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Old 12-01-2008, 04:29 PM
 
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Thank you to the person who started this.

I think so many Christians are under that illusion that their religion is the right and only way. Or so they think, that is. They claim every other religion is the path to Hell or is evil. I think the religions that gets the most crap from Christians are Wicca/Paganistic religions and Islam. What they don't see is that they are just as intolerant and angry as people of Islam. And about Wicca and Pagan religions, they just think that those religions are straight from Hell.

Well, I love sticking it to them that "Christmas" is actually Yuletide and a PAGAN holiday. Then they tell me that it cannot be because Pagan is evil. I then tell them to put logic into it and that proves that Christianity is evil based on their OWN logic. I personally think that true Christianity is not evil but the followers act like it and are extreme. I then love telling them where the Easter Bunny comes from and how Easter came about. They sure love that one. Haha. They love the Pagan..I mean "evil"...influence....on their most loving peaceful religion.

I cannot even get answers in this forum.

But anyways, thanks for this thread.
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Old 12-01-2008, 10:21 PM
 
37,508 posts, read 25,238,629 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theliberalvoice View Post
I personally think that true Christianity is not evil but the followers act like it and are extreme.
Ghandi is often quoted as saying something like . . . "I like your Christ . . . but your Christians are nothing like him."
Quote:
I cannot even get answers in this forum.
But anyways, thanks for this thread.
As to the pagan origins of the Christmas and Easter celebrations . . you are quite correct. They were merged by Constantine to aid the acceptance and spread of Christianity.
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Old 12-02-2008, 07:06 AM
 
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Too many "Christians" are okay with the pagan celebrations because they are fun. Even the Catholic Encyclodedia admits, and clearly shows how pagan celebrations were allowed into the church. I don't think it is ok with God. How can a Christian observe the first commandment and partake in pagan celebrations? These pagan influences allow the polluting and dilluting of Christianity.

There are some that truly try to keep the "Christ in Christmas" and I respect that 100%. I think that they are misguided (my opinion), but their intention and motivation is pure.

I have family members and friends who say laughingly that they "enjoy the pagan celebratons...they're fun!" No doubt that getting together with friends and family, having a good meal, giving and getting gifts, etc...is fun. All those things are not exclusive to these celebrations, these things can be done any time of year not in connection with any holiday.

It would be no different if today, the government decided to combine Islam and Christianity to unite people. Would a Christian be okay absorbing practices of the Islamic faith? When Constantine allowed the mixing of pagan and Christian beliefs, it was no different.
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Old 12-02-2008, 08:51 AM
 
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I totally agree on what you guys said first natural then spiritual true. But I mean how can we say (man) that Yah will allow us to call him whatever we want. I believe that once you know the truth there is no turning back, as numerous scriptures will vouch that you will be held accountable for you actions. To this person:

I agree with some of this but have questions on others.

1. Did Constantine break with the Roman Catholic Church? That was mighty early. 321 AD if I remember right.
2. Didn't Jesus speak Aramaic, not Hebrew?
3. You seem to advocate leaving christianity...for what?

1. Yes he broke away from Catholic and formed up his new but merged both so that everyone would at ease with it.
2. I dont know the answer for sure. Being the messiah was full blood Israelite and born in that area, I would say he spoke Hebrew. The apostle were the ones who i think spoke different languages in order to reach the gentiles.
3.Well after learning all the stuff about the church and knowing his name was hide and changed, something inside of me said i needed to find the truth and he showed me the truth. So in my opinion thats why i stress its best we honor him the best we can. You wouldnt want someone call you John and your name is Todd. Totally different. Were talking about the creator of heaven and earth, you should show as much respect as possible.

I know that not all churches dont worship made man festives and stuff, but seeing how the church was founding etc...and knowing some of things i cant help but walk out and let Yahweh take me where i need to be taken. Anyway I love to hear thoughts on this because its a serious situation you know, we talking eternal life or damnation. I pray it doesnt matter but if i does I pray even more for those lost. Stay up Brethen!!!
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Old 12-02-2008, 09:13 AM
 
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Think about this as well as too who you are calling upon:

John 5:43
"I am come in My Father's Name and ye receive Me not, if another shall come in his own name, him you will receive"

Yahweh or Yahuweh
Yahushua = Yahweh is Salvation

Think about it...
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Old 12-02-2008, 09:37 AM
 
3,553 posts, read 4,372,769 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwarrior View Post
Think about this as well as too who you are calling upon:

John 5:43
"I am come in My Father's Name and ye receive Me not, if another shall come in his own name, him you will receive"

Yahweh or Yahuweh
Yahushua = Yahweh is Salvation

Think about it...
I went through this phase some years back. I have come to some interesting conclusions about it as well.

