paul is speaking to Christian people 2ND "YOU" = Paul is speaking to ALL
In this instance, the "day of the Lord" refers to the day the Lord returns briefly to collect the believers or the body of Christ.
This is the order of things to come:
1. Rapture (day of the Lord, day of "visitation', day of wrath)
2. Rise of the AntiChrist (7 year reign)
3. Salvation of Israel
4. Opening of the seven seals
5. Sounding of the trumpets
6. The 2nd coming of Christ
7. Battle of Armageddon
8. 1000 year reign of Christ
9. Binding of Satan for 1000 years
10. Release of Satan for a short time
11. Final stand or rebellion
12. Great white throne judgement
13. New heaven and the new earth will be created
Essential message:
Believers will not face this day of wrath (day of rapture and God's wrath)
Unbelievers WILL face this day of wrath (the day of wrath for unbelievers)
What you must do to be raptured:
1. Acknowledge your sin
2. you must confess your sin to Jesus
3. You must trust on Jesus....accept Him by faith
I could go on, but I will stop here so as to not make this any longer than it already is and to allow for discussion.
I've been accused of so many things since I've been on CD (R&P), which hasn't been long. I was even accused of being blasphemous and self-righteous because of the screen name that I use. There's a reason for it, just like my being here. It wasn't an accident I stumbled across CD in 2006.
There's been so many questions and disagreements about the end times. Here's what I believe, and here's what the screen name means. Once again, I will state my purpose; to spread God's message of the salvation through Jesus Christ His Son to acheive an eternal, immortal life in heaven with God.
"Day of the Lord" is derived from the many times this term is used in the Bible to refer to the rapture of the church, as well as Jesus' second coming. Some seem to be confused by the fact that they are not one in the same, so I want to clear that up if possible. There will be a 2nd coming, but it's actually in two phases.
1 Thessalonians 5:1-2
"Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night."
Let me just take a moment to dissect these two verses.
NOW = change in topic.....NOT "now", as in right this minute.
Like we would say in conversation; "Now, I want to talk about something else." TIMES (plural)= (greek=chronos) = chronology EVENTS (plural)= epoch (kairos) = happenings
"Times" and "events" that lead up to the "day of the Lord" FIRST "YOU" = Paul is speaking to Christian people 2ND "YOU" = Paul is speaking to ALL
In this instance, the "day of the Lord" refers to the day the Lord returns briefly to collect the believers or the body of Christ.
This is the order of things to come:
1. Rapture (day of the Lord, day of "visitation', day of wrath)
2. Rise of the AntiChrist (7 year reign)
3. Salvation of Israel
4. Opening of the seven seals
5. Sounding of the trumpets
6. The 2nd coming of Christ
7. Battle of Armageddon
8. 1000 year reign of Christ
9. Binding of Satan for 1000 years
10. Release of Satan for a short time
11. Final stand or rebellion
12. Great white throne judgement
13. New heaven and the new earth will be created
Essential message:
Believers will not face this day of wrath (day of rapture and God's wrath)
Unbelievers WILL face this day of wrath (the day of wrath for unbelievers)
What you must do to be raptured:
1. Acknowledge your sin
2. you must confess your sin to Jesus
3. You must trust on Jesus....accept Him by faith
I could go on, but I will stop here so as to not make this any longer than it already is and to allow for discussion.
DayoftheLord: That this is a personal letter from Paul to those first-century saints of Thessalonica is made clear in the very first verse. "To the church OF THE THESSALONIANS in God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ."
Paul proceeds to tell THEM that he, Silvanus and Timothy "give thanks to God always for YOU ALL, making mention of YOU in our prayers, remembering without ceasing YOUR work of faith" (1:2). This entire first chapter and the rest of the epistle are directed to THEM and all of the YOUs pertain to THEM.
Chapter 2: Paul is still talking directly to those first-century Thessalonians! "For YOU yourselves know, BRETHREN, that OUR coming to YOU was not in vain. But even after WE had suffered . . . , as YOU know, WE were bold in our God to speak to YOU the gospel of God" (2:1). The WEs are Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy; the YOUs are the Thessalonians.
"WE were gentle among YOU . . . . affectionately longing for YOU, WE were well pleased to impart to YOU not only the gospel of God, but also OUR own lives, because YOU had become dear to US. For YOU remember, BRETHREN, our labor and toil . . . that we might not be a burden to any of YOU. YOU are witnesses . . . . YOU know how WE exhorted, and comforted, and charged every one of YOU, as a father does his own children, that YOU would walk worthy of God who calls YOU into His own kingdom and glory" (2:7f).
Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy (WE) longed to see THEM (YOU, BRETHREN). But Satan hindered THEM. But THEIR hope was still in this--THEY would see those Thessalonians "in the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ"--when? AT His COMING" (2:17ff)!
