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Old 11-12-2008, 12:13 AM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
702 posts, read 845,004 times
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Quote:
txguy2009:
Okay - I'll tell you what. If somebody here has faith that the 7 years are upon us, let's sign a contract where you give me all your possession in 7 years. You won't need them after all
Could you go back and read what I posted? I went much more into the following on p.1, post #5: "Like the 4 times occurring phrase "great tribulation" never has the number 7 attached to it; in other words, the phrase "the 7 year(s) great tribulation" never occurs in Holy Writ."

Why not go Biblical? As I also said in the same post: "If you confine your expression of what you believe to the words God Himself chose to make His revelation known you would discover as I have that much of what we were told by others to practice or believe has no place in a strictly Scriptural Christianity."

Last edited by Hoosier; 11-12-2008 at 04:59 PM.. Reason: fixed quotes for you
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Old 11-12-2008, 01:19 AM
 
2,945 posts, read 4,775,158 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesMRohde View Post
If you confine your expression of what you believe to the words God Himself chose to make His revelation known you would discover as I have that much of what we were told by others to practice or believe has no place in a strictly Scriptural Christianity.
so true james

Quote:
]My mind is dazzled by the almost unbelievable fact that people's lips say they believe the Bible then make a word such as "rapture" or a phrase such as "7 year(s) great tribulation," both of which are conclusively non-existent in the Holy Writings of the Oracles of God, to be kind of lynch-pins for something as important as the nature of the transition from "the last days" of this eon into "the new day" of the next.
Quote:
Of course this is done with other matters too, like the phrase "original sin" or "immortal soul," among many. It is absolutely a violation of my conscience as a Christian for whom the Bible is the objective standard for my faith and practice. "To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them." (Is 8:20)

I admit there are times when it is convenient or functionally irrelevant to use other words, like "eschatology" or "teleology" though these are based on Scriptural words. But I must insist, when we are attempting to access conclusively what is revealed in Holy Writ for our faith and practice we must confine ourselves to the words the Holy Spirit, God Himself, has chosen to make His revelation known. If we cannot conform ourselves according to the objective authority of what is or is not written we are deceived and will deceive others. This is not to say we are entirely outside of the grace of God. He is very merciful, and just as mankind in it's immaturity was winked at, so in our own childish ignorance we may have not come under the strict discipline of such adherence to Scripture.
Good stuff james. God has to open our eyes for us to see. I was blessed by your post. Thank you!
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Old 11-12-2008, 04:13 PM
 
1,111 posts, read 1,378,057 times
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Default prophet Daniel

Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesMRohde View Post
(I can't get the quote function to work for me so I'm copy/paste-ing...)

txguy2009:
Okay - I'll tell you what. If somebody here has faith that the 7 years are upon us, let's sign a contract where you give me all your possession in 7 years. You won't need them after all

Could you go back and read what I posted? I went much more into the following on p.1, post #5: "Like the 4 times occurring phrase "great tribulation" never has the number 7 attached to it; in other words, the phrase "the 7 year(s) great tribulation" never occurs in Holy Writ."

Why not go Biblical? As I also said in the same post: "If you confine your expression of what you believe to the words God Himself chose to make His revelation known you would discover as I have that much of what we were told by others to practice or believe has no place in a strictly Scriptural Christianity."

Hello and greetings fellow believers

When I put up this post, in one of my studies I wanted to know about prophecy.
When I came to Jesus Christ as my savior that day I had hunger for him so I started to search of his coming. I got several books on regulation and prophecy, I looked up of all the scholars and theologians that studies in this study, I have read many books about this and in my searching I found a scholar that is an expert in the number seven and what it means in the Scriptures I completed my study on this subject. But I'm always looking to others to put some of this puzzle together, I have found my answer but always searching. Studying scriptures is an infinite puzzle it never stops, but you try to get the closest answer as possible. My friend search in the Bible you will find the prophet Daniel chapter 9 versus 20 through 27. In versus 26 you will find when I your answers. If you have a good translator it would explain the number seven. This is one of the signs that I had put in the first of my post. And when you do please tell us your Shareanswer. Also about The rebuilding of Jerusalem Temple.

