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Old 11-02-2008, 01:21 PM
 
14 posts, read 25,494 times
Reputation: 14

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To anyone searching for a logical answer to Bible Prophecy, this letter is for You.

I would like to make a couple things very clear before I begin. These are interpretations from a Christian perspective. They are not intended in any way to be antisemitic. Furthermore, I believe the Jewish people have every right to live within secure boundaries and be independent.

In general, this is a letter that summarizes all of Revelation 13. Its purpose is to show the sequence of events which formed the conclusions in the letter entitled, "The Beast of Revelation 13 is Mahmoud Abbas." Revelation 13 is a puzzle, a parable whose pieces are only revealed through the progress of time. This letter will attempt to bring all the pieces together into one narrative. Since questions concerning prophecy never change and answers never change, this summary will answer almost any question.

Nevertheless, I will continue to be in disagreement with the majority because they do not have the will or the knowledge to admit they promote a false interpretation. The interpretation I am eluding to is the Revived Roman Empire theory. This scenario has been a dead end for years. I must admit though before WWI it had some validity. No ancient interpreter could have known that the Ottoman Empire would break into so many different sovereign states. Until the fall of the Ottoman empire the only possible answer seemed to be Europe. I apologize if this narrative moves too fast. It is assumed that those reading this page are somewhat versed in Revelation. HERE WE GO.

In reference to Revelation 13:1- The Beast rising up out of the sea is the Nation of Israel as it appears after the SIX DAY WAR in 1967.

What is meant by the term Beast? In general, most interpretations have this concept correct. According to most scholars he is the leader of ten nations. When the term Beast is used it can mean either the nations or the leader of those nations. It is the countries he leads and his location that is in dispute.

My interpretation of Rev. 13:1 is as follows:

The Beast can be either a group of seven nations that will wage war, which include Israel or the leader of those nations. In this case, that leader is Mahmoud Abbas. He is identified by his actions and the number 666. The glue that binds them together is Islam and their hate for Israel. This was the outcome of the 1967 war. It brought Israel into a permanent state of conflict with all of her neighbors. The beast was born in 1948 with Israel declaring its independence. A closer look can be seen in Rev.17. When Israel declared its independence, five nations went to war with her and five were vanquished. The word used for vanquished is fallen in verse Rev. 17:10. "And one is", this is Israel. Israel won her war of independence. The other that had not yet come is the Palestinian Authority, which brings us to Rev.13:1 again. The misinterpretation of Rev.17 has been the most responsible for the the Revived Roman empire theory.

The beast rising up out of the sea having seven heads and ten horns is as follows. Seven heads are seven mountains as indicated in Rev.17. Ten horns are ten kings. This is a partial explanation of this parable. The most critical word here is the word head. If the correct meaning is applied to the word head its answer will make sense. In scriptures a mountain has two meanings. It can be either a mountain range or a nation. In this case when a head is referenced in Revelation 13:1 we are talking about nations. This applies to both the heads of Rev.13:1 as well as the beasts mortal head wound. The mortal head wound is the nation or land as claimed by the Palestinians. It is the beasts head (nation) that is wounded. The Beast is Mahmoud Abbas. It was mortally wounded in the Six Day War and has been revived in the Oslo Accords. The beast of Revelation 17 and Revelation 13 are the same because they involve the same countries.

Every theory must have a good foundation. This sequence of events can only point to one individual. I have been writing about these events for over a decade. If I had been wrong from the beginning, this scenario could not have made it all the way to its finish. As it was I had no idea that I was looking for a date, 6/16/06. I was just following the money trail. Was it a coincidence that the policy which enabled them to buy and sell and the date 666 occurred on the same day? I don't think so.

It is always wise to search for the best answer. Who could fault someone for changing there mind when a better answer comes along? It is not dishonor to correct a mistake, but to continue giving false information especially in the realm of prophecy is dishonorable. Maybe some truly believe what they are saying, as for me I quit the big money preachers long ago. A hundred years ago I could understand, 20 years ago I could understand, not today...This is why the Lord will come as a thief. They're all looking in the wrong place...

