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Old 07-22-2009, 11:42 AM
 
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
3,001 posts, read 1,612,725 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodgertutt View Post
SALVATION OUT OF THE LAKE OF FIRE WHICH IS THE SECOND DEATH

EVERYONE WILL BE SAVED – SOME THROUGH THE FIRE – BUT ALL THROUGH THE BLOOD

Any hell that anyone will experience the Bible calls "kolasis aionian," which means age-during corrective chastisement.
Chapter Eleven

It is limited in duration, and corrective in purpose.
AIÓN -- AIÓNIOS
Matthew 25:46 - “Aionian” or “Eternal”

According to the Bible everyone will be saved - some through the fire, but all through the blood.
The Law of Circularity

We should desire to experience the lake of fire if God sees that is what we need. That's how much we can relax in the arms of God's love.

It is God’s decretive will (that which MUST occur) that everyone violates His preceptive will (that which they OUGHT to do) as much as they actually do because each person is being fitted into God’s master plan in a way that necessitates their own individual experience with sin, evil and suffering. Then when God consummates His plan for the ages of time He will eradicate sin and suffering from existence after everyone has learned all that God wants them to learn from its temporary existence.
The eons of the Bible With Concordance, God’s purpose of the eons.

The process of salvation will be completed for the firstfruits of election, (the remnant chosen by grace), after the first resurrection. The process of salvation will be completed for the non-elect after the great white throne judgment. For some, it will include an experience in the lake of fire.

But everyone will be saved out of the lake of fire which is the second death.

You may ask, “What scriptural evidence is there of being saved out of the lake of fire which is the second death?"
There actually is much evidence.

Although the book of Revelation is the last book placed in the Bible, it is not the final revelation of what God is going to do with humanity. The apostle Paul saw way beyond John.

Col.1:25 of which I became a dispenser, in accord with the administration of God, which is granted to me for you, to complete the word of God.

There is much evidence that Paul did see way beyond John. For instance, in Revelation there are still kings reigning, and Christ is still reigning along with His followers. There are still sovereignties and powers in force throughout the book of revelation. So John did not see the day when all sovereignty, authority and power would be done away. Paul did. If you will look at 1Corinthians 15:24-28 Paul saw the day when all of these would be done away. He sees the day when "He should be nullifying all sovereignty, authority and power" (vs.24)

Paul sees the day when Christ will quit reigning (vs.25).

Paul sees the day when death (all death which includes the second death) will be abolished (vs.26). Please remember that death will be abolished **after** all the sovereignties, authorities and powers in Revelation have been nullified. Within the book of Revelation, death is still operational as are the afore mentioned powers.

So what is going to happen to all these people who are in death when death is abolished?

They will come forth vivified (made alive beyond the reach of death) (1Cor.15:22).

They will have their lives justified and will be constituted righteous:
Romans 5:18 Consequently, then, as it was through one offense for all mankind for condemnation, thus also it is through one just award for all mankind for life's justifying.
Romans 5:19 For even as, through the disobedience of the one man, the many were constituted sinners, thus also, through the obedience of the One, the many shall be constituted just.

All will be reconciled to God (Col.1:20)

All will be headed up in Christ (Eph.1:10)

All will bow the knee in the name of Jesus and acclaim with their tongue that "Jesus Christ is Lord" to the glory of God, the Father (Phil.2:9-11).
And we know that anyone who acclaims that Jesus Christ is Lord, especially when it is to God's glory without any hypocrisy is saved for 1Corinthians 12:3 says so.

So there is proof that people will go to the second death **when ** the new earth comes. And there is proof that this is not the final goal God has for these people.

In summary then:
The lake of fire is the second death.
The apostle John did not see into the future as far as the apostle Paul.
How do I know this? and what ramifications does this have as to whether or not one gets out of the lake of fire...the second death? Plenty.
In the book of revelation Christ is still reigning; death is still operational; sovereignties, authorities and powers are still in force.
In 1Cor.15:22-28 Paul sees way beyond John's revelation.
He sees the day when Christ will quit reigning (1Cor.15:25).
He sees the day when all sovereignties, authorities and powers are nullified (1Cor.15:24).
He sees the day when death is abolished (1Cor.15:26) and all are then subjected to Christ then Christ is subjected to God and then God is All in all (1Cor.15:28).
So, yes, there is scripture which intimates that all in the lake of fire will come forth and God will be All in all.
Also in 1Cor.15:22 all are dying and in Christ shall all be vivified. So this happens after death for most.
Also in Romans 5:18,19 you have what happens to all mankind due to what Adam did which happens to the exact same all mankind due to what Christ did. But it does not happen to all at the exact same time.
Each in his own order.