Last edited by TheWordIsOne; 11-12-2008 at 04:19 PM.. Reason: Adjusting Selling
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Old 11-12-2008, 05:01 PM
 
17,750 posts, read 15,047,446 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Betsey Lane View Post
And all "this" is taking place right now:
3. knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lust,
4. and saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation."
5. For this they willfully forgot: that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water,
6. by which the world that then existed perished, being flooded with water.
7. but the heavens and the earth which now exist are kept in store by the same word, RESERVED for fire until the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8. But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9. THE LORD IS NOT SLACK CONCERNING HIS PROMISE, AS SOME COUNT SLACKNESS, BUT IS LONGSUFFERING TOWARD US, NOT WILLING THAT ANY SHOULD PERISH BUT THAT ALL SHOULD COME TO REPENTANCE.
(2 Peter 3:3-9)
Question? If ALL things has been fullfilled already, and we are now reigning with the King, here on earth, where is my mother who passed on 3 weeks ago? In her resurrected body? What, she's been reincarnated as what? One of the birds that sing outside my window in the morning? Or no, maybe as a lizard that my son like to catch? Do tell me please so I can go say, "Hi mom, you are back!" Sound absurd right? Well...............................

Hello Betsey Lane,

Why do you apply this here? Those scriptures apply to those who think he is not ever going to come. No Preterist is saying, by definition, where is the promise of his coming when they considered it fulfilled. They are saying "there it is" not "where is it"?

This would more apply to nonbelievers who scoff at Christianity because its misrepresentation implies false prophesies mostly due to false date setting by over eager futurists and what they read in the scriptures.

Jesus Was A False Prophet
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Old 11-14-2008, 03:41 PM
 
1,111 posts, read 1,378,057 times
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Post The Forth signs, The number Seven

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWordIsOne View Post
This is the Seven Years Tribulation
Seven Years of captivity
Seventy *weeks are determined
For your people and for your holy city.
To make an end of sins,
To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy.

There are seven signs before Christ return.

One, Israel Restored as a nation. * Pass

Two, The reunification of Europe.* Pass

The Great Commission is Now!
Three, The coming of the Anti -Christ. Next.

Forth, The rebuilding of the temple of Israel.

Five , The rise of one world religion.

Six, The invasion of Israel temple.

Seven, The battle of Armageddon. Megiddo.
Prophecy what I see
Isaiah 13:1 The burden of Babylon, which Isaiah the son of Amoz did see.


Leviticus 26: 1 - 43; We read in verse 18 - 24; And after all this, if you do not obey Me, then I will punish you seven time more for your sins. I will break the pride of your power; I will make your heavens like iron and your earth like bronze. And your strength shall be spent in vain; for your land shall not yield its produce, nor shall the trees of the land yield their fruit. Then, if you walk contrary to Me, and are not willing to obey Me, I will bring on you seven times more plagues, according to your sins. I will also send wild beasts among you, which shall rob you of your children, destroy your livestock, and make few in number; And if these things you are not reformed by Me, but walk contrary to Me, then I also will contrary to you , and I will punish you yet seven times for your sins.

Daniel 9: 25- 27Know therefore and understand, That from the going forth of the command To restore and build Jerusalem Until Messiah the Prince, There shall be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; The *street shall be again, and the *wall, Even in troublesome times. And after the sixty-two weeks Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself; And the people of the prince who is to come Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end of it shall be a flood, And till the end of the war desolations are determined. Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week; (Seven Years) But in the middle of the week ( 3 ½ years) He, shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abomination shall be one who makes desolate, Even until the consummation, which is determined, Is poured out on the desolate.”
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Old 11-15-2008, 11:26 AM
 
1,897 posts, read 3,037,129 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWordIsOne View Post
Prophecy what I see
Isaiah 13:1 The burden of Babylon, which Isaiah the son of Amoz did see.


Leviticus 26: 1 - 43; We read in verse 18 - 24; And after all this, if you do not obey Me, then I will punish you seven time more for your sins. I will break the pride of your power; I will make your heavens like iron and your earth like bronze. And your strength shall be spent in vain; for your land shall not yield its produce, nor shall the trees of the land yield their fruit. Then, if you walk contrary to Me, and are not willing to obey Me, I will bring on you seven times more plagues, according to your sins. I will also send wild beasts among you, which shall rob you of your children, destroy your livestock, and make few in number; And if these things you are not reformed by Me, but walk contrary to Me, then I also will contrary to you , and I will punish you yet seven times for your sins.

Daniel 9: 25- 27Know therefore and understand, That from the going forth of the command To restore and build Jerusalem Until Messiah the Prince, There shall be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; The *street shall be again, and the *wall, Even in troublesome times. And after the sixty-two weeks Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself; And the people of the prince who is to come Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end of it shall be a flood, And till the end of the war desolations are determined. Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week; (Seven Years) But in the middle of the week ( 3 ½ years) He, shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abomination shall be one who makes desolate, Even until the consummation, which is determined, Is poured out on the desolate.”
Of what restoration and rebuilding was Daniel speaking? Of what later destruction was Daniel speaking? Of what abomination of desolation did Daniel speak? Did not Jesus say to His disciples right there with Him that they would see the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet? (Mat. 24:15). He was not speaking directly to us but to them. We are not the ye of Matthew 24!