One last item needs to be mentioned here before I finish my complaint against our so-called prophecy teachers. It is a gross misinterpretation which needs to be cited. For some reason anytime the Beast is discussed he is immediately confused with Satan or the antichrist. Satan is not the Beast. He is in heaven right now. He will be cast out of heaven as per Revelation 12 or if you prefer 2nd Thess. chap. 2. The falling away is Satan and his angels being cast out of heaven. These are two different verses that say the same thing. Satan can only be revealed to the world after the Rapture of the Church. Christians will not go through the Great Tribulation which will last for 3.5 years. Satan will be a God to the Muslims. He is also known as the Mahdi. Mahmoud Abbas will also be worshipped to a lesser degree because he will have achieved his goal, the conquest of Jerusalem...Ephraim aka michael777
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Old 11-15-2008, 01:10 PM
 
14 posts, read 25,494 times
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Hello all, just checking back.
Does anyone have a similar view of Bible prophecy?
Michael777
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Old 11-15-2008, 07:32 PM
 
1,597 posts, read 2,138,516 times
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Well, Michael, I can't say I'm very good at interpreting Bible prophecy, but I will welcome you the site. Many people have varied views on what is being spoken of in Revelation, so I'm sure someone will engage you in a discussion.
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Old 11-15-2008, 10:48 PM
 
116 posts, read 330,923 times
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I agree with aquila. I'm sure it's only a matter of time...

I'm also not well-versed in or knowledgeable about Revelation, but I sure do enjoy reading what others have to say about it.
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Old 11-16-2008, 07:12 AM
 
1,897 posts, read 3,485,985 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by michael777 View Post
To anyone searching for a logical answer to Bible Prophecy, this letter is for You.

I would like to make a couple things very clear before I begin. These are interpretations from a Christian perspective. They are not intended in any way to be antisemitic. Furthermore, I believe the Jewish people have every right to live within secure boundaries and be independent.

In general, this is a letter that summarizes all of Revelation 13. Its purpose is to show the sequence of events which formed the conclusions in the letter entitled, "The Beast of Revelation 13 is Mahmoud Abbas." Revelation 13 is a puzzle, a parable whose pieces are only revealed through the progress of time. This letter will attempt to bring all the pieces together into one narrative. Since questions concerning prophecy never change and answers never change, this summary will answer almost any question.

Nevertheless, I will continue to be in disagreement with the majority because they do not have the will or the knowledge to admit they promote a false interpretation. The interpretation I am eluding to is the Revived Roman Empire theory. This scenario has been a dead end for years. I must admit though before WWI it had some validity. No ancient interpreter could have known that the Ottoman Empire would break into so many different sovereign states. Until the fall of the Ottoman empire the only possible answer seemed to be Europe. I apologize if this narrative moves too fast. It is assumed that those reading this page are somewhat versed in Revelation. HERE WE GO.

In reference to Revelation 13:1- The Beast rising up out of the sea is the Nation of Israel as it appears after the SIX DAY WAR in 1967.

What is meant by the term Beast? In general, most interpretations have this concept correct. According to most scholars he is the leader of ten nations. When the term Beast is used it can mean either the nations or the leader of those nations. It is the countries he leads and his location that is in dispute.

My interpretation of Rev. 13:1 is as follows:

The Beast can be either a group of seven nations that will wage war, which include Israel or the leader of those nations. In this case, that leader is Mahmoud Abbas. He is identified by his actions and the number 666. The glue that binds them together is Islam and their hate for Israel. This was the outcome of the 1967 war. It brought Israel into a permanent state of conflict with all of her neighbors. The beast was born in 1948 with Israel declaring its independence. A closer look can be seen in Rev.17. When Israel declared its independence, five nations went to war with her and five were vanquished. The word used for vanquished is fallen in verse Rev. 17:10. "And one is", this is Israel. Israel won her war of independence. The other that had not yet come is the Palestinian Authority, which brings us to Rev.13:1 again. The misinterpretation of Rev.17 has been the most responsible for the the Revived Roman empire theory.

