U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 11-02-2008, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
4,368 posts, read 4,101,329 times
Reputation: 2652

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by weatherologist View Post
This was pretty much my initial thought when I read the OP. I find that many 'cradle Catholics', especially the older generations, don't really know enough about their faith. So when the younger generation comes along and says, "grandma, why do we do this?", grandma can only answer, "because that is the way that it has always been". I have seen many of the "younger generations", probably starting with my age group of 40-55, leaving the Church just because it 'feels good' at another church. That is actually what brought me to the Catholic faith. I was very content in my 'feel good' church, but there was just something missing. I found that 'something' in the Catholic Church and I will work hard to teach my children the 'love' of their own faith.



I think the first step here is knowing how to stick up for the Catholic faith. Many times, we just don't have the right answers. It can be intimidating going up against a person who can quote you Bible verse forward and backward. I know that I am not properly versed in defending my faith on a biblical level.



Amen!

AaronK,
Am I remembering right that you are a new convert? I remember when I first converted that I gave a testimony at my parish during each Mass. I felt drawn to speak to my fellow parishoners about the fire that I was feeling in my soul and to also call out to those that were not full Catholics. Next time you take the Eucarist, look around your parish and see how many sit back. Those are the people that I felt called to draw into the church. Why are they not joining us at the table?

<><
While it is true some older cradle Catholics do not know alot about their faith, many do, more so then many younger Catholics especially more than many converts. This I believe is from experiencing both the pre Vatican II Church and the post Vatican II Church. Younger Catholics have only experienced the reign of John Paul II along with the new pope while older Catholics have experienced in many cases up to six popes. Each one was unique in what they though and what the direction they thought the Church should go.

"Leaving the Church just because it 'feels good' at another church."



Could you explain exactly what you mean by that “feels good” comment?
It seems to me to be somewhat of a negative statement, I hope that you are not judging others by your personal opinions. I know you mentioned you saw them leave, but did you talk to them?

"Those that were not full Catholics"

So there is something called half Catholic?
Again it seems like some are notmeasuring up to your standards
When I attend Mass I do not look around and attempt to judge others why they are there

 
Old 11-02-2008, 02:26 PM
 
Location: among the chaos
2,136 posts, read 4,310,016 times
Reputation: 980
Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
"Leaving the Church just because it 'feels good' at another church."



Could you explain exactly what you mean by that “feels good” comment?
It seems to me to be somewhat of a negative statement, I hope that you are not judging others by your personal opinions. I know you mentioned you saw them leave, but did you talk to them?
I describe a "feel good" church as one that spends most of their service in song. This is not meant to be a bad thing, just not what I was in need of spiritually when I coverted to Catholicism. (Believe me, my comments were not meant to be offensive. That is not who I am.) When I was attending the church before my convertion to Catholicism, we had a wonderful "praise service". The music was absolutely amazing and I would leave feeling great! But, for me, something was missing.

And, yes, I did speak to several people that I know have left the Catholic Church. One of them is a very good friend of mine who was a cradle Catholic and used to actually get on to me for not being Catholic. He now attends a non-denominational church and has spoke to me about how it is wrong that we "worship" Mary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
"Those that were not full Catholics"

So there is something called half Catholic?
Again it seems like some are notmeasuring up to your standards
When I attend Mass I do not look around and attempt to judge others why they are there
Wow! I cannot believe how terribly I must have expressed myself. I, too, do not look around and 'judge'. However, I spent 3 plus years sitting in the congregation unable to take the Eucharist and I watched many people just like me, week after week, sitting silently during communion and not partaking of the Holy Sacrament. I also know a woman who has attended my parish for YEARS, more faithfully than me, who calls herself an agnostic. When I said not full Catholic, this is what I meant. I supposed I could have dug deeper for a better word (maybe you could offer one), however, these are the people that I was referring to. Those that attend week after week but are not in full communion with the church.

I was not judging anyone. If you have read any of my posts, you would know that was not my intent. Sorry if I offended you.

Also, I believe that we have taken this OT, if you have anymore comments for me, perhaps you should start a separate thread where Catholics can actually bash each other or feel free to DM me.
 