Who confirmed a covenant? Was it not Jesus who confirmed the covenant with His blood in His generation? Was HE not cut off in the middle of the week in which HE confirmed the covenant? Do we attribute to Satan (and some "Antichrist") those works which rightfully belong to God when we claim that some yet future leader possessed by the Devil himself will make a covenant with the Jews and then break it?

With whom was the covenant to be made? See Jeremiah 31:31--it was with the Church and not with national Israel. Jesus came to make of two people (Israel and the Gentiles) one nation--they became true Jews circumcised in their hearts. God would right His laws on the hearts of His saints; they would be His people and He would be their God!

The New Covenant is what was spoken of by Daniel the prophet. It's establishment is, therefore, far behind us. There is no justification for teaching that some evil leader of our day will make a covenant with those who now call themselves Jews but are not! There will be NO rebuilt temple. The temple spoken of in Revelation 11 is none other than Herod's temple which was destroyed by Titus and his armies.

Daniel prophesied of the events of Christ's day and also of the events leading up to and including the destruction of the Temple and Jerusalem in A. D. 70! That's the context.

Preterist
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Old 11-15-2008, 11:45 AM
 
1,111 posts, read 1,378,057 times
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Default Prophecy is what I see

Quote:
Originally Posted by Preterist View Post
Of what restoration and rebuilding was Daniel speaking? Of what later destruction was Daniel speaking? Of what abomination of desolation did Daniel speak? Did not Jesus say to His disciples right there with Him that they would see the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel the prophet? (Mat. 24:15). He was not speaking directly to us but to them. We are not the ye of Matthew 24!

Who confirmed a covenant? Was it not Jesus who confirmed the covenant with His blood in His generation? Was HE not cut off in the middle of the week in which HE confirmed the covenant? Do we attribute to Satan (and some "Antichrist") those works which rightfully belong to God when we claim that some yet future leader possessed by the Devil himself will make a covenant with the Jews and then break it?

With whom was the covenant to be made? See Jeremiah 31:31--it was with the Church and not with national Israel. Jesus came to make of two people (Israel and the Gentiles) one nation--they became true Jews circumcised in their hearts. God would right His laws on the hearts of His saints; they would be His people and He would be their God!

The New Covenant is what was spoken of by Daniel the prophet. It's establishment is, therefore, far behind us. There is no justification for teaching that some evil leader of our day will make a covenant with those who now call themselves Jews but are not! There will be NO rebuilt temple. The temple spoken of in Revelation 11 is none other than Herod's temple which was destroyed by Titus and his armies.

Daniel prophesied of the events of Christ's day and also of the events leading up to and including the destruction of the Temple and Jerusalem in A. D. 70! That's the context.

Preterist
Leviticus 24: 8 - 17And you shall count seven Sabbaths of years for yourself, seven times seven years; and the time of seven Sabbaths of years shall be to you forty-nine years. Then you shall cause the trumpet of the Jubilee to sound on the tenth day of the seventh month; on the Day of Atonement you shall make the trumpet to sound throughout all your land. And you shall consecrate the fiftieth year, and proclaim liberty throughout all the land to all its inhabitants. It shall be a Jubilee for you; and each of you shall return to his possession, and each of you shall return to his family. That fiftieth year shall be a Jubilee you; in its own accord, nor gather the grapes of your untended vine. For it is the Jubilee; it shall be holy to you; you shall eat its produce from the field. In this Year of Jubilee, each of you shall return to his possession. And if you sell anything to your neighbor or buy from your neighbor’s hand, you shall not oppress one another. According to the number of years after the Jubilee you shall buy from your neighbor, and according to the number of years of crops he shall sell to you. According to the multitude of years you shall increase its price, and according to the fewer number of years you shall diminish its price; for he sells to you according to the number of the years of the crops. Therefore you shall not oppress one another, but you shall fear your God; for I am the LORD your God.
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Old 11-15-2008, 12:06 PM
 
