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Old 10-10-2008, 06:47 AM
 
Location: Romeoville, IL
1,238 posts, read 2,180,235 times
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I suppose a claim could also be made for Eastern Orthodoxy, but by all accounts, in RCIA we are taught that even though we should respect the views of our protestant brethren, they are of lesser status in terms of how to be faithful to Jesus. The teaching is that protestant Christians are inferior to Catholics. I myself do not like such a title, 'inferior', but I suppose it makes sense when you think about it. The Catholic Church is the Church as Jesus intended it to be, while the protestant religions have 'watered down' in a sense what it means to be Christian, and have even warped many of the views.

 
Old 10-10-2008, 07:06 AM
 
Location: Purgatory
396 posts, read 730,494 times
Reputation: 107
That line of teaching is one of many reasons I've been seriously contemplating leaving the Catholic Church. I don't like that line of thinking and don't think that Catholics or Protestants should have that kind of thinking. Unfortunately, I've seen it all too often (and quite a bit on this board) that people think they are better than someone else because they "have the right brand/version of Christianity." I'll argue my points on the board and enjoy a good debate with others, but I know that as long as you believe in God and Christ, you're no different than me...Christian or Protestant. On the same note, I don't hate non-Christians or think I'm better than they are. I had a prof in college (for History of the Holocaust) who was Jewish. Dr. Shur (God bless her soul) was the most wonderful prof I had. As much as I hate to say it, she was the stereotypical little old Jewish lady...walked with a cane. We were all afraid of her...myself included until I sat down in her office one day and talked with her for 2 hours and realized that she was just as regular as the rest of us...and after attending the Yom-HaShoah (Holocaust Remembrance Day) with her, I realized just how religious she was...and I admired her for it...actually thought she was that much better than I am. So...no, I don't think there is any one church better than the other.

Incidentally, if you ever want to read some good books, do an author search for her: Dr. Irene G. Shur. She actually wrote our text book and helped to found the Center for Holocaust and Genocide Studies and helped to start a Masters program in Holocaust studies. Unfortunately, she did pass away in 2004, but the legacy that she left (and the impression she made on me) will last a lifetime.

Last edited by Morale Officer; 10-10-2008 at 07:20 AM..
 
Old 10-10-2008, 07:22 AM
 
Location: Romeoville, IL
1,238 posts, read 2,180,235 times
Reputation: 507
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morale Officer View Post
That line of teaching is one of many reasons I've been seriously contemplating leaving the Catholic Church. I don't like that line of thinking and don't think that Catholics or Protestants should have that kind of thinking. Unfortunately, I've seen it all too often (and quite a bit on this board) that people think they are better than someone else because they "have the right brand/version of Christianity." I'll argue my points on the board and enjoy a good debate with others, but I know that as long as you believe in God and Christ, you're no different than me...Christian or Protestant. On the same note, I don't hate non-Christians or think I'm better than they are. I had a prof in college (for History of the Holocaust) who was Jewish. Dr. Shur (God bless her soul) was the most wonderful prof I had. As much as I hate to say it, she was the stereotypical little old Jewish lady...walked with a cane. We were all afraid of her...myself included until I sat down in her office one day and talked with her for 2 hours and realized that she was just as regular as the rest of us...and after attending the Yom-HaShoah (Holocaust Remembrance Day) with her, I realized just how religious she was...and I admired her for it...actually thought she was that much better than I am. So...no, I don't think there is any one church better than the other.
I don't like your line of thinking, as it follows in line with the 'watered down' Catholics we have been talking about, or Catholics who try to conform to the secular world we live in today. Catholicism has strict views on just about every issue, and to me it seems if you want to be a member of the Church, you should strictly follow those views to the best of your abilities. Maybe Catholicism isn't for you.

I think as a convert, I have an easier time accepting these views because I WANT to be a Catholic, and as a conservative my entire life I have always been attracted to rigid beliefs and thinking. I dislike the cushy lee-way of many modern Christians, where everything is in a gray area and everything should be challenged.

Catholicism has held it's beliefs for millenniums and for that reason alone I support them more than anything.
 
Old 10-10-2008, 07:35 AM
 
Location: Purgatory
396 posts, read 730,494 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronK View Post
I don't like your line of thinking, as it follows in line with the 'watered down' Catholics we have been talking about, or Catholics who try to conform to the secular world we live in today. Catholicism has strict views on just about every issue, and to me it seems if you want to be a member of the Church, you should strictly follow those views to the best of your abilities. Maybe Catholicism isn't for you.

