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Old 11-10-2008, 03:11 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, North Carolina
5,137 posts, read 15,118,870 times
Reputation: 1008

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that quote has nothing to do with who goes to heaven.

There's another thread that states even Christians are not going to heaven (according to the bible)

Quote:
Originally Posted by liliblu View Post
"While the president often refers to God during public addresses to his supporters, Bush's religious convictions don't always seem to reflect those of the conservative Christians who make up his political base.


In an exclusive interview with ABC News' Charles Gibson, Bush said he believes that both Christians and Muslims worship the same God.



"I think we do. We have different routes of getting to the Almighty," Bush said. "But I want you to understand, I want your listeners to understand, I don't get to get decide who goes to heaven. The Almighty God decides who goes to heaven and I am on my personal walk," he said. "
ABC News: Bush on Religion and God

 
Old 11-10-2008, 03:16 PM
 
116 posts, read 278,477 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denverian View Post
How has his "fruit" been un-Christian? And you know, not all Christians are fundamentalists and share those beliefs. I find it amusing when the far right/fundamentailst Christians claim that other Christian denominations aren't Christian. It just underscores the ridiculous nature of religious fundamentalism.
To add to what renriq said, he also heavily supports partial-birth abortion (among other things), which Christians find abhorrent (frankly, I don't know how anyone can support such an awful thing). And I'm not claiming that other Christian denominations aren't Christian...just the ones that aren't. I can't accept a "denomination" that supports things that the Bible specifically doesn't. For myself, I don't claim a denomination. I don't belong to a specific church, I don't keep my hair long, or wear dresses (ever!), or keep silent in public. I have short, spiky hair that is frequently dyed various colors that strike my fancy; I have a nose piercing and a labret (used to have a tongue piercing, but took it out since it wasn't closing properly...I know! I'm such a heathen!); I have several tattoos, and plan on more; all these things are extentions of my personality. But one thing I refuse to do is contradict God just because it suits the world and their "delicate feelings". If that makes me a ridiculous far-right fundamentalist, well then, I guess I'm a ridiculous far-right fundamentalist. Thank the Lord!
 
Old 11-10-2008, 03:22 PM
 
692 posts, read 1,541,293 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renriq02 View Post
that quote has nothing to do with who goes to heaven.

There's another thread that states even Christians are not going to heaven (according to the bible)
I'll have to find the video but in that interview, he does make that statement. I'll have to find the site again.
 
Old 11-10-2008, 03:25 PM
 
395 posts, read 886,965 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daisiesnfreckles View Post
To add to what renriq said, he also heavily supports partial-birth abortion (among other things), which Christians find abhorrent (frankly, I don't know how anyone can support such an awful thing). And I'm not claiming that other Christian denominations aren't Christian...just the ones that aren't. I can't accept a "denomination" that supports things that the Bible specifically doesn't. For myself, I don't claim a denomination. I don't belong to a specific church, I don't keep my hair long, or wear dresses (ever!), or keep silent in public. I have short, spiky hair that is frequently dyed various colors that strike my fancy; I have a nose piercing and a labret (used to have a tongue piercing, but took it out since it wasn't closing properly...I know! I'm such a heathen!); I have several tattoos, and plan on more; all these things are extentions of my personality. But one thing I refuse to do is contradict God just because it suits the world and their "delicate feelings". If that makes me a ridiculous far-right fundamentalist, well then, I guess I'm a ridiculous far-right fundamentalist. Thank the Lord!
You're right...there exist christians who find partial birth abortion abhorrent. But there are also christians who don't. And some christians oppose the death penalty. And some don't.

See a pattern here? Christianity is an empty black box, you put your own values into it.
 
Old 11-10-2008, 03:30 PM
 
116 posts, read 278,477 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txguy2009 View Post
You're right...there exist christians who find partial birth abortion abhorrent. But there are also christians who don't. And some christians oppose the death penalty. And some don't.

See a pattern here? Christianity is an empty black box, you put your own values into it.
...to their own detriment. I'm not trying to be a "fundamentalist" by saying this, although it surely will come across that way.
 
Old 11-10-2008, 03:31 PM
 
692 posts, read 1,541,293 times
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Here is the video. I suggest listening to whole clip. But skip to 1:15 to hear discussing who goes to heaven.


YouTube - Bush Disagrees With Christ
 
Old 11-10-2008, 03:33 PM
 
692 posts, read 1,541,293 times
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By the way I'm not questioning Bush's Christianity.
 
Old 11-10-2008, 03:36 PM
 
Location: Sheffield, England
2,639 posts, read 5,938,732 times
Reputation: 3249
Anyone else think the thread title sounds like a movie tagline? Just a thought.
 
Old 11-10-2008, 03:36 PM
 
395 posts, read 886,965 times
Reputation: 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by daisiesnfreckles View Post
...to their own detriment. I'm not trying to be a "fundamentalist" by saying this, although it surely will come across that way.
But what is your basis for this? You say yourself you don't wear your hair long or refrain from wearing dresses. You therefore implicitly disagree with those sects who claim this the "true" religion.

How, then, are you so sure that what you think is true? Why is abortion the issue that delineates "true" christians from non-true ones? It seems there's not even really good biblical support for being "pro-life" while some of the weirder beliefs have more explicit support.

My point isn't to say there is a true christianity or not. As I said earlier, I don't believe in it. I'm a skeptic. My point is that religion as such does *no independent logical work* here - people are making independent value judgments; cherry-picking what they want to believe, and even taking some things (like anti-abortion stance) that aren't even in the text and incorporating it in the religion. The moment you start making independent value judgments it seems the whole claim of religion is obviated - that what is "right" is necessarily tied to the will of the Deity - what is "right" is actually what YOU say it is.

So we should cut through the confusion and talk about the beliefs as such and forget "religion."
 
Old 11-10-2008, 03:39 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, North Carolina
5,137 posts, read 15,118,870 times
Reputation: 1008
To GO BACK ON the topic....Could Palin be the antichrist....

I don't believe so as the bible teaches in who the antichrist will be, and she doesnt fit the description.

One person said that she's too ignorant, but I'm not sure how they would know. I would think the antichrist will be 'cunning' in making people think this....
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