Pentecostal vs. Non-Pentecostal (traditions, women, praying, disciple)

[mari4him]

Originally Posted by urbanlemur

I have read somewhere that a lot of churches have stopped teaching these kinds of messages because they are afraid of driving people away. It's good to see that there are churches that are bold enough to teach us not only that God does indeed love us, but that He is just, righteous and expects us to also to live according to His guidelines and not ours. Sounds like you have a very good, well-rounded service!!

Absolutely and thank you. To be honest with you, I wouldn't be there otherwise. If I merely wanted to be entertained on Sunday morning I could find any other number of things to do, including sleeping in rather than getting up at 7am to get a family of 7 ready and out the door by 10:30am. LOL.

I go to church because it is what God wants us to do, to assemble together. I go to church to hear His word, but not to hear man and simply take what man says as gospel truth, I have my bible with me, I read along, I take notes, I compare and I study. If the message does not align itself with God's word I would question the church.

I believe that when you walk into church, you sit down and hear a message, God is not interested in us walking out the same way we walked in. He wants to deal with our lives, with our hearts. He wants to change us and make us more like Him. He wants the seeds to land on furtile ground and be watered through our continued prayer life.

If all a church expects or encourages their congregation to do is to walk in each week and walk out the same, never changing, never growing, never being transformed by the word of God and by His Spirit, something is wrong.

[urbanlemur]

mari4him: I agree with you 100% and I hope all of us are getting this when we go to our church.

[World Citizen]

Originally Posted by mari4him

Very well said.

God is absolutely looking for a people that will draw closer to Him and let Him move in all of His power.

And I agree with you whole heartedly that He is not concerned with the name on the outside of the church.

What He is concerned with is the hearts of those that are called His church.

Amen.

Very well said, BOTH of you!

But I can't rep you yet.... sorry!

[joedrsaved]

I would like to point out some of the things that I find to be good about modern Pentecostals, at least from my experience.

Their sincerity. Sincerity about serving GOD is essential to following JESUS. Those who say that Sunday belongs to GOD, need to get their calender out and take a close look at the other six days of the week. He owns them all and He expects His children to honor Him 24/7. More than any other group in America, I've found the Pentecostals to be the most sincere about serving the LORD JESUS. Again that's been my experience and I highly value that sincerity and zeal.

Another great asset of the Pentecostals is their rigid determination to allow GOD to manifest the gifts of the SPIRIT in their lives. It's important to read the Bible about the gifts, but it is an extreme blessing to fellowship with those who actually know the gifts from experience.

In all we are far better off with them than we would be without them. They are truly the LORDs people.

I sometimes with zeal might sound negative. But I know the time is short and I want to overcome and also want all saints to overcome. But looking back over the years, I can truly say, the Pentecostals have been a great blessing to me and to several members of my family and all that by the grace of GOD with Whom is Salvation, glory, and all praise forever in JESUS!

[sun queen]

Hmm... I think all "Believers"/ Christians should follow the whole counsel of the Word. I mean Jesus never said the Pentecostal's, or the Baptist or any other denomination was better than another. HE did not sanction such religious divisions. HE said that HE will return for the Church, HIS Bride... I don't think there is any room for religion in that. The Word of God also says salvation cannot be obtained through works, but by the Spirit... I believe this scripture encompasses religion or denominations too. Believers need to remember only the the blood that Jesus the Christ shed on the cross atoned for sin, and there is no room for denominational divisions in that either.

[Hiram]

Originally Posted by mari4him

The church that I attend now, due to having moved, runs a little bit shorter than what I am accustomed to, however, it still follows along the same lines or structure if you will as previous ones.

1) Opening with Praise and Worship (some contemporary and some older hymns) The word tells us to enter His gates with thanksgiving and His courts with praise. I believe this is the time that brings us into His presence. I know for me it is an essential time where I begin to shut out all the worries and concerns of the world as I lay them at His feet.

2) Prayer - A time to thank God for all He has done and ask for His spirit to move upon the congregation, to open our hearts to receive what He would have us receive that day and a prayer that it be Him speaking to the hearts and minds of His children. Giving the service to Him to do as He wills.