The Lake of Fire

Reconciliation in the Heavens

Savior of the World Series

Where is a resurrection from the lake of fire which is the second death taught in the scriptures?

The lake of fire is distinctly defined as the second death Rev.20:14; 21:8. In it is cast all that is still at enmity with God. So that, death is indeed the last enemy (1 Cor.15:26).

And we are just as decidedly told that Christ is the one who abolishes death and brings life and incorruptibility to light (2 Tim.1:10). The reading "hath abolished" is not true as to fact or as to grammar. It is in the indefinite form (commonly called the aorist tense) simply recording the fact apart from time. Death has not been abolished yet.

How and when it will be abolished is told us in the fifteenth of first Corinthians. It is to be abolished by means of universal vivification (1 Cor.15:22). This takes place at the consummation (1 Cor.15:26).

It is useless to look for plain statements on this subject in parts of the Scriptures whose scope is limited to eonian truth, such as the Revelation. It is unwise to look for it anywhere but in the special portion which deals with this topic. Death and resurrection are exhaustively treated in the, fifteen chapter of first Corinthians and there it is we should look for clear statements as to the ultimate goal. There we are distinctly told that the last enemy that shall be abolished is death (which must refer to the lake of fire, for the first death cannot be the last enemy). And there we are told that it is to be done by a universal vivification rather than resurrection.

The term "resurrection" is applied to those who have afterward died again, such as those who suffer the second death. Hence there is not a resurrection, merely, from the lake of fire, but a vivification beyond which there can be no death.

What do you suppose the lake that burns with fire and brimstone will do? It will burn off of mankind the stubborn will which is contrary to the Lord’s will. It will take that which the Lord subjected man to, death, and will burn its bonds off. The flames of fire will lick the lashes of cords that have bound men in rebellion and will dispose of those cords as one would burn refuse in a hot scorching fire. It is the rebellious will, maintained by ignorance that is burned. The same standard of burning happens to the Overcomer. They are baptized in the very same fire. The fire that constitutes the lake that burns with fire and brimstone and the fire upon the brow of the Overcomer are the very same kind of fire. In both cases, whether it be the Overcomer or the unrepentant sinner, the cords of ignorance as to the will of the Lord are burned off. Such is the ordination in fire, no one will escape it who needs it.
THIS POST REFUTES THE CONCLUSION OF YOUR POST beloved 57.
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:43 AM
 
Location: NC
11,653 posts, read 9,136,471 times
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Right, beloved God bless.

Aionios = of or relating to an age.
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:45 AM
 
Location: In the♥of Jesus !
9,590 posts, read 5,319,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodgertutt View Post
I think it may be time now for eternal tormentors on the forum to start tearing out their hair and ripping their clothes with righteous indignation and breathing out threats to us URs.
Nay.....not worried about you rodgertutt and your groupies threats...LOL!!
God is faithful and greater then any UR's doctrine and His word stands and will reveal the truth to those who He is calling to see the truth instead of the lie, His Holy Spirit has it all in control, no need for any righteous indignation....I trust Him and know He will prevail against this lie that is being proclaimed as His TRUTH!
That is what is wonderful to be His child....no fear, His perfect love casts out fear. So you can threat all you want....because God is my strength!!
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:45 AM
 
Location: The A
1,876 posts, read 1,384,324 times
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Default No forgiveness..

Quote:
Originally Posted by rodgertutt View Post
THIS POST REFUTES THE CONCLUSION OF YOUR POST beloved 57.
No it doesnt, there is no forgiveness for the wicked in a time to come:

matt 12:

32And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:46 AM
 
Location: NC
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God is our strength too, Latte 'Chic. God bless.
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:48 AM
 
Location: NC
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Quote:
Every knee bowing in the Name of Jesus (Phil 2:9; Is 45:23)
“in” is the literal Greek translation. See Young’s Literal Translation.

and every tongue acclaiming that Jesus Christ is Lord.
And we know that anyone who acclaims that Jesus Christ is Lord,
especially when it is to God's glory without any hypocrisy is saved for 1Corinthians 12:3 says so

Every Knee Shall Bow

Every knee shall bow -- forced or free will
Thank you for the links, Rodger. God bless.
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:49 AM
 
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
3,001 posts, read 1,612,725 times
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Default The unforgivable sin

Quote:
Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
No it doesnt, there is no forgiveness for the wicked in a time to come:
matt 12:
32And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
So it's repetion time again. LET'S ROLL!!

