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The Bible states quite clearly that the soul survives the death of the body. Mattew 10:28"Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell (Gehenna). The reference to Gehenna is future - after the Millennium and does not mean destruction in the sense of non-existence, but in the sense of ruin and uselessness. The reference is obviously to the unbeliever. And this was Jesus speaking by the way.
In the meantime, the soul which survives the death of the body has to reside somewhere. In the case of the believer, that place is heaven. In passages such as Rev. 6:9-11; 7:9-14, 20:4, the scene is in heaven and the souls of Tribulational martyrs are seen. Now, that is still future, but the Church Age believer also goes to heaven at the point of physical death. Peter, knowing that he was about to die, mentioned laying aside and departing from his earthly dwelling - his body (2 Peter 1:13-14). Paul said that to be absent from the body is to be at home with the Lord.(2 Cor. 5:8) Absent from the body means that he was not referring to the resurrection in that verse, though earlier he had been.
In Old Testament times the believer went to Abraham's Bosom, also called Paradise which at that time was located in a now vacated part of Hades (Luke 16:19-31; Luke 23:43). Whether Luke 16:19-31 is a parable or not is irrelevant. It deals with an experience after death.
In 1 Sam. 28:12-20 the dead prophet Samuel was brought up from Abraham's Bosom by God in the incident with the witch of Endor. Samuel rebuked Saul for disturbing him by bringing him up. Again, it was actually God who interrupted the seance and caused Samuel to be brought up in a vision. Now, some people disagree with that and say that it was a demon which impersonated Samuel. That had been the intention of the medium who worked with the demons in order to fool people. It was a nice little scam she had going. But on this occasion God took control of the situation, and for the only recorded time in human history caused the spirit of someone who was still physically dead to come up from Sheol.
Rachael's soul departed (and went to Sheol) because she had died (Gen. 35:18). Her soul did not cease to exist, her soul departed, just as Peter's soul departed from his body when he died.
Both the soul and the spirit are immaterial parts of man which survive physical death.
The Bible teaches that the believer goes to heaven at death. Mainstream Christianity recognizes this. It is generally the cults which deny that fact.
He's probably referring to Jesus's words to the thief on the Cross where he said "Today you will be with me in Paradise." Possible evidence, though probably not enough to label anything a cult for disagreeing with it and God's idea of "today" might be different from ours. I have heard that the Hebrew's believed we enter a type of "soul sleep" until the resurrection.
What about Lazarus and the rich man? Lazarus was carried straight to heaven by Angels. But then there's the "dead in Christ". I don't have a denomination per se, but I lean more towards Southern Baptist. According to what is believed by some Baptists, not all mind you, but some believe that when the dead in Christ is referenced, it means the physical, earthly dead bodies of those who have died will be resurrected to be "reunited" with their heavenly body.
That has to do with the Rapture process. So when it says "the dead in Christ shall rise first" it means that the earthly body will rise up to meet the heavenly body in the air, and that those who are left (Christians) who are still alive will be taken up in the air, and will never actually experience an earthly death. I believe this also.
How will we be able to recognize each other in heaven, like the Bible suggests, if we do not put back on the face and bodies that we had on earth? They will be perfected, of course, but we will have to have our earthly bodies to be recognized. I mean, when you think about it, it makes complete sense.
So to answer your question, I think we all go to our eternal destinations as soon as we die. I think there is a type of "slumber" that we may or may not experience, depending on what God has planned for us. There is mention in the Bible of "being awakened from slumber" (can't remember who or where in the Bible right at the moment) referring to someone who had already died, but was awakened for a particular reason. I'm just talking about those who die and have gone to heaven. Those who go to hell.....well....I think they go straight there immediately, and stay there. There may be a "not so hot" hell waiting room until judgment, but they will definitely be waiting in hell/hades.
Lazarus and the rich man is not about what you think it is...
Lazarus and the rich man is not about what you think it is...
What is it then, we are going over that in bible study next week so see what it really means and im curious on what others thinks this parable means as well.