Old 11-02-2008, 02:29 PM
 
272 posts, read 431,347 times
Reputation: 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by LogicIsYourFriend View Post
I would personally rather they not. We don't need more door to door salespeople.
Totally agree. Today we call it advertising not evangelizing.
 
Old 11-04-2008, 11:40 AM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
4,368 posts, read 4,101,329 times
Reputation: 2652
Quote:
Originally Posted by weatherologist View Post
I describe a "feel good" church as one that spends most of their service in song. This is not meant to be a bad thing, just not what I was in need of spiritually when I coverted to Catholicism. (Believe me, my comments were not meant to be offensive. That is not who I am.) When I was attending the church before my convertion to Catholicism, we had a wonderful "praise service". The music was absolutely amazing and I would leave feeling great! But, for me, something was missing.

And, yes, I did speak to several people that I know have left the Catholic Church. One of them is a very good friend of mine who was a cradle Catholic and used to actually get on to me for not being Catholic. He now attends a non-denominational church and has spoke to me about how it is wrong that we "worship" Mary.



Wow! I cannot believe how terribly I must have expressed myself. I, too, do not look around and 'judge'. However, I spent 3 plus years sitting in the congregation unable to take the Eucharist and I watched many people just like me, week after week, sitting silently during communion and not partaking of the Holy Sacrament. I also know a woman who has attended my parish for YEARS, more faithfully than me, who calls herself an agnostic. When I said not full Catholic, this is what I meant. I supposed I could have dug deeper for a better word (maybe you could offer one), however, these are the people that I was referring to. Those that attend week after week but are not in full communion with the church.

I was not judging anyone. If you have read any of my posts, you would know that was not my intent. Sorry if I offended you.

Also, I believe that we have taken this OT, if you have anymore comments for me, perhaps you should start a separate thread where Catholics can actually bash each other or feel free to DM me.
So that whole response to me in post #12 was about people abandoning the Catholic Church because they like the music better at other non Catholic churches, I guess I was reading more into that statement than was meant to be. I guess it must be a regional thing that happens in certain areas of the country I have never heard of anyone leaving the Church over music. My Church uses several different styles of music for mass along with Mass that have no music for those that prefer a more silent Mass.
You mention in your last post about your friend leaving the Church because he thought that “we "worship" Mary”, it is a shame how easily some are talked out of their faith by others. Unfortunately the hierarchy of our Church has all too often only told us what to believe but not why. But these two examples of music and people being talked out of their faith by those that go around proselytizing are far from why people are leaving the Church these days.

Yes I did question the term “full Catholic” you used because I have heard that and other terms such as “true Catholic” use by those who believe they are superior Catholics, they often invite others to leave the Church because they find others not Catholic enough for their liking. I have also found more often than not that these attacks are leveled by converts on cradle Catholics. It may be that with the enthusiasm converts feel for their new found faith they perceive cradle Catholics to be lacking in faith.
They also perceive any criticism level against the hierarchy or teachings to be criticism against the Catholic faith itself. As I mentioned in post #31 there are many of us who have experienced the Catholic faith from the time period of pre Vatican Church up to the present. We have lived these experiences as part of our lives so it does give us a unique prospective.

“perhaps you should start a separate thread where Catholics can actually bash each other”

I am sorry you feel that way, that was not my intent.
That is why I said “I hope that you are not judging” and asked “Could you explain exactly what you mean by that “feels good” comment”
I did not want to make any false assumptions.
But if I did offend you I apologize for doing so.
 
Old 11-08-2008, 04:11 PM
 
Location: among the chaos
2,136 posts, read 4,310,016 times
Reputation: 980
Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
But if I did offend you I apologize for doing so.
Apology accepted.