I think as a convert, I have an easier time accepting these views because I WANT to be a Catholic, and as a conservative my entire life I have always been attracted to rigid beliefs and thinking. I dislike the cushy lee-way of many modern Christians, where everything is in a gray area and everything should be challenged.

Catholicism has held it's beliefs for millenniums and for that reason alone I support them more than anything.
Well thanks. I was born and raised a Catholic. I am very open minded (thanks to college and some very close friends). I have very good friends that are not Catholic and do not conform to many of the social and societal or Christian "Norms." What I had a lot of trouble with was the new Pope telling me that I had to believe that if you aren't Catholic, you're going to Hell. So...you mean to tell me that I can like my friends, but unless they're Catholic, they're going to Hell? I can talk to my former minister friend about everything, but unless she "goes straight" and converts to Catholicism, she's going to Hell? What about my Massage Therapist who's Mormon? Should I believe that Dr. Shur went to Hell because she was Jewish? I'm sorry...I can't subscribe to that kind of thought process, and if I'm a "watered down Catholic" for it, so be it. As I said, this is one of many reasons I've been considering leaving the Church. I have my own spiritual issues ("God Limbo" as I've called it before) that I can't deal with the strict rules at the moment. Don't get me wrong, I love the Mass...I loved going to the Triduum services at the Newman Center...but I've got to work through my own "God Limbo" before I can be what whatever it is I'm meant to be, but for now, I'll take my "watered down Catholicism" and enjoy the life I've been given until I figure things out.
 
Old 10-10-2008, 07:46 AM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,446,997 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronK View Post
I suppose a claim could also be made for Eastern Orthodoxy, but by all accounts, in RCIA we are taught that even though we should respect the views of our protestant brethren, they are of lesser status in terms of how to be faithful to Jesus. The teaching is that protestant Christians are inferior to Catholics. I myself do not like such a title, 'inferior', but I suppose it makes sense when you think about it. The Catholic Church is the Church as Jesus intended it to be, while the protestant religions have 'watered down' in a sense what it means to be Christian, and have even warped many of the views.
I believe the Catholic Church is the superior church but not for the reasons you think. It is true the protestant church has been watered down but the Catholic Church has not helped the cause either. Does pedophilia ring a bell? and how the church handled priest who they KNEW were pedophiles.

It has been absolutely shameful not to mention has hurt the gospel more ways than you could ever imagine and hurt the Catholic Church reputation especially in the West where attendance/ membership has significantly dropped, churches closing in droves in Europe being turned into dance halls and pubs.

Denominations mean nothing! and I am still waiting for that scripture where we should be thanking/ worshiping Mary?
 
Old 10-10-2008, 08:01 AM
 
Location: Purgatory
396 posts, read 730,494 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reformed Liberal View Post
I believe the Catholic Church is the superior church but not for the reasons you think. It is true the protestant church has been watered down but the Catholic Church has not helped the cause either. Does pedophilia ring a bell? and how the church handled priest who they KNEW were pedophiles.

It has been absolutely shameful not to mention has hurt the gospel more ways than you could ever imagine and hurt the Catholic Church reputation especially in the West where attendance/ membership has significantly dropped, churches closing in droves in Europe being turned into dance halls and pubs.

Denominations mean nothing! and I am still waiting for that scripture where we should be thanking/ worshiping Mary?
First off...there are pedophiles in EVERY denomination and profession in the world, so please don't use that argument here.
Second...denominations mean nothing? Um...back up...you do realize that people that call themselves "Non-denominational" are actually in a denomination?
Third...and pardon me for a second here...CATHOLICS DO NOT WORSHIP MARY! Ok...I feel better now. Back on track here. 1) The 'Hail Mary' is Biblical (I believe it's in Luke - I'm not the greatest Bible Scholar) when the Angel speaks to Mary and says, "Hail Mary, Full of Grace, the Lord is with thee!" 2) It's the same as prayers to saints...we ask them to pray for us to God. It's the same as asking a friend to pray for you. 3) "Honor thy Father and Mother." - Why not honor the Mother of God? I don't have kids. I've never performed a pre-hospital delivery (thank GOD!)(and don't want to actually), but I have respect for those of us women (I don't have kids) that have given birth. And on top of that, I have even more respect for the woman that gave birth and raised Jesus Christ. 4) People moan and groan about 'bead counting.' It's just a way to keep track of where you are in the Rosary. The Rosary is a meditation device (I posted links in another thread that I'm sure no protestants have looked at because they think they're better than that and wouldn't agree with it anyways).
But, I'm sure I'm just wasting my breath here...but hey, gotta do something in my "cool down" time after work.
 