1,897 posts, read 3,037,129 times
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Originally Posted by TheWordIsOne View Post
Leviticus 24: 8 - 17And you shall count seven Sabbaths of years for yourself, seven times seven years; and the time of seven Sabbaths of years shall be to you forty-nine years. Then you shall cause the trumpet of the Jubilee to sound on the tenth day of the seventh month; on the Day of Atonement you shall make the trumpet to sound throughout all your land. And you shall consecrate the fiftieth year, and proclaim liberty throughout all the land to all its inhabitants. It shall be a Jubilee for you; and each of you shall return to his possession, and each of you shall return to his family. That fiftieth year shall be a Jubilee you; in its own accord, nor gather the grapes of your untended vine. For it is the Jubilee; it shall be holy to you; you shall eat its produce from the field. In this Year of Jubilee, each of you shall return to his possession. And if you sell anything to your neighbor or buy from your neighbor’s hand, you shall not oppress one another. According to the number of years after the Jubilee you shall buy from your neighbor, and according to the number of years of crops he shall sell to you. According to the multitude of years you shall increase its price, and according to the fewer number of years you shall diminish its price; for he sells to you according to the number of the years of the crops. Therefore you shall not oppress one another, but you shall fear your God; for I am the LORD your God.
What is the context of Leviticus 24:8-17 and how does it answer my specific questions to you?

Preterist
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Old 11-15-2008, 01:10 PM
 
1,111 posts, read 1,378,057 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Preterist View Post
What is the context of Leviticus 24:8-17 and how does it answer my specific questions to you?

Preterist
Dear friend, you are asking the question for the moment I cannot answer your question my interpretation will lead to more questions and few answers. Every member has to gift right now I only have to gift to see. When you give me a scripture or a verse, I can look up in the Bible and give you your answer in the Scriptures, hoping that you will find your answer to your own question?
Hopefully in time that the Lord of the Holy Spirit gives me the gift of interpretation.
I was once told that is easy to memorize words, but its how you understand the meaning of words is justice imports memorizing words.
I don't want to add more confusion to already confused world.
The spirit of God is not a confusion but love. I can probably give you a way that you might find your own answer to your own questions what is in your heart. Given time he will seek knowledge for wisdom and understanding. For now my friend is only what I see it is a gift.
The Bible is an ancient book and with this ancient another book that is a mystery, a mystery that will manifest a new law which is the New Testament within the New Testament there is a mystery to be solved, with the old it will manifest the new.
In other words looking through the entire Bible word for word were one book says one thing to be a book says the same thing but in another way. By looking in certain verses you are able to find a hidden key, once you found a key it will open other page. This way when you give me some Scriptures I can look into the Bible and give you something it will correspond with your Scriptures this way we keep adding one page after another and as you put your answers together and others you will find your own answers and the meaning of the mysteries of the Bible.
I don't know if you can understand *** this ***********. Your faith will guide you through to seek what we've *** seen for? My object is the will of God motto my own at his. It is like my mind has been very empty for long time and now the Lord had touched my mind, it is like the Cosmo forever changing, forever growing. Soon hopefully I can give you your answer, but like I said it's only when I see. Maybe if you look hard enough you will see to?
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Old 11-16-2008, 08:00 AM
 
1,897 posts, read 3,037,129 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWordIsOne View Post
Dear friend, you are asking the question for the moment I cannot answer your question my interpretation will lead to more questions and few answers. Every member has to gift right now I only have to gift to see. When you give me a scripture or a verse, I can look up in the Bible and give you your answer in the Scriptures, hoping that you will find your answer to your own question?
Hopefully in time that the Lord of the Holy Spirit gives me the gift of interpretation.
I was once told that is easy to memorize words, but its how you understand the meaning of words is justice imports memorizing words.
I don't want to add more confusion to already confused world.
The spirit of God is not a confusion but love. I can probably give you a way that you might find your own answer to your own questions what is in your heart. Given time he will seek knowledge for wisdom and understanding. For now my friend is only what I see it is a gift.
The Bible is an ancient book and with this ancient another book that is a mystery, a mystery that will manifest a new law which is the New Testament within the New Testament there is a mystery to be solved, with the old it will manifest the new.
In other words looking through the entire Bible word for word were one book says one thing to be a book says the same thing but in another way. By looking in certain verses you are able to find a hidden key, once you found a key it will open other page. This way when you give me some Scriptures I can look into the Bible and give you something it will correspond with your Scriptures this way we keep adding one page after another and as you put your answers together and others you will find your own answers and the meaning of the mysteries of the Bible.
I don't know if you can understand *** this ***********. Your faith will guide you through to seek what we've *** seen for? My object is the will of God motto my own at his. It is like my mind has been very empty for long time and now the Lord had touched my mind, it is like the Cosmo forever changing, forever growing. Soon hopefully I can give you your answer, but like I said it's only when I see. Maybe if you look hard enough you will see to?
See what? What are you talking about?

Preterist
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