I was not comfortable calling God anything but God or Father, even though it can be proven that His name was something else in the "old language". Same with Jesus. I had heard that somehow the name Jesus could be traced back to an ass or donkey in the OT, and it sounded like foolishness, but I listened. I had heard that the only place in the OT that kept the name of God was psalms 68:4, and it was kept there for us to seek it out.

But still, I wondered. God is God, the Great I AM. If I am looking at someone, and they see me looking at them, can they tell? Same with talking to them. Do we honestly think God cannot tell the difference, or do we think that little of Him. So I for one will call Him God, or Father, and my Savior Jesus Christ, King of Kings.
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Old 12-02-2008, 10:44 AM
 
8,743 posts, read 10,002,940 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beeveenh View Post
Too many "Christians" are okay with the pagan celebrations because they are fun. Even the Catholic Encyclodedia admits, and clearly shows how pagan celebrations were allowed into the church. I don't think it is ok with God. How can a Christian observe the first commandment and partake in pagan celebrations? These pagan influences allow the polluting and dilluting of Christianity.

There are some that truly try to keep the "Christ in Christmas" and I respect that 100%. I think that they are misguided (my opinion), but their intention and motivation is pure.

I have family members and friends who say laughingly that they "enjoy the pagan celebratons...they're fun!" No doubt that getting together with friends and family, having a good meal, giving and getting gifts, etc...is fun. All those things are not exclusive to these celebrations, these things can be done any time of year not in connection with any holiday.

It would be no different if today, the government decided to combine Islam and Christianity to unite people. Would a Christian be okay absorbing practices of the Islamic faith? When Constantine allowed the mixing of pagan and Christian beliefs, it was no different.
No, Pagans did not pollute your religion. You polluted theirs.
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Old 12-02-2008, 12:39 PM
 
810 posts, read 1,259,323 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theliberalvoice View Post
No, Pagans did not pollute your religion. You polluted theirs.
I agree, sort of...they were probably just as well off with out being coerced into Christianity. I think Christianity would have been better off without inviting pagans in. No offense.
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Old 12-02-2008, 01:09 PM
 
10 posts, read 14,673 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HotinAZ View Post
I went through this phase some years back. I have come to some interesting conclusions about it as well.

I was not comfortable calling God anything but God or Father, even though it can be proven that His name was something else in the "old language". Same with Jesus. I had heard that somehow the name Jesus could be traced back to an ass or donkey in the OT, and it sounded like foolishness, but I listened. I had heard that the only place in the OT that kept the name of God was psalms 68:4, and it was kept there for us to seek it out.

But still, I wondered. God is God, the Great I AM. If I am looking at someone, and they see me looking at them, can they tell? Same with talking to them. Do we honestly think God cannot tell the difference, or do we think that little of Him. So I for one will call Him God, or Father, and my Savior Jesus Christ, King of Kings.

I totally agree on what you are saying let me gather this scripture for you:

John 4:23-24 KJV
"23But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. 24God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth"


So we are suppose to worship in truth and in spirit. Now after all the research you have done and all that he has shown you. Leaving his name so that WE (his people) the people that are seekers of righteousness would find it. If he didnt care what we called him why are there numerous scriptures saying call on his Name or why would he bother to even tell Moses? (1 Cor 8:5, every lord and god has a name) now knowing the TRUTH. There is only one thing you can do, worship him in truth and in spirit. Bottom line.

Last edited by Yahwarrior; 12-02-2008 at 01:14 PM.. Reason: added another verse
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Old 12-02-2008, 01:30 PM
 
Location: NC
10,005 posts, read 8,719,959 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beeveenh View Post
I agree, sort of...they were probably just as well off with out being coerced into Christianity. I think Christianity would have been better off without inviting pagans in. No offense.
IMHO Christianity became sort of a power thing pretty early on. As such they needed to convert the Pagans in order to maintain the Medieval social order. Essentially everyone needed to be Christian at that time because the rulers needed to convince the serfs that they were empowered to rule by divine right. It worked something like this.

Jesus bestowed holy authority on the Pope to create kings and emperors. The kings and emperors with the blessing of the Pope, and therefore Jesus, could grant titles of noblity and with the aid of God, and a few knights, the peasants and serfs went along with their miserable existance hoping for an eternal reward.

In order for this to work however, everyone had to be Christian so they would believe Jesus was the son of God and Catholic Christian believing that St. Peter, (I think) invested the authority of the Holy Church in the Pope. That way anyone rebelling against their lord faced eternal damnation for defying not only their lord, but the king, the Pope, and God and if that did not deter them there were always the knights.
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