The unforgivable sin is an attitude. It is the attitude of attributing to Satan what is really of God. Attitudes cannot be forgiven. They must change.

But having had the attitude can and will be forgiven when, through the enlightenment of the Spirit of God, the wrong attitude gets changed. And having had the attitude will be forgiven after the age to come.

Instead of being forgiven the sinner will suffer the consequences. But the consequences are not eternal. They are what the Bible calls kolasis aionian which mean age-during corrective chastisement. Mark's language "hath never forgiveness" should read "has not forgiveness to the age, but is liable to aionian judgment;” that is, to an indefinite penalty.
Chapter Eleven

Here are good links on the subject of the unforgivable sin.
The Unpardonable Sin: The Unpardonable Sin; What Is The Sin? There Is No Unpardonable Sin! No Forgiveness To The Age; The Day Dawns
There Is No Unpardonable Sin
The Unpardonable Sin
The “Unpardonable Sin”
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:49 AM
 
Location: In the♥of Jesus !
9,590 posts, read 5,319,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShanaBrown View Post
God is our strength too, Latte 'Chic. God bless.
Not if you hold to that lie.....
God does not lie!!! And you all proclaim a lie against His truth!!
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Old 07-22-2009, 11:50 AM
 
Location: E: (0.00) - S: (-0.97)
231 posts, read 173,242 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Latte'Chic View Post
You teach a lie.....shanabrown!
Yes, Some will bow their knee and give praise one day, yet some will not! For they did not accept the truth, because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Romans 1:18-32

You twist the scripture to mean what you want it to say.....You deny Jesus Christ and His ultimate sacrifice on the cross for the sins of the world by stating all will one day reign with Him, regardless if they repent of their sin and receive salvation now....through Him or not!!!

Heb.3:7-19
7 Therefore, as the Holy Spirit says:
“ Today, if you will hear His voice,

8. Do not harden your hearts as in the rebellion, In the day of trial in the wilderness,
9. Where your fathers tested Me, tried Me,
And saw My works forty years.
10. Therefore I was angry with that generation,
And said, ‘They always go astray in their heart,
And they have not known My ways.
11. So I swore in My wrath,‘ They shall not enter My rest.’”
12. Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God;
13. but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.
14. For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end,
15. while it is said:
“ Today, if you will hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts as in the rebellion.”

16 For who, having heard, rebelled? Indeed, was it not all who came out of Egypt, led by Moses?
17. Now with whom was He angry forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness?
18. And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who did not obey?
19. So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.
Your signature and location are an utter farce, you call ShanaBrown a liar, but you are a first class 2 faced judgmental hypocrite, if I had to judge who was telling the truth by the following criteria (I don't identify as christian, thanks to people such as yourself and those that act and think like you), please come down from the pedestal of self righteousness you have placed yourself on

Fruits of the spirit, judging by what it says in Gal, I'd say ShanaBrown is showing the fruits of the spirit, far more than you are

Here are the 9 fruits of the Holy Spirit listed one right after the other in a bullet point format:
  • Love
  • Joy
  • Peace
  • Longsuffering
  • Kindness
  • Goodness
  • Faithfulness
  • Gentleness
  • Self-control
Now here is the specific verse from Scripture where these 9 fruits are being given to us by the Lord:
"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control." (Galatians 5:22)


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Old 07-22-2009, 11:52 AM
 
Location: The A
1,876 posts, read 1,384,324 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alisonminnie View Post
Your signature and location are an utter farce, you call ShanaBrown a liar, but you are a first class 2 faced judgmental hypocrite, if I had to judge who was telling the truth by the following criteria (I'm don't identify as christian, thanks to people such as yourself and those that act and think like you), please come down from the pedestal of self righteousness you have placed yourself on

Fruits of the spirit, judging by what it says in Gal, I'd say ShanaBrown is showing the fruits of the spirit, far more than you are

Here are the 9 fruits of the Holy Spirit listed one right after the other in a bullet point format:
  • Love
  • Joy
  • Peace
  • Longsuffering
  • Kindness
  • Goodness
  • Faithfulness
  • Gentleness
  • Self-control
Now here is the specific verse from Scripture where these 9 fruits are being given to us by the Lord:
"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control." (Galatians 5:22)



No sense quoting that verse, if the person is following a false Gospel..
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