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Old 09-06-2009, 08:05 PM
 
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I miss these in depth discussions concerning the Word. I am praying to have more revealed to me, and others, to learn more of God's Wonders and Ways.
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Old 09-06-2009, 08:19 PM
 
Location: Somewhere
6,370 posts, read 5,631,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HotinAZ View Post
I was curious to see how this doctrine of the "Second" coming of Christ developed throughout the centuries. And how it seems to be the primary driving force behind most of todays theological discussions. We have everything from the hard fought debates on the "Rapture", to the years being proclaimed on His return.

Jesus the Christ was adamant that He would return, but never said when. Said He didn't know! Even in Revelations He said "coming quickly". Not just once, but 5 times.

Rev 2:16
'Therefore repent; or else I am coming to you quickly, and I will make war against them with the sword of My mouth.


Rev 3:11
'I am coming quickly; hold fast what you have, so that no one will take your crown."

Rev 22:7
"And behold, I am coming quickly. Blessed is he who heeds the words of the prophecy of this book."

Rev 22:12
"Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward {is} with Me, to render to every man according to what he has done.

Rev 22:20
He who testifies to these things says, "Yes, I am coming quickly." Amen. Come, Lord Jesus.

Jesus said that many will come in His name.

Luke 21:8
And He said, "See to it that you are not misled; for many will come in Myname, saying, 'I am' and, 'The time is near.' Do not go after them.

Why would Jesus say not to follow those who claim to be from Christ?

He gives us the answer:

He warned of those who say they ARE Annointed, and those who say the TIME is NEAR!!!
There will be MANY mislead, not a few, as Jesus stated here:

Mark 13:16
"Many will come in My name, saying, 'I am' and will mislead many.


The sadness is, that Jesus actually proved Himself as coming in the Father's Name. He did this with His actions, and with His Father's Power, while remaining faithful and sinless to His end.

John 5:45
"I have come in My Father's name, and you do not receive Me; if another comes in his own name, you will receive him.
Where does it say that Jesus didn't know?
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Old 09-06-2009, 08:30 PM
 
3,553 posts, read 4,374,021 times
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Originally Posted by trettep View Post
Where does it say that Jesus didn't know?
Matthew 24:36
"But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone."

Mark 13:32
"But of that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but the Father {alone.}
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Old 09-06-2009, 09:02 PM
 
Location: Somewhere
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HotinAZ View Post
Matthew 24:36
"But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone."

Mark 13:32
"But of that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but the Father {alone.}
I see in my commentarys on those verses that the reference to the Son not knowing is lacking in many of the earliest manuscripts and one linguist mentioned in the commentary says the verse doesn't mean to not know but to not be imparted by anyone but the Father.

If it did mean that the Son doesn't know then that would be contrary to other scriptures that say that God has given the Son ALL things and all power. Surely that would have to include the full plan for the coming.

Surely, when we read that in the Christ all the FULLNESS did dwell it cannot mean any less than FULL. To be withheld from the Christ a portion of this knowledge would then mean that the FULLNESS is not dwelling therein.

My belief is that if we are to include the verse from Mark that we must understand it to mean that the understanding is being revealed by the Father, for the Son came to reveal the Father and if we have the Son we have the Father and vice versa. So to me this is saying to me that it is by the Holy Spirit that we CAN indeed know the time.
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Old 09-06-2009, 09:08 PM
 
3,553 posts, read 4,374,021 times
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Originally Posted by trettep View Post
I see in my commentarys on those verses that the reference to the Son not knowing is lacking in many of the earliest manuscripts and one linguist mentioned in the commentary says the verse doesn't mean to not know but to not be imparted by anyone but the Father.
Huh? Are we again cherry picking verses? You asked a question, I gave it right out of the Word. Believe it or not.

Quote:
If it did mean that the Son doesn't know then that would be contrary to other scriptures that say that God has given the Son ALL things and all power. Surely that would have to include the full plan for the coming.
By your reason and logic. Mine is not that way, for I understand it.

Quote:
Surely, when we read that in the Christ all the FULLNESS did dwell it cannot mean any less than FULL. To be withheld from the Christ a portion of this knowledge would then mean that the FULLNESS is not dwelling therein.
Again, your logic. Jesus is saying no one knows the day or the hour. No one, but the Father. I believe Him.

Quote:
My belief is that if we are to include the verse from Mark that we must understand it to mean that the understanding is being revealed by the Father, for the Son came to reveal the Father and if we have the Son we have the Father and vice versa. So to me this is saying to me that it is by the Holy Spirit that we CAN indeed know the time.
And it has been the delusion of the church since Paul.
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Old 09-06-2009, 09:15 PM
 
Location: Somewhere
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Originally Posted by HotinAZ View Post
Huh? Are we again cherry picking verses? You asked a question, I gave it right out of the Word. Believe it or not.



By your reason and logic. Mine is not that way, for I understand it.



Again, your logic. Jesus is saying no one knows the day or the hour. No one, but the Father. I believe Him.



And it has been the delusion of the church since Paul.
Oh, I see you prefer to just take it at face value. Then that is how you will receive it. I won't bother to give you some amazing information on just when the time will be.
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Old 09-06-2009, 09:42 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,391,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trettep View Post
Oh, I see you prefer to just take it at face value. Then that is how you will receive it. I won't bother to give you some amazing information on just when the time will be.
Tell me! Tell me!!!
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Old 09-06-2009, 09:58 PM
 
3,553 posts, read 4,374,021 times
Reputation: 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by trettep View Post
Oh, I see you prefer to just take it at face value. Then that is how you will receive it. I won't bother to give you some amazing information on just when the time will be.
Is it yours or another copy and paste? I am more interested in what you have been given.
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Old 09-06-2009, 10:33 PM
 
Location: Rapid City, SD
723 posts, read 858,754 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trettep View Post
Oh, I see you prefer to just take it at face value. Then that is how you will receive it. I won't bother to give you some amazing information on just when the time will be.

Uh oh!!! Do we have an ancient Mayan on our hands????/jk


GOD BLESS!!!
ALMOST2L8

P.S. You probably don't want to spill the beans to everyone huh??? Hey, you don't have to private message me and let me in on the secret. wink.... wink LOL
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Old 09-07-2009, 10:38 AM
 
Location: Somewhere
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Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
Tell me! Tell me!!!
Hi katjonjj, you will know this if you think Spiritually. I can't emphasis this enough regarding this. Remember that it is the Father who knows. The Holy Spirit is His Spirit by which we cry ABBA (Father). Jesus said that He would build His Church in 3 days:

Joh 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
Joh 2:20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
Joh 2:21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

Notice that Jesus was speaking of the TEMPLE of his body. This is not a reference to His physical body. The Temple is SPIRITUAL and this refers to the members of His body which are the Church.

Did you ever realize that the Apostles and disciples of the Lord are called STONES. They are OF the building that Jesus is assembling. When all of those stones are selected and built then shall He return.

2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Think on that hard and ask the Lord to give you this knowledge.

Paul
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