Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
43And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
43And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Neither this scripture, nor any other scripture in the Bible, teaches that God will let anyone suffer forever.
beloved57 has said on a previous post she doesn't have the time to read the following link.
Other members of this forum may have enough interest to take the time to open it up and read it.
BIBLE THREATENINGS EXPLAINED Bible Threatenings Explained
especially scroll down and click on
CAST INTO HELL-FIRE
Last edited by rodgertutt; 07-11-2009 at 06:58 AM..
Reason: addition
The idea that God will sustain any creature alive in a state of inescapable eternal suffering forever is the most putrid mental "garbage" in existence.
As I have mentioned many times on forums, I, Rodger Tutt, had a complete nervous twelve year breakdown (1966-78) over my inability to love or respect an endless - hell god. (I’m 70) My breakdown was caused by my fear of what God might do to me since I was unable to love or respect Him.
One of the great comforts that helped me to recover was learning that many other people have suffered with the same problem. The following quote is from THE DOCTRINE OF ETERNAL HELL TORMENTS OVERTHROWN by Samuel Richardson, edited by Thomas Whittemore, and published by him in 1833. On page 85, Whittemore says that Richardson wrote this book nearly 200 years before 1833.
First of all, there is what Richardson wrote nearly 200 years before 1833: “The doctrine of endless hell torments hath caused many to murder themselves, taking away their own lives by poison, stabbing, drowning, hanging, strangling, and shooting themselves, casting themselves out of windows, and from high places, to break their necks and by other kinds of death, that they might not live to increase their sin, and increase their torments in hell.”
Now here is what Whittemore the editor, wrote at the bottom of the page nearly 200 years later in 1833:
“Here we see the same dreadful effects attended the doctrine of endless misery nearly 200 years ago which attend it now. It was then the cause of anxiety, despair, and suicide, as we suppose it always was before, where fully believed, and as we know it has been of late years. Let posterity know, that within the last ten years, there have been a large number of suicides, which must be attributed to the doctrine of endless torment. That doctrine makes men melancholy; it drives them to despair; they know not what to do; and they sever the brittle thread, Fathers and Mothers, in repeated instances in the United States, have murdered their children, lest they should grow up, and commit sin, and be ****ed. Can a doctrine which produces such dreadful consequences be the doctrine of God?” End of Quote.
Note that the victims of this theology found no consolation in the Christian gospel. This was my problem too! The question I kept asking myself was, “How can I find comfort in the Christian Gospel when I can’t even love or respect it’s God?”
In my library, I have several dozens of books, most of which I have read, and several hundred cassettes, by 29 different speakers, all of which I have listened to, some of them many times, by men who believe that the Bible (correctly translated) teaches universal transformation; that is, that God will eventually change all suffering into something better that it happened. These books and tapes answer, many times over, the arguments that I have read in seven, (plus parts of other) books in support of the idea that the Bible teaches never ending suffering for part of God’s creation.
In addition to these sources, Hurley Books, Westmoreland, New Hampshire, lists 463 universalist books that can be purchased from them. It will be a comfort to many, as it was to me, to learn that there are so many people who see this kind of God in the Bible.
It is my great joy in life to make this information available to many people via forums and emails. God will use all my efforts as He sees fit. In this great truth I relax! SEE
ABSOLUTE ASSURANCE IN JESUS CHRIST Absolute Assurance
It is my great joy in life to make this information available to many people via forums and emails. God will use all my efforts as He sees fit. In this great truth I relax!
The idea that God will sustain any creature alive in a state of inescapable eternal suffering forever is the most putrid mental "garbage" in existence.
You dont believe in the God of scripture, but a god you have made up in your mind..
Matt 25:
41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
You dont believe in the God of scripture, but a god you have made up in your mind..
Matt 25:
41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
Seems to me that you have made up your mind too beloved57
As I have pointed out before the literal Greek text reads age-during fire.
Young's literal translation.
Here is an expostion that demonstrates how wrong you are beloved 57.
HOW THE BIBLE TEACHES ALL FALLEN CREATURES WILL LOVE GOD
“That we should be to the praise of His glory, who first trusted in Christ.”
Eph. 1:12
Why do we trust in Christ when we do trust in Him?
People who want to give all the glory to God for their trusting in Jesus as their Savior will greatly enjoy and benefit from Jim’s writing and will recognize it as the truth.
The introduction at the beginning of each of the seventeen chapters is not the chapter itself. You must click on the highlighted title of each chapter to bring up the entire chapter to read it.
The “danger” in preaching the truth resides only in the imagination of the person who doesn’t understand the truth.
The online book “HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE” by James Coram needs no defense. It stands on its own merit.
It has helped many people. It will help many more.
Most comments and questions regarding this book are responded to within the writing itself, for example, “WHAT ARE CORRECT TRANSLATIONS OF THE BIBLE?”
A frequent response to first learning about the existence of this book is,
“You believe the words of men, but we believe the Bible.”
But the actual reading of, “HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE” by James Coram will prove to all readers that JUST THE OPPOSITE IS TRUE.