3) Announcements - Any upcoming missions or outreaches. Any upcoming bible studies or opportunities for the church to gather together for a time of fellowship among believers.

4) The message - The heart and bulk of it all. God's word read and a message delivered often providing practical application to one's life and quite often carrying an "ouch" feeling at some point where conviction sets in. No there is no tickling of the ears nor a message of "its okay just do what feels comfortable" In fact, just this past Sunday it was clearly stated that God is more concerned with our character than He is with our happiness or as I have heard it said before, our comfort.

5) Closing in Prayer - A time to ask God to change us. To help us take His word and have it engraved in our hearts. To transform us and make us more like Him. An invitation to any and all who may be moved of God to accept Him as their own personal Lord and Savior. A blessing for our lives, for our church, for our community and for our nation.

6) A praise or worship song as led by the spirit to be and an invitation for those who are moved to give an offering, or their tithes, to give. No force or strongarming, no guilting anyone into it, just merely an opportunity to do so as moved by the Spirit to do.

7) End of service, some linger around and fellowship or talk for a bit, others go gather their children and others leave to go about their day.

We should be in God's presence at all times. Once we enter the kingdom, we are naturally part of the body.

Luke 9:23 Then He said to [them] all, "If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow Me.

Hebrews 3:13 but exhort one another daily, while it is called "Today," lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.


http://www.city-data.com/forum/4340802-post181.html

Originally Posted by joedrsaved

I would like to point out some of the things that I find to be good about modern Pentecostals, at least from my experience.

Their sincerity. Sincerity about serving GOD is essential to following JESUS. Those who say that Sunday belongs to GOD, need to get their calender out and take a close look at the other six days of the week. He owns them all and He expects His children to honor Him 24/7.

Another great asset of the Pentecostals is their rigid determination to allow GOD to manifest the gifts of the SPIRIT in their lives. It's important to read the Bible about the gifts, but it is an extreme blessing to fellowship with those who actually know the gifts from experience.

In all we are far better off with them than we would be without them. They are truly the LORDs people.

I sometimes with zeal might sound negative. But I know the time is short and I want to overcome and also want all saints to overcome. But looking back over the years, I can truly say, the Pentecostals have been a great blessing to me and to several members of my family and all that by the grace of GOD with Whom is Salvation, glory, and all praise forever in JESUS!

Romans 10:2 For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge.

[joedrsaved]

Hiram--- Paul was witnessing there about Jews who did not know JESUS. The Pentecostals do know JESUS. and I bear them witness of that! I'm not suggesting that they are yet perfect in every way and most of them probably would tell us the same and I would tell everyone that I'm not completely perfect yet either. But my and their perfect LORD is perfecting us and has perfectly saved us.

[Saintmarks]

I was raised in a denomination well known for winning souls and preaching the word but not open to the manifestation of the gifts of the Spirit as found in pentecostal and charismatic churches. I wasn't taught that such were of the devil or in error, but that the days of miracles ended with biblical times. Something about that never satisfied me. The only pentecostals I knew were into a legalistic expression, strict in dress, hair, make up, etc, but I also knew fundamentalists in my own denomination that preached an outward holiness like this as well. I always felt uneasy with outward measurements of holiness. Not that I agree that one should go to the opposite side and flaunt liberties either, but the rules on hair and dress and such always turned me off. I guess that's why I was never exposed to the gifts of the Spirit in my formative years.

When I was in college, I found myself in a backslidden state. I was still active in my church, but found myself too often singing in the choir on a Sunday morning when I had been actively pursuing the devil's ways the previous evening. I got to a point where I knew I was double minded and I knew I had to go whole hog with the world or get serious about my Christian walk.

I met a guy at my college who really walked the walk in victory. Through many discussions, he showed me in scripture that I needed to ask the Lord to deliver me from various spirits that I had allowed in my life through my sinful behaviors. I did not have much experience with this type of ministry or teaching, but I was game as I knew I wasn't living a victorious life.