Not being able to come himself, Paul sent Timothy, "our brother and minister of God" to establish YOU (the Thessalonians). Paul had told THEM this when he had been with them:
"for YOU yourselves know that WE are apponted to this . . . we told YOU before when WE were with YOU that WE would suffer TRIBULATION. . . . But now Timothy has come to US from YOU, and brought us good news of YOUR faith and love, and that YOU always have good remembrance of US, greatly desiring to see US, as WE also to see YOU" (3:3ff).
Note this: Paul is talking to those first-century brethren of Thessalonica--
"may the Lord make YOU increase and abound in love to one another to all, just as WE do to YOU, so that He may establish YOUR hearts blameless in holiness before our God and Father" (3:12ff)--When? "AT THE COMING OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST with all His saints" (3:13).
Paul then encourages THEM in particular (chapter 4) to remain pure and to love one another just as THEY, the Thessalonian BRETHREN were then doing toward all the brethren in all Macedonia.
Next Paul speaks to THEM about "those who have fallen asleep" (4:13
Here is the context--Paul is talking to those believers of his day about things that were going to impacy him and them personally!
"For this WE say to YOU by the word of the Lord, that WE (all believers of that generation) who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then WE (first-century saints) who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with THEM in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus WE shall always be with the Lord"--and thus shall all believers since that time go to be with Him at death.
Chapter 5 also involves those believers of that day. THEY are the "WE" and the "YOU" and the "US" in these verses. This first letter to the Thessalonians from Paul begins and ends with direct statements to those first-century Thessalonian saints. Note the benediction--"Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify YOU completely; and may YOUR whole spirit, soul, and body be preserved blameless" (5:23)--When? "AT THE COMING OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST." "Brethren, pray for US. Greet all the brethren (of Thessalonica) with a holy kiss" (5:25, 26).
Notice the final verses--"I charge YOU by the Lord that this epistle be read to all the holy BRETHREN" (5:27). If they were charged to do it, then it involved their day and only they could make sure it was read by those of their own day. This letter was passed around to the other churches. The coming of the Lord was to affect them personally. That is the context.
There is nothing in these verses that indicates that all of a sudden Paul starts talking about a different group of believers.
James said it clearly--"The coming of the Lord is AT HAND" (5:8).
Whatever the so-called "rapture" was, it happened in the first century to those first-century believers!
Preterist,
No need to keep quoting such long posts...I'll just address you. Honestly, your long posts with the "you, they, them" all capitalized does not impress me. I skimmed through it, because you keep saying the same things, but you're not really saying anything. I see that you think you have some kind of moral obligation to dispute what I say, but this is reaalllllly getting old.
I just have a couple of questions for you.
Is it the fear of dying or the world coming to an end that scares you into believing what you do? As a Christian, that should not be a prospect to dread...it should be a time for rejoicing and looking forward to being with our Lord and Saviour. There should be absolutely NO fear if you are a Christian.
How do you explain that the Bible says that the earth will be destroyed by fire? That obviously is one thing FOR SURE you cannot claim or hope has happened yet.
Isaiah 51:5-6 "My righteousness draws near speedily, (no specific time mentioned) my salvation is on the way (doesn't say when) and my arm will bring justice to the nations. The islands will look to me and wait in hope for my arm. Lift up your eyes to the heavens, look at the earth beneath; the heavens will vanish like smoke, the earth will wear out like a garment and its inhabitants die like flies. But my salvation will last forever, my righteousness will never fail."
2 Peter 3:10-13 "But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar, the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything in it will be laid bare. Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? Yo ought to live holy and godly lives as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming. That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat. But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, the home of righteousness."
Oh yeah, and I never said it's only been two days since Jesus died on the cross....it was to make a point between God's time and our time being two completely different things. Since a day is like a thousand years to God and vice versa, then how can you say with any certainty whatsoever that it hasn't been two days in God's eyes? See my point?
You put way too much emphasis on certain words to drive home a point, one that makes no sense to the majority of Christians. Think about that, and why it is so important to you to change people's way of thinking to yours. Pride cometh before a fall.
Preterist,
No need to keep quoting such long posts...I'll just address you. Honestly, your long posts with the "you, they, them" all capitalized does not impress me. I skimmed through it, because you keep saying the same things, but you're not really saying anything. I see that you think you have some kind of moral obligation to dispute what I say, but this is reaalllllly getting old.
But the man is making perfect sense, DOTL. If you isolate personal bias of what you WANT and WISH the scripture to say and just just treat the scriptures honesty you CANNOT take away from them that somehow, all of sudden, a CONTEXT that clearly shows a specific time frame flies 2,000 years (and counting) into the future. To do otherwise is to be blatantly dishonest.
I don't even agree with Preterist on his conclusion that the events were fulfilled in Jesus' day or the generation he left behind or that just came after, but I can confidently say that the scripture (s) are very clear in what they are saying. It's because the obvious cannot be accepted the true conclusion cannot be considered.
The book of Matthew states that Jesus told his Disciples who were with him that they would NOT finish preaching around Israel before he came back. I am not sure how much clearer it could be.