Old 10-10-2008, 08:04 AM
 
Location: In the North Idaho woods, still surrounded by terriers
2,178 posts, read 6,150,093 times
Reputation: 973
Neither God nor Jesus were Catholics. What an absurd premise, AaronK
 
Old 10-10-2008, 08:05 AM
 
Location: USA
322 posts, read 643,422 times
Reputation: 117
I would like to speak honestly and candidly from my heart on this subject, but would perhaps be viewed as a Catholic basher, so will try to be neutral.

I hope that all who know and love JESUS CHRIST will with all their heart obey Him, love others who obey Him, and trust Him at all times.

We are individuals and as individuals have a duty to obey the LORD. In the great and awesome day of the LORD, we each will be one to One before the LORD. So I hope that all on Earth will know him who died for all our sins and who rose from the dead and took captivity captive, so that we who were blind and decieved would receive eternal hope and full assurance of everlasting life.
 
Old 10-10-2008, 08:53 AM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,446,997 times
Reputation: 746
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morale Officer View Post
First off...there are pedophiles in EVERY denomination and profession in the world, so please don't use that argument here.
I understand that, If you are going to put words in my mouth, at least let it be accurate. This thread is the one painting the Catholic Church as this perfect church. I am saying, not so.

Quote:
Second...denominations mean nothing? Um...back up...you do realize that people that call themselves "Non-denominational" are actually in a denomination?
What matters is sound doctrine and calling a human being , "The Holy Father" who is a sinner as well is not sound doctrine

Quote:
Third...and pardon me for a second here...CATHOLICS DO NOT WORSHIP MARY! Ok...I feel better now. Back on track here. 1) The 'Hail Mary' is Biblical (I believe it's in Luke - I'm not the greatest Bible Scholar) when the Angel speaks to Mary and says, "Hail Mary, Full of Grace, the Lord is with thee!" 2) It's the same as prayers to saints...we ask them to pray for us to God. It's the same as asking a friend to pray for you. 3) "Honor thy Father and Mother." - Why not honor the Mother of God? I don't have kids. I've never performed a pre-hospital delivery (thank GOD!)(and don't want to actually), but I have respect for those of us women (I don't have kids) that have given birth. And on top of that, I have even more respect for the woman that gave birth and raised Jesus Christ. 4) People moan and groan about 'bead counting.' It's just a way to keep track of where you are in the Rosary. The Rosary is a meditation device (I posted links in another thread that I'm sure no protestants have looked at because they think they're better than that and wouldn't agree with it anyways).
To Worship: reverent honor and homage paid to God or a sacred personage, or to any object regarded as sacred.

(The Pope was buried with an "M" on his coffin, and after his attempted assassination, he thanked Mary for saving his life)

Mary recognized that she needed the Savior. The Bible never says that Mary was anyone but an ordinary human whom God chose to use in an extraordinary way. Yes, Mary was a righteous woman and favored (graced) by God

I believe this is the verse you were talking about but notice what Jesus said, in the next verse. In fact There was never a better opportunity for Jesus to declare that Mary was indeed worthy of praise and adoration but He does not.

(Luke 11:27)

"While Jesus was saying these things, one of the women in the crowd raised her voice and said to Him,

Blessed is the womb that bore You and the breasts at which You nursed”

(Luke 11:28) Jesus reply
"On the contrary, blessed are those who hear the word of God and observe it."

Mary was a sinful human being who needed Jesus Christ as her Savior, just like everyone else

Quote:
But, I'm sure I'm just wasting my breath here...but hey, gotta do something in my "cool down" time after work.
Same here.

Last edited by Fundamentalist; 10-10-2008 at 09:13 AM..
 
Old 10-10-2008, 10:06 AM
 
Location: Pleasant Shade Tn
2,214 posts, read 4,994,670 times
Reputation: 545
Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronK View Post
I suppose a claim could also be made for Eastern Orthodoxy, but by all accounts, in RCIA we are taught that even though we should respect the views of our protestant brethren, they are of lesser status in terms of how to be faithful to Jesus. The teaching is that protestant Christians are inferior to Catholics. I myself do not like such a title, 'inferior', but I suppose it makes sense when you think about it. The Catholic Church is the Church as Jesus intended it to be, while the protestant religions have 'watered down' in a sense what it means to be Christian, and have even warped many of the views.

Since Catholicism was not around when the Christian Congregation was established, I do not feel is the one true superior Church. Also, I feel there are many doctrines assoicated w/ the Catholic church that contradict bible teachings.
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