The evening we prayed for God to set me free, my friend then showed me Matt 12:43-45

“When an unclean spirit goes out of a man, he goes through dry places, seeking rest, and finds none. Then he says, ‘I will return to my house from which I came.’ And when he comes, he finds it empty, swept, and put in order. Then he goes and takes with him seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter and dwell there; and the last state of that man is worse than the first. So shall it also be with this wicked generation.”

He then showed me the verses in Acts where the believers were filled with the Spirit. He then prayed with me. Tongues came flowing out, words and syllables I could never have come up with on my own. A sense of freedom enveloped me, a power filled my inner parts like I have never known. As we left the room, I felt like I was ten feet tall. My friend said it was the weight of bondage that had been lifted and my Spirit was now energized and filled by the power of the Holy Spirit in a way I had not known, that is why I felt taller.

I mention my personal testimony to say that I was not looking for tongues, I was not seeking an "experience," rather, I was seeking freedom from habitual sins and a return to the God of my childhood with full abandonment. I had tried in my own power to live a victorious life, but had failed. It was not until I totally turned my ability to live a Christian life totally over to the Lord and allowed him to take me to a place that was not in my religious tradition that I found the power to walk out what I knew to be truth.

Since this time I have met with a tremendous persecution from Christians who vehemently oppose this expression of Christianity. I have yet to meet an unsaved person or even another from a non-Christian religion who has been as hurtful and rejecting as my own brothers in the Lord. I do not understand why this is such a divisive issue.

I see this same attitude in some postings here. Why is there such a vehemence against any and all things "pentecostal" or "charismatic?" My brothers and sisters in this stream of Christianity aren't starting a war against the more traditional groups that aren't moving in the gifts, but I have seen and witnessed a great deal of animosity towards my experience and others like me. Why is this so divisive? Even moreso, again, than what I have experienced from non-Christians.

I yearn for the unity of the Body of Christ. I believe God is coming for a pure church, a spotless bride. Yet it grieves me to see such divisiveness. Why is this so? Why do tongues and miracles and expressive worship frighten some Christians the way it does to have a biblical war?

[Submariner]

Originally Posted by Hiram

OK, two weren't, Acts 2 and 10. Please, before you give your "testimony" I would appreciate an "It is written" otherwise, who is being edified here. Are you teaching something. How will I understand you if you do not back up your statements? Thanks. So you Pentecostals have a lot of answering to do with scripture. I will look forward to the replies.

My only reply is: "It is written"

There exist only five records or accounts in the Bible of people being born again, in each of those five they spoke in tongues.

The laying on of hands was a rarity, needed to fix a problem. In God's Grace and timing it was not needed. Only God's love and the faithful obedience of the believers can make it all work smoothly.

Many will testify that they heard God's Word spoken to them from the lips of a Believer while speaking in tongues. And yet anyone can record and analyse those same tongues, and they come away scratching their heads.

This is all about freedom of choice. You must be allowed to decide for yourself.

If I showed you, absolute PROOF, you would no longer have a free will choice.

There will come a day when every head will bow, and every knee,...

But today there is yet a choice. So you must still be allowed that choice.

Focus on why it can not be so, and you will further prove to yourself why it can not be so. A self-fulfilling prophecy.

Cry to God, ask Him to guide you. And He will.

God never fails.

[mari4him]

Originally Posted by Hiram

We should be in God's presence at all times. Once we enter the kingdom, we are naturally part of the body.

Hiram, your comment appears to take something in my post out of context and make it appear as what was being said was something that in all actuality is not what is meant. Of course we should be in God's presence at all times and not only during praise and worship. To assume that I would mean the opposite in any way is absurd.

However, to clarify what I meant is that during praise and worship is a time when I myself at least, shut out the rest of the world completely. Try to remove from my consciousness any worries, my to do list, my bills, etc etc. You know all those other little life things that we tend to have to give some thought to during the day. Yes, those things I try to put out of my mind as I simply enter, should I say deeper and more focused, and rest in His presence and in His presence alone. Me and God, nothing else exists in that moment.

But yes I do agree with you, being in His presence on a daily basis is where we should be.