Last edited by yydanay515; 05-25-2008 at 08:12 PM..
Just one question: where is the word "rapture" found in the scriptures?
It's not in the scriptures....the word "rapture" began being used somewhere in the 17th century (not sure of the exact century or date) by a pastor (not sure of his name). It's just a word used to describe being "caught up", which is the phrase used in the Bible. But, you have to give the guy credit....when someone mentions 'rapture', it sends people into orbit but at least everyone knows what it is referring to. I think that was probably the whole point.
But the man is making perfect sense, DOTL. If you isolate personal bias if what you WANT an WISH the scripture to say and just just treat the scriptures honesty you CANNOT take away from them that somehow, all of sudden, a CONTEXT that clearly shows a specific time frame flies 2,000 years (and counting) into the future. To do otherwise is to be blatantly dishonest.
I don't even agree with Preterist on his conclusion that the events were fulfilled in Jesus' day or the generation he left behind or that just came after, but I can confidently say that the scripture (s) are very clear in what they are saying. It's because the obvious cannot be accepted the true conclusion cannot be considered.
The book of Matthew states that Jesus told his Disciples who were with him that they would NOT finish preaching around Israel before he came back. I am not sure how much clearer it could be.
Believe what you want, but only "time" will tell. And Jesus said that because He wasn't just speaking to the disciples in front of Him, He was speaking of the ones to come also. The context clearly does not show a specific timeframe...neither one of you can prove anything. I've told you this before and I'll say it again.....true discernment comes with much study, guidance through the Holy Spirit and not leaning upon your own understanding, as some are clearly doing. Peace out.
Believe what you want, but only "time" will tell. And Jesus said that because He wasn't just speaking to the disciples in front of Him, He was speaking of the ones to come also. The context clearly does not show a specific timeframe...neither one of you can prove anything. I've told you this before and I'll say it again.....true discernment comes with much study, guidance through the Holy Spirit and not leaning upon your own understanding, as some are clearly doing. Peace out.
Which scriptural context are you referring to DOTL?
I've been accused of so many things since I've been on CD (R&P), which hasn't been long. I was even accused of being blasphemous and self-righteous because of the screen name that I use. There's a reason for it, just like my being here. It wasn't an accident I stumbled across CD in 2006.
There's been so many questions and disagreements about the end times. Here's what I believe, and here's what the screen name means. Once again, I will state my purpose; to spread God's message of the salvation through Jesus Christ His Son to acheive an eternal, immortal life in heaven with God.
"Day of the Lord" is derived from the many times this term is used in the Bible to refer to the rapture of the church, as well as Jesus' second coming. Some seem to be confused by the fact that they are not one in the same, so I want to clear that up if possible. There will be a 2nd coming, but it's actually in two phases.
1 Thessalonians 5:1-2
"Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night."
Let me just take a moment to dissect these two verses.
NOW = change in topic.....NOT "now", as in right this minute.
Like we would say in conversation; "Now, I want to talk about something else." TIMES (plural)= (greek=chronos) = chronology EVENTS (plural)= epoch (kairos) = happenings
"Times" and "events" that lead up to the "day of the Lord" FIRST "YOU" = Paul is speaking to Christian people 2ND "YOU" = Paul is speaking to ALL
In this instance, the "day of the Lord" refers to the day the Lord returns briefly to collect the believers or the body of Christ.
This is the order of things to come:
1. Rapture (day of the Lord, day of "visitation', day of wrath)
2. Rise of the AntiChrist (7 year reign)
3. Salvation of Israel
4. Opening of the seven seals
5. Sounding of the trumpets
6. The 2nd coming of Christ
7. Battle of Armageddon
8. 1000 year reign of Christ
9. Binding of Satan for 1000 years
10. Release of Satan for a short time
11. Final stand or rebellion
12. Great white throne judgement
13. New heaven and the new earth will be created
Essential message:
Believers will not face this day of wrath (day of rapture and God's wrath)
Unbelievers WILL face this day of wrath (the day of wrath for unbelievers)
What you must do to be raptured:
1. Acknowledge your sin
2. you must confess your sin to Jesus
3. You must trust on Jesus....accept Him by faith
I could go on, but I will stop here so as to not make this any longer than it already is and to allow for discussion.
The Day of the Lord is when a believer is prepared to be quickened, transfigured.
There is also a day of the Lord where He will come in His kingdom with power.
Those that He said; There be some standing here that shall not taste of death, til I come in My Kingdom with Power, are some of the few that are caught up and transfigured. There have been converts and believers that in the last 2,000 yrs. have been part of this promise, it is given anytime one is prepared to behold the face of Christ.
The RAPTURE as taught by churchianity, is a LIE and will be responsible for millions of self professed Christians, cursing and turning from God, when the woes come upon them and they are still HERE.
The Left Behind Fiction books will go down in history as one of greatest devil doctrines that man has ever seen. Pity those that perpetuate RAPTURE deception.
godspeed,
freedom
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I think that was probably the whole point.