<><
 
Old 12-16-2008, 04:50 PM
 
28 posts, read 34,596 times
Reputation: 15
Default Evangelizing is our duty

Here are some thoughts that may have been forgotten. Christ came to save souls. All souls. He desires all to be saved by him. He suffered, died freely by crucifixion, and then rose again. Before giving himself up for all sins, he established the Catholic Church here on earth. Read Mathew 16 and it is clear that Peter was appointed the first pope by Christ himself. The sacrament of confession was also established by Christ himself and he gave Peter and the other apostles (priests) the authority to either forgive those sins on HIS behalf or not to forgive them. Christ also said that the very gates of hell will not prevail against his church. He knew the church would always be under attack from the outside and sadly from the inside as well. He knew people would lose faith and 'head for the exits' as one person wrote. We as a church need to stick with what Christ taught those apostles. We should also stick with how the apsotles passed down teachings to us. They did so through early traditions, since the bible was not written by the Catholic church until around 400 AD. The church grew because of Peter and his subsequent successors. We should not be taking a poll and changing the truth of the church and its teachings to appease the people who don't believe in the eucharist anymore, and have decided to head for the exits or buy into any other ways of the world. Christ knew all of this was going to happen. He told about it in the parable of the grain falling on different soils in Luke 8:4-15. So, yes, we should be evangelizing at all times because we are the Church that Jesus founded. Much is expected of us because of this fact.
 
Old 12-16-2008, 09:57 PM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
4,368 posts, read 4,101,329 times
Reputation: 2652
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr RC View Post
Here are some thoughts that may have been forgotten. Christ came to save souls. All souls. He desires all to be saved by him. He suffered, died freely by crucifixion, and then rose again. Before giving himself up for all sins, he established the Catholic Church here on earth. Read Mathew 16 and it is clear that Peter was appointed the first pope by Christ himself. The sacrament of confession was also established by Christ himself and he gave Peter and the other apostles (priests) the authority to either forgive those sins on HIS behalf or not to forgive them. Christ also said that the very gates of hell will not prevail against his church. He knew the church would always be under attack from the outside and sadly from the inside as well. He knew people would lose faith and 'head for the exits' as one person wrote. We as a church need to stick with what Christ taught those apostles. We should also stick with how the apsotles passed down teachings to us. They did so through early traditions, since the bible was not written by the Catholic church until around 400 AD. The church grew because of Peter and his subsequent successors. We should not be taking a poll and changing the truth of the church and its teachings to appease the people who don't believe in the eucharist anymore, and have decided to head for the exits or buy into any other ways of the world. Christ knew all of this was going to happen. He told about it in the parable of the grain falling on different soils in Luke 8:4-15. So, yes, we should be evangelizing at all times because we are the Church that Jesus founded. Much is expected of us because of this fact.
"people who don't believe in the eucharist anymore, and have decided to head for the exits or buy into any other ways of the world."
Can you in any way substantiate that claim as to why people are leaving?

Last edited by ted08721; 12-16-2008 at 10:12 PM..
 
Old 12-16-2008, 10:25 PM
 
2,560 posts, read 5,059,611 times
Reputation: 957
People are leaving because it is too hard for them to follow the teachings of the church. It isn't easy. You have to work at it!
 
Old 12-17-2008, 12:16 AM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
4,368 posts, read 4,101,329 times
Reputation: 2652
Quote:
Originally Posted by Okiegirlfriend View Post
People are leaving because it is too hard for them to follow the teachings of the church. It isn't easy. You have to work at it!
No they are leaving because of a corrupt selfserving hierarchy that oppress people, they are being forced out; many were among the most active and talented in their parishes. I think those that give the most are the ones that feel most betrayed.
 
Old 12-17-2008, 03:04 PM
 
28 posts, read 34,596 times
Reputation: 15
Default For Ted

You asked how it is possible to substantiate the claim that people are leaving through the exits because they don't believe in the eucharist anymore. It is simple, if the eucharist is the body of Christ then why in the world would ANYONE let ANYTHING drive them away from it? The desire should be to RUSH JOYFULLY through the entrance to the church to receive the body of Christ, rather than head to the exits. But if the eucharist is not properly adored, respected, and yes desired, people will be viewing things from a personal perspective of likes and dislikes inside the church. The true reason for mass gets lost. I think this substantiates why people leave a lot better than "corrupt, self-serving hierarchy that oppresses people, especially the active and most TALENTED"? What does all of that mean exactly?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top