IMHO, "HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE" by James Coram is the most powerful of all of the dozens of books that I have read, the hundreds of tapes that I have listened to, and the many online articles that I have read that show that a correctly, (literally, not interpretively) translated Bible teaches universal salvation, not eternal torment, or even annihilation. (I am 70 years old)
In fact, to me it is so powerful that it renders all arguments to the contrary completely irrelevant to the truth that it proves that, by the time God’s plan for the ages of time has been consummated, the universal salvation of all sinful creatures from everything from which they need to be saved, most certainly, will have occurred. The eons of the Bible With Concordance, God’s purpose of the eons.
It can be read in its entirety online at Concordant Expositions (html format) - His Achievement Are We
Or, it can be Googled up by typing in HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE
It has seventeen chapters, each chapter having its own highlighted heading followed by a short introduction.
Just click on the highlighted heading and the entire text of that chapter will appear.
Since I have read many writings, the sum total of which probably contain every argument in existence in support of the idea that the Bible teaches eternal torment or annihilation, I am confident that if anyone were to read "HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE" in it's entirety, they would change their mind about their belief that the Bible teaches eternal torment or annihilation.
However, as a friend recently reminded me, one must be disposed of the Ultimate Placer to receive any revelation; it’s all about Sovereign causes & effects. Or as Ralph Waldo Emerson put it, “People only see what they are prepared to see.”
Seems to me that you have made up your mind too beloved57
As I have pointed out before the literal Greek text reads age-during fire.
Young's literal translation.
Here is an expostion that demonstrates how wrong you are beloved 57.
HOW THE BIBLE TEACHES ALL FALLEN CREATURES WILL LOVE GOD
“That we should be to the praise of His glory, who first trusted in Christ.”
Eph. 1:12
Why do we trust in Christ when we do trust in Him?
People who want to give all the glory to God for their trusting in Jesus as their Savior will greatly enjoy and benefit from Jim’s writing and will recognize it as the truth.
The introduction at the beginning of each of the seventeen chapters is not the chapter itself. You must click on the highlighted title of each chapter to bring up the entire chapter to read it.
The “danger” in preaching the truth resides only in the imagination of the person who doesn’t understand the truth.
The online book “HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE” by James Coram needs no defense. It stands on its own merit.
It has helped many people. It will help many more.
Most comments and questions regarding this book are responded to within the writing itself, for example, “WHAT ARE CORRECT TRANSLATIONS OF THE BIBLE?”
A frequent response to first learning about the existence of this book is,
“You believe the words of men, but we believe the Bible.”
But the actual reading of, “HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE” by James Coram will prove to all readers that JUST THE OPPOSITE IS TRUE.
IMHO, "HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE" by James Coram is the most powerful of all of the dozens of books that I have read, the hundreds of tapes that I have listened to, and the many online articles that I have read that show that a correctly, (literally, not interpretively) translated Bible teaches universal salvation, not eternal torment, or even annihilation. (I am 70 years old)
In fact, to me it is so powerful that it renders all arguments to the contrary completely irrelevant to the truth that it proves that, by the time God’s plan for the ages of time has been consummated, the universal salvation of all sinful creatures from everything from which they need to be saved, most certainly, will have occurred. The eons of the Bible With Concordance, God’s purpose of the eons.
It can be read in its entirety online at Concordant Expositions (html format) - His Achievement Are We
Or, it can be Googled up by typing in HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE
It has seventeen chapters, each chapter having its own highlighted heading followed by a short introduction.
Just click on the highlighted heading and the entire text of that chapter will appear.
Since I have read many writings, the sum total of which probably contain every argument in existence in support of the idea that the Bible teaches eternal torment or annihilation, I am confident that if anyone were to read "HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE" in it's entirety, they would change their mind about their belief that the Bible teaches eternal torment or annihilation.
However, as a friend recently reminded me, one must be disposed of the Ultimate Placer to receive any revelation; it’s all about Sovereign causes & effects. Or as Ralph Waldo Emerson put it, “People only see what they are prepared to see.”
41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
literally "age-during fire"
No two words in the history of man have been so torturing as aion and aionion. No two words in the history of man, mishandled by man, have contributed more to the physical, emotional and spiritual harm of so many, than these. You may think I must be exaggerating. But I am not. It is the mistranslation of these two words that has foisted the false and destructive doctrine of eternal torment upon the church and the world.
Mistranslation of the Greek words "aion" and “aionion” is a master stroke of diabolical genius. No other words erroneously translated, could more effectively pervert man’s image of God and cause such widespread confusion. The following work by Joseph E. Kirk is offered in the hope that the serious seeker after scriptural truth will be aided in their quest.
CHART OF GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME
THE EONS OF THE BIBLE WITH CONCORDANCE The eons of the Bible With Concordance, God’s purpose of the eons.
Also see
AN ANALYTICAL STUDY OF WORDS An Analytical Study of Words
(especially note the quotes by the many Greek scholars in chapters three and twelve)
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Bible threatenings explained