The beast rising up out of the sea having seven heads and ten horns is as follows. Seven heads are seven mountains as indicated in Rev.17. Ten horns are ten kings. This is a partial explanation of this parable. The most critical word here is the word head. If the correct meaning is applied to the word head its answer will make sense. In scriptures a mountain has two meanings. It can be either a mountain range or a nation. In this case when a head is referenced in Revelation 13:1 we are talking about nations. This applies to both the heads of Rev.13:1 as well as the beasts mortal head wound. The mortal head wound is the nation or land as claimed by the Palestinians. It is the beasts head (nation) that is wounded. The Beast is Mahmoud Abbas. It was mortally wounded in the Six Day War and has been revived in the Oslo Accords. The beast of Revelation 17 and Revelation 13 are the same because they involve the same countries.

Every theory must have a good foundation. This sequence of events can only point to one individual. I have been writing about these events for over a decade. If I had been wrong from the beginning, this scenario could not have made it all the way to its finish. As it was I had no idea that I was looking for a date, 6/16/06. I was just following the money trail. Was it a coincidence that the policy which enabled them to buy and sell and the date 666 occurred on the same day? I don't think so.

It is always wise to search for the best answer. Who could fault someone for changing there mind when a better answer comes along? It is not dishonor to correct a mistake, but to continue giving false information especially in the realm of prophecy is dishonorable. Maybe some truly believe what they are saying, as for me I quit the big money preachers long ago. A hundred years ago I could understand, 20 years ago I could understand, not today...This is why the Lord will come as a thief. They're all looking in the wrong place...

One last item needs to be mentioned here before I finish my complaint against our so-called prophecy teachers. It is a gross misinterpretation which needs to be cited. For some reason anytime the Beast is discussed he is immediately confused with Satan or the antichrist. Satan is not the Beast. He is in heaven right now. He will be cast out of heaven as per Revelation 12 or if you prefer 2nd Thess. chap. 2. The falling away is Satan and his angels being cast out of heaven. These are two different verses that say the same thing. Satan can only be revealed to the world after the Rapture of the Church. Christians will not go through the Great Tribulation which will last for 3.5 years. Satan will be a God to the Muslims. He is also known as the Mahdi. Mahmoud Abbas will also be worshipped to a lesser degree because he will have achieved his goal, the conquest of Jerusalem...Ephraim aka michael777
Michael777:

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ which God gave Him to show His servants--things which must shortly take place. And He sent and signified it by His angel to His servant John, who bore witness to the word of God, and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, to all things that he saw. Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of this prophecy , and keep those things which are written in it; for the time is near (Rev. 1-3).

"Then he [angel] said to me, 'These words are faithful and true.' And the Lord God of he holy prophets sent His angel to show His servants the things which must shortly take place. 'Behold, I am coming soon' . . . . And he [angel] said to me, 'Do not seal the words of the prophecy of this book, for the time is at hand." (Rev. 22:6, 10).

"Behold, I am coming soon, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work" (Rev. 22:12).

"He who testifies to these things says, 'Surely I am coming soon" (Rev. 22:20).

ALL of the events of the Revelation (including chapter 13) occurred in the time frame clearly indicated in the book itself--pre-A. D. 70!

Preterist
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Old 11-16-2008, 09:02 AM
 
Location: Shumway, Az.
139 posts, read 433,926 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Preterist View Post
Michael777:


ALL of the events of the Revelation (including chapter 13) occurred in the time frame clearly indicated in the book itself--pre-A. D. 70!

Preterist
If this was the case, we should be in heaven right now. The problem with Preterits is;

Matthew 24:15-22 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: 17Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: 18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. 19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: 21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Matthew 24:12-22 Do not fit the 70A.D. destruction of Jerusalem. Preterists interpret this passage of the Bible as non-literally. Details of this passage are significant, are ignored.

But this is my own thoughts.

Bob
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Old 11-16-2008, 12:22 PM
 
14 posts, read 25,494 times
Reputation: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preterist View Post
Michael777:

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ which God gave Him to show His servants--things which must shortly take place. And He sent and signified it by His angel to His servant John, who bore witness to the word of God, and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, to all things that he saw. Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of this prophecy , and keep those things which are written in it; for the time is near (Rev. 1-3).

"Then he [angel] said to me, 'These words are faithful and true.' And the Lord God of he holy prophets sent His angel to show His servants the things which must shortly take place. 'Behold, I am coming soon' . . . . And he [angel] said to me, 'Do not seal the words of the prophecy of this book, for the time is at hand." (Rev. 22:6, 10).