He's probably referring to Jesus's words to the thief on the Cross where he said "Today you will be with me in Paradise." Possible evidence, though probably not enough to label anything a cult for disagreeing with it and God's idea of "today" might be different from ours. I have heard that the Hebrew's believed we enter a type of "soul sleep" until the resurrection.
Yes, until resurrected to heaven [ Rev 20 v 6; 5 vs 9,10] or on earth during Jesus millennial reign over earth the dead sleep in death.
-Psalms 6 v 5; 13 v 3; 115 v 17; 146 v 4; Ecclesiastes 9 v 5; Daniel 12 vs 2,13; John 11 vs 11-14
The day [today] that Jesus died Jesus went to the Bible's hell - Acts 2 vs 27,31.
So, Jesus was saying to the thief on that day [ the day they died ] that Jesus was promising the thief a future resurrection when 'earth' would become a 'paradise' during Jesus 1000-year reign over earth.- Acts 24 v 15
Only baptized followers go to heaven. The thief was not baptized, so like King David he is still awaiting a resurrection back to life on earth.- Acts 2 v 34.
There was no comma before the word today as if the verse would read truly I tell you, but rather truly I tell you today, so, the KJV placement of the comma looks as if Jesus went to heaven the day he died.
What is it then, we are going over that in bible study next week so see what it really means and im curious on what others thinks this parable means as well.
Please keep in mind that the story of the rich man [ the money-loving Pharisees -Luke 16 vs 14,19 ] is a story, a parable, or an illustration, and Not an actual happening. -Matt. 13 v 34
Lazarus and the rich man is not about what you think it is...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4
Please keep in mind that the story of the rich man [ the money-loving Pharisees -Luke 16 vs 14,19 ] is a story, a parable, or an illustration, and Not an actual happening. -Matt. 13 v 34
Actually, almost all parables teach true doctrines on many levels. You can't possibly say with any degree of certainty that this parable is "not an actual happening." Yes, it probably teaches a deeper truth, but there are those of us who believe it is also a true story which teaches of the conditions in the spirit world prior to Jesus' death.
So, Jesus was saying to the thief on that day [ the day they died ] that Jesus was promising the thief a future resurrection when 'earth' would become a 'paradise' during Jesus 1000-year reign over earth.- Acts 24 v 15
The thief was not baptized, so like King David he is still awaiting a resurrection back to life on earth.- Acts 2 v 34.
That's a lot of conjecture you've got there. We have what the Bible actually says and what we, the readers, think it meant to say. I don't have a problem with people interpreting the Bible differently than I do, just so long as they don't imply that their interpretation is spelled out in no uncertain terms in the Bible, when in fact that simply isn't the case.
Please keep in mind that the story of the rich man [ the money-loving Pharisees -Luke 16 vs 14,19 ] is a story, a parable, or an illustration, and Not an actual happening. -Matt. 13 v 34
Actually the story about another rich man was not a parable, but an encounter of a rich young man who approached our Savior with a question about eternal life:
Mat 19:[16] And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
[17] And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
[18] He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
[19] Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
[20] The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
[21] Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
[22] But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.
I believe strongly that our Savior died for the sins of all the world, that our heavenly Father knows every person on the face of the earth who is hungering and thirsting after righteousness, and that, if we truly repent, He knows how to make arrangements for us to receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. I believe that our Savior intends for the 2nd part of His Great Commission to be practiced by true believers, Teaching them to observe ALL thing that I have commanded them" and that we will be faithful until death if we are to enter into eternal life.
Actually the story about another rich man was not a parable, but an encounter of a rich young man who approached our Savior with a question about eternal life:
Mat 19:[16] And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
[17] And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
[18] He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
[19] Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
[20] The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
[21] Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
[22] But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.
I believe strongly that our Savior died for the sins of all the world, that our heavenly Father knows every person on the face of the earth who is hungering and thirsting after righteousness, and that, if we truly repent, He knows how to make arrangements for us to receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. I believe that our Savior intends for the 2nd part of His Great Commission to be practiced by true believers, Teaching them to observe ALL thing that I have commanded them" and that we will be faithful until death if we are to enter into eternal life.
It is HaShem that grants repentance, it is not something that we exercise...
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