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Which one wears the coon hats?
Cause that be the one I belong too!!
You do know I'm kidding right????
Yes I do know you're kidding Curly
If you read my post above Then, you know what I believe About The body of Christ And the difference Between The nation of Israel.
The 144,000 We'll be in the tribulation Preaching To all the different nations And revelation Chapter 7 Verse nine Talks about A great multitude That are saved because of their preaching
God had a chosen people, a visible, physical nation, in the Old Testament under the Law. These were the children of Israel.
But all the prophets pointed to a time when all could call upon the name of the Lord, when all other nations would press into His "holy mountain":
Isaiah 25:6 ¶ And in this mountain shall the LORD of hosts make unto all people a feast of fat things, a feast of wines on the lees, of fat things full of marrow, of wines on the lees well refined. 7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. 8 He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it. 9 ¶ And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation.
This is a major topic of Old Testament prophecy.. and rightly so, for this pointed to the time of the Messiah, the Redeemer promised to Adam and Eve.
And then Jesus came, fulfilling the law and making the Old Testament sacrifice obsolete.
John the Baptist proclaimed that this time was at hand:
Luke 3:3: And he came into all the country about Jordan, preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins; 4 As it is written in the book of the words of Esaias the prophet, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight. 5 Every valley shall be filled, and every mountain and hill shall be brought low; and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough ways shall be made smooth; 6 And all flesh shall see the salvation of God. 7 Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come? 8 Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, and begin not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, That God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham. 9 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: every tree therefore which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
The axe was laid to the root of the tree.. fruits must be brought forth. The Old Testament sacrifices, and an earthly Israelite heritage were no longer sufficient.. repentance was needed. And this was for all mankind, all nations. "All flesh shall see the salvation of our God".
This is echoed in the rest of the New Testament:
Galatians 3:6 ¶ Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. 7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. 8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed. 9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham. 10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. 11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. 12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. 13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: 14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
Justified by faith, not under the law.. and these receive the blessing of Abraham, the promises to "the children of God". That can be for everyone!
Romans 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: 29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
Romans 10:12 ¶ For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ’s, then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Col. 3:11: Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
Romans 11 is also an interesting read.
So what does this mean? God no longer has a physical nation as His people: 35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him. (Acts 10:35)
There is no Messiah coming to save Israel.. that has already happened. Many Jews, having hardened hearts, did not see this.. and many people today have the same mistaken view. The Messiah came! He established His nation!
There are no special promises, or unfulfilled prophecies relating to physical Jews.. all has been fulfilled, and is being fulfilled in everyone who repents and believes the Gospel. Nothing will happen in Israel, no great king will come to establish his throne and reinstate the Old Testament sacrifice.. this would be an abomination to God. God will never resume this old, insufficient program. That story is over.. but the new one is still alive!
I remember some scripture from either Romans or Hebrews that really does a great job on this subject, I'll have to dig and see if I can find it.
In short, I believe we(Christians) are Abraham's seed. I believe we are adopted into the Kingdom of God(Israel) and only Christ defines who is and is not 'God's People'.
I remember some scripture from either Romans or Hebrews that really does a great job on this subject, I'll have to dig and see if I can find it.
In short, I believe we(Christians) are Abraham's seed. I believe we are adopted into the Kingdom of God(Israel) and only Christ defines who is and is not 'God's People'.
I agree. Romans 11 talks about this, how the Gentiles are "grafted in" the vine.
I agree. Romans 11 talks about this, how the Gentiles are "grafted in" the vine.
CG81,
Romans chapter 11 verse 25.
For I would not, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles become in.
The Gentiles have been coming in to the body of Christ. For 2000 years.
Verse 26, and so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, there shall come out of Sion. The deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Verse 27 for this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. Also this verse.
Acts chapter 15, verse 14, Simeon has declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles to take out of them a people for his name.
Verse 15 and to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
Verse 16 after this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it out.
Verse 17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
What is he talking about when he says after this I will return?
When the body of Christ is complete. Then he will return and deal again with the Jews. There are many many scriptures that talk about this in the millennial kingdom. If we do not keep Israel and the body of Christ separate. We have all kind of confusion and contradiction that is what Paul is talking about when he talks about rightly dividing the word of truth.
For I would not, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles become in.
The Gentiles have been coming in to the body of Christ. For 2000 years.
Verse 26, and so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, there shall come out of Sion. The deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Verse 27 for this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. Also this verse.
Yes, the Gentiles have been coming in for 2000 years. Romans 11 has some very deep thoughts, but I do not believe that verse 26 means that everyone in Israel shall be saved, but rather that since the Deliverer, Jesus, came, they can be saved just as you and I can be saved. Consider verse 23, coming after it speaks of the Gentiles being grafted in because of the unbelief of God's chosen:
Romans 11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
This would tell me that in order to be saved, people in the Israelite nation need to be grafted in in the same way that the Gentiles need to be. There is no other way to salvation.
Quote:
Acts chapter 15, verse 14, Simeon has declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles to take out of them a people for his name.
Verse 15 and to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
Verse 16 after this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it out.
Verse 17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
What is he talking about when he says after this I will return?
If you read the whole chapter, I believe these verses refer to what happened when Jesus came 2000 years ago and the gospel was opened to all. "After this I will return" were words of prophecy referring to this time. The tabernacle of David is not a physical tabernacle, but referring to the spiritual place of worship or the New Jerusalem in the spiritual kingdom in the reign of Christ today.
Quote:
When the body of Christ is complete. Then he will return and deal again with the Jews.
I believe you're referring to this verse:
Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
The early church was experiencing the time referred to when "The fulness of the Gentiles be come in". This is the time of the new dispensation when all could come in... not to some future time when all Gentiles will be saved. As you mentioned, they have been coming in for 2000 years. If you read the rest of the chapter, (as I mentioned, I can't comprehend all the depth to it) but it talks of how because Israel was blinded, the Gospel was opened to all. This has already happened. People in Israel now need to accept the way of salvation just like anybody else.
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