"Behold, I am coming soon, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work" (Rev. 22:12).

"He who testifies to these things says, 'Surely I am coming soon" (Rev. 22:20).

ALL of the events of the Revelation (including chapter 13) occurred in the time frame clearly indicated in the book itself--pre-A. D. 70!

Preterist
In whose perspective is the time short, yours or Gods? One day to the
Lord is one thousand years.
Also, in reference to your quote above; have you received your
reward already? Michael777
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Old 11-16-2008, 03:49 PM
 
1,897 posts, read 3,485,985 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Route_66_traveler View Post
If this was the case, we should be in heaven right now. The problem with Preterits is;

Matthew 24:15-22 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: 17Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: 18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. 19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: 21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Matthew 24:12-22 Do not fit the 70A.D. destruction of Jerusalem. Preterists interpret this passage of the Bible as non-literally. Details of this passage are significant, are ignored.

But this is my own thoughts.

Bob
Hi Bob: What about it doesn't fit? Did not Jesus tell those disciples standing right there Him that they would see the abomination of desolation? Did He not say to them, "See I have told you beforehand?" According to Josephus, the saints in Jerusalem saw the signs of impending doom, remembered Jesus' words as they were passed down to them, and fled! There was not one Christian remaining in the city when it was besieged. The historian Eusebius also related that the early Christians fled Jerusalem and took refuge at Pella (Ecclesiastical History 3.5). Notice as Jesus is speaking to those disciples right there with Him, He tells them to pray that their flight would not be in winter or on the Sabbath.

The problem you see with verses 21 and 22 arises because of a misunderstanding of the nature of the tribulation that made it great and made it unique. It is always argued by those who object to the A. D. 70 fulfillment that more people had died in previous wars and many more died in subsequent wars so A. D. 70 pales in comparison. But where does Jesus indicate that the "greatness" of this tribulation involved the number of people who would die during it?

Anyone who takes the time to read Josephus' account of this horrendous time will have a far different perspective. Josephus was, after all, an eyewitness to these things. The atrocities within the city by the Jews themselves upon one another was as great at that inflicted upon them by the Romans! Deadly riots broke out within the walls from disagreements among Jewish factions, Jews killed one another, mothers ate the flesh of their own children, etc.

First of all, what was the purpose of this great tribulation? If we carefully consider Matthew 23, we can ascertain God's assessment of that generation of Jews from the many woes Jesus pronounces against them. They were found guilty of all the righteous blood shed upon the earth! Their house would be left unto them desolate. We see this in the events of the Jewish Wars with Rome which led up to the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple. God used the Roman armies to destroy that nation and take His vengeance on them for their idolatry, murder, adultery, and stiff-necked disobedience. It is this vengeance by God against a people He once claimed as His own that contributes to the characterizing of this time as the "great tribulation." Many others have died in conflicts (both before and after A. D. 70), but not as a result of God's promised, personal judgment upon them.

The Jews of that day had 20 centuries of preparatory knowledge of their coming Messiah. Yet they rejected Him. They were the only generation guilty of orchestrating events that led to His death. They even pleaded: "His blood be upon us, and on our children" (Mat. 27:25). God obliged their request.

This is Jesus' assessment of that generation of Jews:


“Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for you build the sepulchres of the prophets, and garnish the tombs of the righteous, and say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we should not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. Wherefore you witness to yourselves, that you are sons of them that slew the prophets. Fill up then the measure of your fathers. You serpents, you offspring of vipers, how shall you escape the judgment of hell? Therefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: some of them shall you kill and crucify; and some of them shall you scourge in your synagogues, and persecute from city to city: that upon you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of Abel the righteous unto the blood of Zachariah son of Barachiah, whom you killed between the sanctuary and the altar. Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation" (Mat. 23).

When has any nation been judged for such great crimes against God's saints which spanned hundreds of years of history and what nation has ever committed more grievous crimes against God and His Anointed? These are significant aspects of the great tribulation. In A. D. 70 God finally lowered the hammer of His judgment against that generation of Jews for all their crimes against His saints which began as far back as Abel and culminated with the death of Christ and the subsequent persecutions and slaughter of those post-Pentecost saints!



What about the intense suffering and carnage of this five-month siege of Jerusalem? Again, according to Josephus, it was horrible beyond belief. Many thousands died of starvation. The number and sight of the bloated bodies shocked even the staunch Romans soldiers. Josephus relates that there were so much shed blood that the flow of it extinguished fires (Josephus, Wars 6.8.5). More than 1,300,000 Jews died in Jerusalem from wounds, famine, fire, or crucifixion and perhaps as many as 97,000 more were taken into captivity (Wars 6.9.3-4).



Matthew 24:21-22 does fit the time of the Jewish Wars and the destruction of Jerusalem in A. D. 70. Again, it is not the number of dead that determines the timing of this event. Serious consideration must be given to the nature of it and its intensity and atrocities.

Preterist
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Old 11-16-2008, 04:12 PM
 
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Remember Jesus Christ is the only one who has the power over life and death. Satan does not have that power. Mahdi. Mahmoud Abbas is not the beast the beast is the system we live in today you must also understand the bar code system 666 I will get more indepth later. Think about it stop looking for the person who dies of a head wound and then comes back to life Jesus is the only one who has that power!
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Old 11-16-2008, 04:21 PM
 
1,897 posts, read 3,485,985 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by michael777 View Post
In whose perspective is the time short, yours or Gods? One day to the
Lord is one thousand years.
Also, in reference to your quote above; have you received your
reward already? Michael777
Please, people, can we finally refrain from misusing 2 Peter 3:8 to negate every time statement in the Scriptures! Again, it does not say that one day IS a thousand years! Read it again, please, Michael777. It says "one day is AS a thousand years. All this verse is saying is that God is outside of the confines of time; it has no hold upon Him. But when He communicates with us, He uses words we will understand? He uses words in our perspective. Do you want a God who says to us "soon" when He really means "later"--much later? Do you want a God who says to us "at hand" or "near" when He really means "far off--far, far off?" God says what He means and means what He says--in words we will understand according to the rules of language!

God invented words and language for us to communicate with one another and for Him to communicate with us. When the writers of the NT wrote their inspired words and they used such terms as "at hand" and "near" and "soon" and "shortly," they used them in their normal, common, everyday usage! Do you not use them that way? If God wanted to say far off or later, He would have said that!

And again, why is it that those who want to use 2 Peter 3:8 to silence preterists, quote only one portion of it? What about the part that says "a thousand years is as a day?" What does that mean Michael? Are we now to suppose that every thousand years that pass are really only one day? Perhaps the millennium you long for will be only one day long? Is that not the logical conclusion of your reasoning if you consider the entire verse?

Not everyone, everywhere at the same time received their reward. When Jesus returned and set the captives free from Hades, He pronounced judgment upon the righteous and the unrighteous. Those who waited in Hades in paradise went immediately to be with Him and received their rewards; those who waited in the place of the unrighteous were cast eternally from His presence. Hades was then cast into the lake of fire.

At the time of His return, Jesus brought spiritual resurrection to those who waited in Hades--they received their heavenly bodies fitted for heaven. All since that time, at death, receive their resurrection bodies and their reward. It is an individual thing, not a corporate one. So, no, I have not yet received my reward. I must first die, receive my resurrection body and leave this earthly body behind.

Furthermore, notice that Revelation 20:11ff precedes Revelation 22 in which is found the time frame for this entire book. John was shown those things which were in his day to shortly take place. He was not to seal up the words of the prophecy of the Revelation because the timing for its fulfillment was then near (Rev. 1:1, 3; 22:6, 10).

Notice also what Paul wrote concerning the resurrection and the judgment in Acts 17 and 24:

Acts 17:31 (speaking to the Athenians)--"he has appointed a day in which He is about to judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained."

Acts 24:15 (speaking to Felix, the governor)--"there is about to be a resurrection of the dead, both the just and the unjust."

Acts 24:25 (speaking to Felix, the governor)--"Now as he [Paul] reasoned about righteousness, self-control, and the judgment about to come, Felix was afraid."

The resurrection and the judgment were about to come in Paul's day!

Preterist
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